LIGHTWAVE CONTEST and "THAT" STIGMA

Julez4001

Julez4001

Member
:newtek: This is not a slam on Dominic's ROBOTOCHAN.

As someone who didn't enter in the contest and have no beef with the 1st place winner however this is going back to another discussion that Lightwave tends have this in-grain "kiddie" artwork attached to it. Even Cinema 4D marketting is moving from it and starting to wear the whole MOTION GRAPHIC Leader label.

ROBOTOCHAN was good in the criteria of "kiddie" artwork (and I don't mean in its development but its look). Its right up there with Proton's TOFU. Both great pieces but they have to know that outside of the industry and for "newbies" looking atthe marketting of Lightwave, this kinda of artwork is becoming more and more the poster child for Lightwave. It screams hobbyist more than professional tool for your latest visual fx movie. YES Lightwave had work in Iron Man but if you look at XSI, Max, Maya, Zbrush and more important Modo (former Lightwave), they do not push this type of artwork because they are trying to appeal to the big studios and those 16-28 year old demographic - all the time.

Was Iron Man plastered on Newtek's front page during Sig, no but ROBOTCHAN was.

I sincerely hope that in the next contest, Newtek alter the rules and allow:


Commerical 3rd party plug-ins
MDD imports ( I wouod have jumped in on that one alone)
Compositing applications
and more importantly since Displacement type characters are still all the rage in generic app talk:
Zbrush & Mudbox entries.

And when next Sig is up, you plaster that all over the site, its just good plain old fashion marketing against your competitors who do not put up "kiddie fare" 24-7. They may have a shot or two but they promote how their tools were used in the latest film or videogame. -- 24/7

COOL wins all the time.... I can't help it that it does but its always leads.
 
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Julez4001

Julez4001

Member
My co-worker saw the showreel and thought that because of all the LW logo stuff in ROBOTCHAN - it was a joke ! Because he said "Is that the best Lightwave Can do ?" and I had to sit there and defend Dominic's work and he relented but I was miffed with NewTek that they had this big contest and was promoting to usersd rather than to folks who may be interested in Lightwave. Because I lie to you not, they are talking about ROBOTCHAN but it ain't glowing.....

Real Talk.
 
shrox

shrox

Man of many cells.
I too would like to see a move away from the toy and toony creations I see Lightwave being slanted towards.

I do stuff for NASA, was art director at Sega where I used Lightwave exclusively for creation on the worlds' first MMPO that could handle a million players, and used LW in development of The Sims at Maxis, but NewTek ain't interested.

I am probably one of LW's first major users in game development. But NT never seemed to care.

And fine work there Dominic.
 
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Tippsy

Tippsy

New member
I agree although I think it is better even with the next contest to have one of the rules being it must be all created in Lightwave because a few months ago when I was looking into Lightwave I was seeing all this cool stuff but then after reading would find out that the modeling was done in Z brush and the background was done with photoshop etc. And it kind of ticked me off because from that I had no idea whether Lightwave was actually any good or not. I would love to see full Lightwave animations in the contests but like Julez said for the demographic of 16 and up although sure for other little demo reels show some fun and funny stuff like Robotchan but don't use something like that for your main ad I would not have bought Lightwave if I saw the contest and that was what the best in full Lightwave could come up with. Although I am not slamming on anybody either.
 
virtualcomposer

virtualcomposer

Airwolf 3D man
I agree, LW needs to be posted as a professional app, not a hobby. It will begin to affect how companies that hire people like us decide if our app is professional or not. I seriously would have promoted Iron Man and BSG. These are successful movies that really speak about LW professional abilities. I've talked to quite a few film companies who's goal is to produce ultra realism and I believe LW can do this and have seen it.
 
Surrealist.

Surrealist.

Active member
I think you are giving far too much paranoid credit to this "world of professionals" out there. Like everyone who is a professional 3D artist can't enjoy some fun and can't put a contest into perspective for what it is. And can't take the winner into perspective with all of the other work as well. And lastly would be so simple minded as to think that the winning contest entry is what NT is putting forth as what they see the future of animation. It was a contest. There were many great entries. Some won some did not. The reason they won is because they were judged to win. That is not the end all be all of animation in LW. Clearly not. That is obvious. And that is far from the point. It is an extremely limited view to project these attributes to all 3D professionals based on a few people or even one person's critical opinion. By and large people "in the industry" are far less critical and far more able to think for themselves based on all of the facts put before them than many people give them credit for.
 
shrox

shrox

Man of many cells.
Honestly, if the contest had said that the winning entries would be shown as a feature at Sig on giant video screens, I would have entered. It just says announced at Sig, which could have just been a mention in a microphone. I'll get ready for next year I guess...
 
Julez4001

Julez4001

Member
Its not the "be all end all BUT it is "just another" nail in that Newtek marketing strategy coffin when compared to other leading 3d app.

I am not oppose to simple fun BUT once again the "kiddie toy" genre in 3D leads in the eye of lightwave audience. Its a very reoccuring theme with Newtek and if you take even Modo, they do not have a "feel" for being a hobbyist tool. Can you make fun stuff with Modo? Sure. Is that its motif. hell no.
 
rakker16mm

rakker16mm

Post-apocalyptic
I really don't want to upset anyone but I really have to say that as far as I am concerned there is only one thing to say about the contest and that is to congratulate the winner.

Congratulations Dominic :thumbsup:
 
shrox

shrox

Man of many cells.
How about a new thread, maybe with a poll about a direction that NewTek might want to pursue as far as what subjects are featured by Lightwave. Tried and true, or new and cool? Tried and true being things you normally associate with CG, and new and cool being thing you do not nessecerily think of CG for, (but no crap like in the Jokes that aren't funny thread...) or think only of CG for, like King Kong in the recent movie with Jack Black.
 
RebelHill

RebelHill

Goes bump in the night
I just wanna say that Im not entirely sure where this whole, top 10 photo real FX work, is the best, or only, or whatever work that should be shown off... like photoreal VFX is somehow the be all and end all.

IMHO... cartoony, or simple works are just as valid (hell not so long ago, folks were crying "why doesnt NT show off something that looks as good as big buck bunny").

Irrespective of whether its cartoon, VFX, photorealism, arch-viz, medical viz, etc.... what NT and LW needs to demonstrate is work that comes in the top level of its respective genre...

The aim should not be to show "what LW can do"... it should be to show something that leaves viewers clueless as to what app it was created with... is it maya is it max... who knows... but it looks GREAT... oh wahts that... done in LW u say... alright... i'll take a few seats.
 
D

Dexter2999

Member
Well, this years entrants aside, I'd love to see the film quality graphics being submitted. In Newtek's defense, it is hard to keep people motivated on projects for long periods of time.

Even if OMFG graphics were shown, LightWave detractors would just come back with, "Yeah?, but how long did it take you?"

I think the initial post hit a strong point with, if Newtek could market the competition as offer to showcase artist work prominently at Siggraph, I think there would have been an unprecedented turn out for the competition.

I say, you have a year guys, get to it! Start working now on that showcase piece for next year. I think it is important to remember that even if your piece doesn't win, you will still wind up with a really good portfolio piece.
 
colkai

colkai

How Old? Really? Aww Heck
Considering cartoony accounts for a huge TV market - I don't see a problem with it at all.

I think there is an ingrained perception that things have to be feature film quality and photo-real to be "cool / good". What I think is, that given time, if Newtek could put together a reel of work done by one-man bands / hobbyists and studios, it would show the "get it done" side of the software.
Give the folk enough time to really fine-tune things and then show that no matter where you are, from start to finish, LW can produce the results.

As to the winner, personally speaking, yes, not my favourite of the challenge, but at least he had a go.
Given the timescale involved, I am not sure I could of even got that done so I'm not really in a position to be playing down his work.

We can all sit back and say what should of been done, but unless we are out there giving the choice of material, well, it's kinda like shouting at the TV when your favourite sport is on. ;)
 
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