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Thread: unusual SX-8 behavior

  1. #1

    unusual SX-8 behavior

    i've had problems with VT recognizing my SX8 intermittently but at times it does work. here's what i've found...

    i actually have to fully shut down my machine (NOT a restart) TWICE or sometimes THREE TIMES before the SX8 will properly send video AND audio to the toaster

    it seems critical that i allow the machine's capacitors to FULLY DISCHARGE before restarting XP. And then i have to wait until XP is completely finished booting (drives are not being accessed) before launching VT[2] or i won't get video (or sometimes audio)

    i am using Y/C inputs on the SX8
    also using audio inputs 3,4,5
    i'm running XP Pro

    if i follow this procedure VT[2] works flawlessly
    until i shut down again in which case i may have to follow the same shut down/start up procedure again.

    i'm willing to do this, but ideally i'd like it to work every time...

    anyone else noticing this??
    mark

  2. #2
    VT5 USER Rich Deustachio's Avatar
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    I have the same problem once in a while. It seems to be related to NewTeks winrtme file. If you shut winrtme before rebooting the computer it will recognize the SX8. Seems to me this started at aroud the time build 2881 came out and has been there ever since. I don't think if you use windows XP the VT2/3 needs to run this program I could be wrong.

  3. #3
    If you simply close the toaster, use the task manager to kill winrtme (cntl alt delete) under the process tab, then restart the toaster it will probably see your SX8 just fine

  4. #4
    UniSon Gordon's Avatar
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    Yes, this happens with some motherboards. It's a timing thing between the VT + SX-8 and PCI, I think. NT optimized VT timing and shaved a frame off the latency which is very important for live production. The downside is that some motherboards, VT and SX-8 have a problem starting up sometimes. (Very intermitent, I might add).

    However, I have found that killing WinRTME and restarting the Toaster never works for my customers. If it was not recognized at bootup during the hardware intialization then there is no chance of the software triggering it to restart.

    You are correct in that it seems to have a better change of succeeding if all power has been removed, either unplug or turn the switch off on the power supply, not just the front of the computer. Warm reboots do seem to work almost as often however.

    There is a short cut that for sure tells you if VT will work once Windows is loaded. The occurs right at boot up during the POST, (power on self test), phase. Here is what to do:
    1. Have a monitor connected to a VCR that will output a blue screen when a valid signal is not present.
    2. Connect one of the outputs on the SX-8 to the input of that VCR and have the VCR and monitor turned on.
    3. Turn all power off on the computer. This should generate a blue screen on the VCR monitor.
    4. During the POST watch this monitor. If the the blue screen is NOT replaced with a 'static' image then don't bother going through the Windows load. Press 'F8' to get the the Windows advanced options screen and reset, (warm boot or cold boot), the machine.

    Generally about two or three warm boots and the VT card will init properly, (you will see the blue replaced with static and then black), and from that point on the software will work.

  5. #5
    Registered User ted's Avatar
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    I've been having this from the beginning. I'm using a SuperMicro Board.
    I don't get anything like this on the two systems that don't have a BOB, both also have SuperMicro Boards.
    I'm hoping NewTek can resolve this someday.
    Ted R. Ruiz Sr.
    Ad-Venture Video Productions
    Elite NewTek Dealer
    www.editbay.tv
    TriCasters, Most All Models
    Cameras-Mostly HVX 200's

  6. #6
    UniSon Gordon's Avatar
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    Ted:
    If I remember correctly, the recognition of the SX-8 on boot up was more of an issue after the timing was tightened. I think this was a year ago. However, as we do live production and will show the image magnified on a big screen, and with the projector adding another 2 frames, we were willing to put up with the problem in order to lose some of the delay on the Toaster end. NT said that the release shaved off a frame but it seems more like two frames to me.

    However, not everyone is doing live production with ImageMag. Therefore, I wonder how many would prefer the old way?

    I sympathize with the developers because this really is a puzzle. It can work without problem for several boots in a row and then one day, for no apparent reason, it seems like it will never come up. (However, now that I discovered the secret mentioned in the above post - it is quite tolerable.)

    I just remembered another thing. We beefed up the power supply in the system, which also helped, (but NOT solved), the reliability a bit.

    I wonder how diverse this list is of motherboards that this happens on? Supermicro, ASUS, MSI - any others that people are having a problem with?

    Is anybody using the SX-8 and NOT having this trouble? Is so, what motherboard, memory size and type, and what power supply are you using?

    Gord

    Timing is everything!

  7. #7
    Registered User ted's Avatar
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    Even though I don't use VT for live production, I'd vote for fewer delayed frames first. I'm sure it is more important then a reboot every few mornings.

    Still hoping NT can resolve it though.
    Ted R. Ruiz Sr.
    Ad-Venture Video Productions
    Elite NewTek Dealer
    www.editbay.tv
    TriCasters, Most All Models
    Cameras-Mostly HVX 200's

  8. #8
    Here's my method.

    I start the computer up in the morning with the speakers on. When I hear a "snap" in the speakers (not a dangerous spike, but a indication that signal is going to the speakers from the SX-8) I know I am all set (or if I am laying on the floor, which I do often after a late edit session, I can see the red led on channel 1.

    If these indications don't happen, I run wintime again until they do. Usually this happens to me one out of every 5 times I boot up. I am running a SuperMicro MoBo with 1gig ram and Dual 1.8 Xenons.

    Knowing the workaround makes it just annoying..(like the quirks of the Toaster CG).

  9. #9
    gordon -
    you are quite right
    killing winrtme does not fix the problem at all
    either the blue screen on my tv monitor (an output from the sx8), or the speaker snap mentioned by ray seem to give an earlier warning. the speaker snap seems a bit extreme, however (what causes this snap - seems like quite a dc jolt to my sound system)
    so, i prefer the bluescreen warning...

    will VT[3] fix this?
    thanks, guys
    mark

  10. #10
    UniSon Gordon's Avatar
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    For the last 10 or so starts using 3890, I have not had a single problem! I also moved the VT card into a different slot and this seems to help a bit. So here is what I have tried so far and it seems to be quite a bit better.

    1. New larger more reliable power supply. I would recommend the Antec True Power 550 EPS12V.

    2. Changing the VT card to a different PCI slot - I moved it a couple down.

    3. Running version 3890 software.

    Don't know about VT[3] adding more reliability, furthermore it will be hard to tell because it has been pretty reliable for a couple weeks now.

  11. #11
    I used to have this kind of problem back on VT1, the toaster card wouldn't even post, I found that the toaster liked to have a specific irq assigned. I was using 3 or 11 (I think) OS was NT and if I had trouble starting then I would manually change the irq setting for that slot the toaster was in. I don't think you can do this in Win2k and I haven't had a problem in my Dell 530 machine. The problem used to occur on ABIT board I believe.

  12. #12

    bob

    I have an intermittant problem with the booting of the system from cold start.

    No BOB!

    I have a shortcut for "kill EinTime.exe" and a shortcut for "RTME.exe on the desktop

    first kill "wintime" then run "RTME" you will probably have to run it twice as the first time it will just flash.

    It should detect the bob and load the software.
    To quit RTME you must type "quit" and hit enter

    This works on my system and all the others that we have set up.
    Pete
    Pete Draves
    CV Productions
    Oak Creek, WI
    [email protected]

  13. #13
    Basically, Pete that is what we do. Seems to work for us too. Just an annoyance.....one I will gladly put up with to do things in real time.
    If it's taking you longer than an hour to watch 60 minutes...you need help

  14. #14

    Unhappy hi all

    same problem here

    Im tried all the steps, but doesnt work.

    Any another help is welcome.

  15. #15
    UniSon Gordon's Avatar
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    If you are saying that even after a few cold boots, (including unplugging the power cord from the computer for 30 seconds), you still don't get the SX-8 to initialize then you may have a hardware problem with a.) the SX-8 daughter card or b.) possibly even the SX-8 itself.

    (You have checked that there is power to the daughter card - using the four pin floppy power connector - right?)

    .

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