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Thread: Pro Render SDK Released and RoadMap

  1. #1

    Pro Render SDK Released and RoadMap

    These guys are way ahead and giving away the tech. Why not just integrate it into Lightwave.

    https://www.amd.com/en/technologies/...mail&utm_term=



    Announcing Updated AMD Radeon ProRender Plug-ins for the Blender 2.80 Beta, AI-Accelerated Denoising, and More.
    Fast. Easy. Incredible.
    At NAB 2019 several significant updates to AMD’s physically-based rendering engine, AMD Radeon™ ProRender, were revealed, including new plug-ins for leading creative applications, and the new AMD Radeon ProRender Developer Suite.
    Radeon ProRender’s combination of cross-platform compatibility, powerful rendering capabilities, and efficiency helps reduce the time required to deliver true-to-life images.
    Updated plug-ins for Autodesk®; 3ds Max® and Maya®, along with the open beta of the new plug-in for the Blender™ 2.80 beta, can be downloaded today.
    AMD Radeon ProRender Modo render Mike Griggs
    The updates to Radeon ProRender include:
    ● New Radeon ProRender v2.0 beta plug-in completely rewritten for the Blender 2.80 beta
    ● AI-Accelerated Denoising 1 and Adaptive Sampling for the Blender 2.80 beta, Autodesk Maya 2, and Autodesk 3ds Max plug-ins
    ● Hair Rendering Support for the Blender 2.80 beta and Maya 2 plug-ins
    ● Maya Fluid Volumes 2, Maya 2019 Support 2, and 3ds Max 2020 Support
    ● Foundry Modo 13 Radeon ProRender integration
    ● New Radeon ProRender Developer Suite that includes non-commercial use SDKs for developers and support for the upcoming Full Spectrum Rendering technology
    In addition to the updates above, the development roadmap for Radeon ProRender has been updated, listing the features scheduled to be added in the next quarter and beyond.
    The updated Radeon ProRender plug-ins for 3ds Max and Maya 2, and the Blender 2.80 beta are available now. For more details about all the updates click on the link below.

  2. #2
    Registered User gdkeast's Avatar
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    Hopefully they will if their plate is not already too full. I'm cautiously optimistic about LW 2020 but I guess mum is the word for now.

  3. #3
    AMD has a huge team working on pro render now. They are catching up and making updates really quick on both Linux, Mac and Windows and all GPUs. It's free, so NT only needs to implement it with 1 developer. Yes, I know resources are scarces, but this is a good spot to put resources in my book. I guess it will depend if there's actual demand for it. If you are interested, please voice your opinion, or you will not get it.

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  5. #5
    Super Member CaptainMarlowe's Avatar
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    Guys, I have filed a feature request a few months ago for pro render support in LW (LWF - 2324). I think the more users wile file requests through the report system, the more chances we have to get it taken into consideration. So if you really want it, I would encourage you to file a FR rather than asking it here on the forums.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainMarlowe View Post
    Guys, I have filed a feature request a few months ago for pro render support in LW (LWF - 2324). I think the more users wile file requests through the report system, the more chances we have to get it taken into consideration. So if you really want it, I would encourage you to file a FR rather than asking it here on the forums.
    Done.
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  7. #7
    Registered User gdkeast's Avatar
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    Good idea. Done.

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    In the past I would have agreed with you about Prorender, and it seems a good idea, but I've worked (or tried to work) with Blender and Modo's Prorender. And in each case, the experience wasn't very good.

    Modo's one is in beta stage, still lacks of some features that makes the engine good only if you are doing simple scenes. For example, because of load times.

    Blender's one is a crash fest, impossible to work with it, and I try it on every release.

    Both of them have a very bad denoise filter, and it's only usable when using gpu render, which I cannot use because in my scenes I easlily fill my gpu's memory.

    I agree that could be a great thing, but I don't want a mid-baked plugin that is unstable. If you publish it, it must be rock solid. So, I prefer devs to spend their time solving the hub issues, updating the modeling system and givig us lightweight displacements, for example.

    Hey, just my opinion, not discouraging anyone.
    Last edited by Asticles; 04-27-2019 at 08:50 AM.
    English is not my native language so please be patient.

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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Asticles View Post
    So, I prefer devs to spend their time solving the hub issues, updating the modeling system and givig us lightweight displacements, for example.
    Yeah but I think it comes down to the area of expertise with each developer. If for instance if Antti is a shading/rendering guy why have him work on modeling if that isn't his thing. One thing is for certain - if LW is to grow and become more relevant in the 3D world they need to add more devs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Parsons View Post
    Yeah but I think it comes down to the area of expertise with each developer. If for instance if Antti is a shading/rendering guy why have him work on modeling if that isn't his thing. One thing is for certain - if LW is to grow and become more relevant in the 3D world they need to add more devs.
    That would imply a greater monetary investment, which I do not think will happen until the new group decides what to do with the program.

    What I wanted to say is, that they have already spent great efforts in giving us a new rendering engine. Why invest now in external motor? To get it in January?

    Would not it be more appropriate for an outside company or developer to do it?
    English is not my native language so please be patient.

    Salvador Ureña
    http://urenasalvador.wixsite.com/portfolio

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Asticles View Post

    What I wanted to say is, that they have already spent great efforts in giving us a new rendering engine. Why invest now in external motor? To get it in January?

    Would not it be more appropriate for an outside company or developer to do it?
    Pro render has a bunch of developers working on it. It might be buggy now, but it most likely will surpass lightwave render development very soon just by the resources they are putting into it. Newtek would only need to develop a plugin bridge to it. I wouldn’t mind if a third party developer do it, but NT would do a better job and can do it faster with intimate knowledge of lightwave.

    It’s a gpu option that can add value to lightwave and can be a easy gpu Render win. I guess nothing is really easy.

  12. #12
    It would be no trival task to implement ProRender into LW, I mean, they'd have to have someone who understands rendering and have them dedicated to it. So either by either bringing another developer on, or taking someone off their current role and putting them on implementing ProRender inside of LW. Mark Granger would have been a good candidate for that job, especially given that he was interested in rendering on the GPU (but he has since gone on to work for Otoy). Antti is working on the LW renderer so not sure if that leaves someone else who would be able to do it.

  13. #13
    I'm just going by numbers. If NT only has 1 programmer dealing with rendering and AMD has 5 programmers dealing with Pro Render, it would take NT 10 years to get to the same place as Pro Render in 2 years.

    If it takes 1 year to integrate Pro Render into LW, they are still saving themselves many years of development. Not saying NT should abandon their own render engine in favor of Pro Render, but there's some serious consideration here.

    I really don't know what is the answer, since I'm sure there's a lot more to consider, but Pro Render should be discussed and considered. Maybe Antti can provide a much deeper integration of Pro Render that would specifically work with all aspect of LW.

    Why not just let AMD do the bulk of the work for them and let the last 15% be dealt by NT. Instead of all 100% of the burden placed on 1 render programmer at NT.
    Last edited by thomascheng; 04-28-2019 at 02:11 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by thomascheng View Post
    I'm just going by numbers. If NT only has 1 programmer dealing with rendering and AMD has 5 programmers dealing with Pro Render, it would take NT 10 years to get to the same place as Pro Render in 2 years.

    If it takes 1 year to integrate Pro Render into LW, they are still saving themselves many years of development. Not saying NT should abandon their own render engine in favor of Pro Render, but there's some serious consideration here.

    I really don't know what is the answer, since I'm sure there's a lot more to consider, but Pro Render should be discussed and considered. Maybe Antti can provide a much deeper integration of Pro Render that would specifically work with all aspect of LW.

    Why not just let AMD do the bulk of the work for them and let the last 15% be dealt by NT. Instead of all 100% of the burden placed on 1 render programmer at NT.
    The more programmers you have in the team, the more time is wasted on meetings, discussions, not real programming. Single knowledgeable programmer can be faster than 10 programmers working in a team. Team working requires writing documentation and writing comments, for other people to understand what each line of code is doing. If code is not commented, after firing, resigning etc. of programmer from a team, work done by him/her will be partially useless. Nobody will know what code is doing. So enterprises demand heavy commenting of the code (which takes valuable time of programmer) and writing proper documentation. Single programmer does not have to do it.

    There are projects which can be easily split to couple people. And there are projects hard to split.
    In modular application, such as LightWave, one person is responsible for writing one module/plugin/tool/extension.
    If two or more people are working on the single module/plugin/tool/extension, they interfere and have to exchange information between them self (wasting time).
    Last edited by Sensei; 04-28-2019 at 04:14 PM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Sensei View Post
    The more programmers you have in the team, the more time is wasted on meetings, discussions, not real programming. Single knowledgeable programmer can be faster than 10 programmers working in a team. Team working requires writing documentation and writing comments, for other people to understand what each line of code is doing. If code is not commented, after firing, resigning etc. of programmer from a team, work done by him/her will be partially useless. Nobody will know what code is doing. So enterprises demand heavy commenting of the code (which takes valuable time of programmer) and writing proper documentation. Single programmer does not have to do it.

    There are projects which can be easily split to couple people. And there are projects hard to split.
    In modular application, such as LightWave, one person is responsible for writing one module/plugin/tool/extension.
    If two or more people are working on the single module/plugin/tool/extension, they interfere and have to exchange information between them self (wasting time).
    Yeah, I use to be a programmer for a bank. We always made it a habit to properly comment our code and build module parts for other team members, that is just being part of a programmer and a necessary part of the work. I wouldn't consider commenting or documenting wasted time. Otherwise, you end up with useless code if the member leaves, especially if you only have one person dealing with it all. Anyway, there's definitely diminishing returns, but even if 5 programmers only double the speed, Pro Render would still be advancing at twice the pace. AMD mentioned that the code will eventually be open sourced (not sure if that changed honestly), so it should be well commented/documented when released to the public.
    Last edited by thomascheng; 04-28-2019 at 08:14 PM.

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