Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: File transfer while using NDI

  1. #1
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Argentina
    Posts
    4

    File transfer while using NDI

    Hello everyone. I'm Pablo I'm a new user in this comunity.

    I' ve ben searching in this forum and in the vMix forum as well, but I can't find the answer or anny suggestions.

    I work in a TV studio (recording shows in live situations) and i'm currently using Vmix as a playout system (I know! vMix is not a playout, but it works for me), via NDI to a Tricaster 460.

    Set Up:

    Intel® Desktop Board DX58SO
    Intel I7 3.05 Ghz
    8gb RAM
    Nvidia Quadro K2000
    1 SSD for the system and apps
    1 RAID 0 for the Data
    1Gb ethernet port
    1Gb LAN (14-15 pc aprox)
    Don't know the switch or the router specifications, sorry.

    It's working very well. I can send several sources to vMix (premiere, vlc, videos, ppt, etc.) and send the vMix Output to a NET input in the Tricaster without having to change the source in the Tricaster every time. Besides, I can send the sources directly to Trciaster, play two or more videos simultaneously at 1080 50i with an excelent quality.

    The problem appears when sending a video over NDI, another user of the LAN starts transferring files from one PC to another. Video starts to fail (frames and audio drops, in a terrible way) In other words: every works fine until the bandwith is share.

    The question is: Is it normal? Is there any way to control the bandwith to give priority to the NDI when it Is necesary?

    By the way, sorry for my pour english

    Greetings from Argentina!

    Pablo

  2. #2
    Is the file transfer to the TriCaster or vMix machine or just between two other systems on the network?

    If it is just when you transfer files between any two systems, it sounds like your switch's internal capacity is being maxed out. What is your network switch?
    Kane Peterson
    Key Accounts Sales Engineer
    NewTek, Inc.

  3. #3
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Argentina
    Posts
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by kanep View Post
    Is the file transfer to the TriCaster or vMix machine or just between two other systems on the network?

    If it is just when you transfer files between any two systems, it sounds like your switch's internal capacity is being maxed out. What is your network switch?
    Hello, thanks for you Replay.

    I didn't test if they problem appears when transfer files between any two systems. At the time it happened when moving files into/outp the vMix or the Tricaster terminals.
    On wesnesday I will be able to test it.

    Greetings.

  4. #4
    Windows file copy is set to operate as quickly as possible. When you try to copy files onto any system it will be an impact on the resources of that system, in many ways.

    First is bandwidth, file copy will try to use all bandwidth available, which can start to conflict with NDI traffic. File copy can cause 'spikes' of traffic where it floods the interface with as much traffic as it can handle, but NDI needs a continuous flow of data.

    Also, file copy causes lots of interrupts on the computer's system bus. Interrupts are low level, happening in the kernal of the OS. When interrupts occur the computer has to deal with action and it is out of the control of a user application (like TriCaster or vMix).

    Finally, file copy does use some CPU cycles, plus performance of the target hard drive in question. This can also be an issue if you are trying to use this same disk for playback or recording. It might have the performance normally, but then you also try to push data as fast as possible to the disk, then there is no longer enough performance for everything it is trying to do.

    When you are using a computer to write a Word document, email or visit a webpage, the above issues don't really cause a problem. But when you are working with an real-time application like TriCaster (or vMix), things need to happen when they need to happen. There is no waiting, if that frame arrives late, it is not needed anymore, but at the same time you didn't have it to display either.

    NewTek has always recommend that file transfers should not happen while the system is being used for real-time production. If you absolutely need this workflow, then you need to look into a shared storage solution. That way the file transfer is occurring on a separate system, optimized for this kind of workload and using up the resources there. NewTek sells a solution for this called 'NewTek Remote Storage'. This allows you to have a location on the network where you can record files, playback media and NLE users can be working all at the same time.
    Kane Peterson
    Key Accounts Sales Engineer
    NewTek, Inc.

  5. #5
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Argentina
    Posts
    4
    Kanep, thank you very much

    Quote Originally Posted by kanep View Post
    NewTek has always recommend that file transfers should not happen while the system is being used for real-time production.
    You mean file transfer in the same system where Tricaster is running? or file transfer over diferents systems in the LAN is algo negative?

  6. #6
    Specifically transferring files to/from the TriCaster while it is producing an event.

    If copying files across your network is also causing issue even if the TriCaser isn't involved, then you have a under-powered network switch, upgrade it to some better.
    Kane Peterson
    Key Accounts Sales Engineer
    NewTek, Inc.

  7. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Oslo
    Posts
    4
    Hi Pablo, it's a very well known problem in networking. The solution is generally called "Quality of Service" (QoS) and refers to placing priority on a network stream over another. You will find a lot of people talking about it when it comes to e.g. getting Netflix to stream well at home whilst someone else is downloading something

    There are several options:

    - Upgrading to 10Gb speed - but this needs the network cards on both ends and the router to upgrade, so costly.

    - Getting a router/switch that supports QoS, or finding out if your current router supports it. This should probably be the first choice. Note that the router/switch is where this setting is made - NOT in any of the PCs.

    - "Teaming", which is using a network card with two 1Gb ports on both ends, where "teaming" refers to the network ports working in a pair, doubling the capacity - this needs 2 ports in and out of the router, and it has to be supported by the network card on both ends (also, it would only reduce the chance of it happening - this isn't really a full solution..).

    - Setting up a different network architecture where the video sending and receiving are separate from the others, with another router - this is complicated and you have to ask on various forums.

    - Ban transfering big files over the network - use memory sticks or external hard drives
    Last edited by Bobbert; 03-06-2019 at 02:25 AM.

  8. #8
    There is also an option of using a 3rd party copy tool that has bandwidth limiting feature (speed limit). It will slow down the process, so it will not interfere.
    Kane Peterson
    Key Accounts Sales Engineer
    NewTek, Inc.

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Argentina
    Posts
    4
    Thank you very much for all of your replays!

  10. #10
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    15
    There is also an option of using a 3rd party copy tool that has bandwidth limiting feature (speed limit). It will slow down the process, so it will not interfere.
    For Windows set IPG in Robocopy

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •