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Thread: Make Human- Development stagnation?

  1. #1
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Make Human- Development stagnation?

    It seems like quite a while since any update of the free make human software , while I found it interesting and nice, it sort of falls a bit flat compared to daz studio, but it had nice geometries based on real humans and age settings and race settings that I really donīt think is implemented in the standard daz studio.

    Manuel Bastioni seem to have done a lot of work with make human, but it seems he is doing his own thing with his blender figure plugin nowadays, maybe that explains some lack of updates?

  2. #2

    it seems he is doing his own thing with his blender figure plugin nowadays, maybe that explains some lack of updates?
    not impossible he moved the attention over there.
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  3. #3

    p.s. off topic, fractal generator >
    https://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?157484

    Last edited by erikals; 07-02-2018 at 01:37 PM.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    ...compared to daz studio, but it had nice geometries based on real humans and age settings and race settings that I really donīt think is implemented in the standard daz studio.
    Not out of the box but there are tons of very good age and vasc morphs (as well as countless other head and body modifiers) available for DS.

  5. #5
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post

    not impossible he moved the attention over there.
    the manuelbastioni lab for figure in blender is nice indeed, especially the skin shading, and that it can be run within blender, but it is also...Much much slower to setup, the menuīs are not good, and is having a hard time making sense in blenders own cluttered interface, and I would actually prefer the standalone tool make human, you have mor organized acess to changing of gender, age, muscle mass and other tweaks, and it also responds much quicker than bastioni lab within blender.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Not out of the box but there are tons of very good age and vasc morphs (as well as countless other head and body modifiers) available for DS.
    Yeah..I figure there is some stuff, I just donīt have the time to lurk around right now to find it for daz..that is why pre-build morphs within a software makes life a bit easier, rather than lurking around that marketplace to download each morph seperately and install..I am lazy currently due to vacation might have a look at it later though.

  6. #6

    a quite nice app, for now i'll just take the MH>LW route, instead of the Blender one

    for the reasons you say  
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  7. #7
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post
    a quite nice app, for now i'll just take the MH>LW route, instead of the Blender one

    for the reasons you say  
    Yup..
    and a tip, if you do not know..
    when exporting obj figures from make human, I would suggest check the meter unit in the scale unit option, that should give you the correct scale when importing to lightwave, the cm unit ends up completely wrong.
    And surfacing needs to be adjusted, like for the body you need turning the 100% transperancy down to 0, and also uncheck that texture, for eyes it may be enough by turning down the transparency there as well.

  8. #8

    thanks! noted!  
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    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    Yeah..I figure there is some stuff, I just donīt have the time to lurk around right now to find it for daz..that is why pre-build morphs within a software makes life a bit easier, rather than lurking around that marketplace to download each morph seperately and install..I am lazy currently due to vacation might have a look at it later though.
    Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant commercial morphs, for example from Zev0, they're great and go far beyond what's possible with MakeHuman. Installation in DAZ via DIM is automatic for all products.

  10. #10
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant commercial morphs, for example from Zev0, they're great and go far beyond what's possible with MakeHuman. Installation in DAZ via DIM is automatic for all products.
    Figured so as well, and therein lies the problem, I am not in such desperate need of such morphs that I would pay for them.
    Unless I simple would want them for some reason..but not likely, .and could actually make my owns if needed..question is how good and accurate they would be if we aim for various race morphs etc, as I am aware of..the parameters in make human seem to be researched properly on a proper Ethnicity basis.
    Age morphs are easier.

    Edit ..yes, Zev0 seem to have done nice morphs, not bad at all.

  11. #11
    Registered User Rayek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post
    a quite nice app, for now i'll just take the MH>LW route, instead of the Blender one

    for the reasons you say  
    Do realize that the figures in ManuelBastioniLab are VASTLY improved in both mesh and quality of the anatomy - there is really no comparison. Makehuman meshes are beginning to look like Sims in comparison. Not to mention the displacement maps, the deformation quality, the Skin editor, the option to control the export of various skin textures (including displacement ones), the expression editor, and the muscle system, as well as the addition of stylized figures.

    Manuel is currently working on a realistic muscular male (more than 70% done), and works like a man obsessed with creating the most anatomically correct humans. Just check out his current work on a realistic eye shader, and the work he did on the feet.

    Manuel never mentioned why he left the MH project, but reading between the lines of his comments on the Blender forums I think he no longer wished to support virtual humans below the legal age (18 year and older only). He made it quite explicit in a number of his answers that his LAB will never support under-age characters. I have a feeling he saw his work abused by certain unsavory parties on the web, and decided to withdraw and go solo, because his main interest is in providing a scientific study of the human body. That's what drives him.

    The meshes are so good, that I use quick renders to practice drawing anatomy and Bargue drawings of selected parts.

    Also, the workflow is quite different in both. ManuelBastioniLab works in two stages: first set up the character properties, then generate and save out a fully rigged version which is easy to pose using the standard Blender pose tools, and/or by selecting presets.

    Makehuman is very much lacking in comparison nowadays. I see no reason to use MH myself anymore at this point - Manuel was one of the (if not THE primary) driving factors behind Makehuman, and since he left MH's development virtualy stopped in its tracks. He redid all the base meshes a number of times now, and with various revisions, ever improving the mesh quality and anatomy features.

    So, even if you don't like Blender that much, MH just isn't worth using anymore in my opinion - unless you are satisfied with sub-par quality. My two cents.

    PS turn off subdivision preview in the display options to speed things up.
    Last edited by Rayek; 07-04-2018 at 03:00 AM.
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  12. #12

    hm, ok, will take a second look at ManuelBastioniLab  

    http://www.manuelbastioni.com/manuellab.php
    Last edited by erikals; 07-04-2018 at 06:02 AM.
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  13. #13
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rayek View Post
    Do realize that the figures in ManuelBastioniLab are VASTLY improved in both mesh and quality of the anatomy - there is really no comparison. Makehuman meshes are beginning to look like Sims in comparison. Not to mention the displacement maps, the deformation quality, the Skin editor, the option to control the export of various skin textures (including displacement ones), the expression editor, and the muscle system, as well as the addition of stylized figures.



    Manuel never mentioned why he left the MH project, but reading between the lines of his comments on the Blender forums I think he no longer wished to support virtual humans below the legal age (18 year and older only).

    So, even if you don't like Blender that much, MH just isn't worth using anymore in my opinion - unless you are satisfied with sub-par quality. My two cents.

    .
    Well..I donīt agree with you, I think make human may have a place for me for some stuff, you can always modify with sculpting, do morphs.. and change textures or shaders yourself, and as you say...even if you donīt like blender...that isnīt it for me, it is that bastionilab is too slow and to messy in itīs own interface within blender.

    As for age...I can understand his reason for it..but itīs also a part of why I rather would go with daz, I do not like others to censur what I maybe have need for, making a family..portraiting it in archviz, or do a growing effect morph etc.

    Same with his nudity censorship..I can understand his fear for misuse, but it also make his product less useful in certain aspects, thus for me and some others of less interest...and I think make human may die out eventually, actually think that may be the case with his bastionilab as well...just guessing.

    When you say vastly improved in mesh quality, do you mean a much better topology, or simply higher denser mesh? or both?
    I love the skin shading though in bastionilab, the speed of generating the figure I do not like, neither do I like the settings..but hey, it leaves room for improvements.

    about subpar quality, depends on what you need it for...bastionilabs meshes would probably be considered subpar to Tenīs real scanned humans, there is always levels of what you need.

  14. #14
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Confirming some stuff rayek mentioned about topology mesh quality.


    right is bastiony proxy male human, left is a guy at my age 52, and itīs most likely not the age problem here..but lesser topology quality, the left guy is around 14.000 polyīs and bastioni to the right around 17 000 polys.
    will have to check some other topologys that can be choosen in make human and see how they look like as well.

    Even though bastionis topology is better, I wouldnīt discard make human use anyway.

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  15. #15

    the MH version isn't quite as good, however, you should use the Geometries/Topology/Male generic preset

    the B version, quite nice topology, certainly better.
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