Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 20

Thread: Horrible audio skipping and dropout.

  1. #1
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24

    Horrible audio skipping and dropout.

    The short story-about 30 minutes into a 90 min live meeting, the audio started losing sync and dropping out. It steadily got worst over time until the audio would disappear for a period of time and return.

    The equipment-Tricaster Mini SDI, Newtek NC1 I/O, JVC PTZ cameras, Shure wireless audio into Shure Dante SCM820, Ubiquity Switches,

    The signal path-The Mini is receiving video and audio via the network. NDI from NC1 I/O and Dante from Shure SCM820.

    The SDI from the JVC cameras are routed into the NC1 I/O and selected on the Tricaster.

    For audio, 8 Shure wireless transmitter and receivers, wired to the Shure SCM 820 and Danted(?)
    This is a dedicated network, no other traffic but mine. The Shure SCM is on a Ubiquity switch along with a Newtek Spark and the Tricaster rack. In this rack, there’s a Netgear switch, (I plan to replace with a Ubiquity) with the mini and JVC PTZ controller.

    I’m not sure where the bottleneck is, the Dante out of the Shure, the Dante routing software on the Mini or the network bandwidth. I can’t see the bandwidth being the problem as the switches are 1G and all cabling to well within spec.

    Does anyone have experience with this new paradigm of signal routing?

    Thanks in advance for your help.
    PS, I have contacted Newtek support and Shure Support.

  2. #2
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NewTek
    Posts
    1,556
    As a test I would add a video clip to the NC1 I/O and let it loop for a while to see if you encounter the issue with Dante out of the loop.
    Zane Condren
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    NewTek Inc.
    new.tk/call

  3. #3
    NewTek System Integrator PIZAZZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Texas, or wherever the plane drops me off this week
    Posts
    4,194
    Quote Originally Posted by brook286 View Post
    Does anyone have experience with this new paradigm of signal routing?
    I can definitely say we have some experience with Dante, Ubiquiti, and TriCasters. Mostly all good experiences.

    Questions that might help:
    1. Are you running Dante in it's own VLAN ? I suspect not since you mentioned a Netgear switch was to be replaced soon.
    2. Which models of Switches are you running ? Ubiquiti Unifi or Edge?
    3. Are you going Dante from the Shure audio mixer to the TriCaster? If so have you tried going analog to determine if the problem is in the Dante reception of the TriCaster or possibly somewhere else?
    4. Are you going Dante from the Shure wireless into the SCM820 or analog?
    5. Are you running the NDI video in it's own VLAN?


    There are lots and LOTS of variables to wade through. I will be glad to help once you reply with some of the details to the questions above.
    Jef Kethley
    PIZAZZ
    www.pizazz.com

    Using:
    All models of TriCasters + 3Play, IPSeries
    Panasonic UB300 4k cams
    Tactical Fiber/converters, SDI2NDI converters, NDI-Viewfinder, and NDI2HDMI

  4. #4
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    Jef, thanks for the good insight. This site has four meeting rooms on my network. I'm using Edge switches in the data closets to connect the rooms together. In this meeting room, I'm using Unifi switches. From Ubiquity specs, VLAN is available in the Unifi switches. I haven't been able to log into the Unifi switches yet.

    It seems from your questions, I want to configure the NDI and Dante on different VLANs?
    I'll be going there shortly, but my first question-I believe vlan setup is switch port based? So I need to have the Tricaster able to "see" both vlans (NDI and Dante)
    To answer your other questions.
    -Using the Shure Dante to the unifi switch that the Tricaster is on.
    -Analog from the Shure wireless receivers to the SCM 820.
    -As mentioned no VLANs, yet.

    My first test yesterday was to make the system screw up. So I played a sync audio/video clip in a laptop with 7 wireless mics around it and 2 cameras pointed at the laptop. The sync was locked for over 30 minutes. Then I put the tricaster into record and 32 minutes in the sync unlocked. Stopped the recorded and restarted the Tricaster, software only. Started recording again and the sync stayed locked for over 50 mins until I had to leave. And, this is important, all of the Dante feeds were in sync. I have each Shure Dante channel mapped to individual inputs on the Tricaster so I can adjust levels. I plan to call Newtek support as soon as I get in.

    Zane, given the above info, I'm not sure the problem is with the Dante or NC1. Thanks for the suggestion.

    More to come.

  5. #5
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    137
    I have a TC Mini Advanced running Dante Virtual Soundcard, and a Shure MXA910 array that outputs Dante. The Dante audio routinely goes out of sync, even though the MXA910 is the master clock and there's no other Dante transmitters/receivers on the network. Check your Latency settings within Dante Controller to make sure they all match, I've had the most success around 4ms.
    TriCaster TC1 #1
    TriCaster TC1 #2
    NC1 Studio I/O Module
    TriCaster Mini SDI Advanced #1
    TriCaster Mini SDI Advanced #2
    Video Nerd

  6. #6
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    An update--
    Another show last night lost sync about 10 minutes in. Even thought a few days of testing using the new UBNT switches did not have a problem. Reminder, there's 4 NDI sources (3 cameras via NC1 and a spark) and 8 channels of Dante from a Shure SCM820DAN mixer. All 8 mics around a laptop playing a sync video/audio file and 2 cameras pointed at it. All day yesterday no problem. But when the meeting started and we were switching cameras, inserting graphics and adjusting audio levels.
    Crash, ok not a crash. The sync was lost. I had an analog audio from the Shure 820 ready to go. Muted the Dantes and unmuted the analog input. After changing the video delay from 150ms to 0. The sync was perfect for over 2 hours.
    I'm starting to believe the Tricaster Mini can not handle all of the processing. Trying to do too much with a little box.
    Any thoughts??????????Please!!!!!!!!!

  7. #7
    NewTek System Integrator PIZAZZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Texas, or wherever the plane drops me off this week
    Posts
    4,194
    Quote Originally Posted by brook286 View Post
    An update--
    Another show last night lost sync about 10 minutes in. Even thought a few days of testing using the new UBNT switches did not have a problem. Reminder, there's 4 NDI sources (3 cameras via NC1 and a spark) and 8 channels of Dante from a Shure SCM820DAN mixer. All 8 mics around a laptop playing a sync video/audio file and 2 cameras pointed at it. All day yesterday no problem. But when the meeting started and we were switching cameras, inserting graphics and adjusting audio levels.
    Crash, ok not a crash. The sync was lost. I had an analog audio from the Shure 820 ready to go. Muted the Dantes and unmuted the analog input. After changing the video delay from 150ms to 0. The sync was perfect for over 2 hours.
    I'm starting to believe the Tricaster Mini can not handle all of the processing. Trying to do too much with a little box.
    Any thoughts??????????Please!!!!!!!!!
    Are you using VLans? I have seen NDI and Dante fight on the same vlan. After we started separating the traffic, many of our issues went away.

    Lastly can you try going analog out of the audio mixer and bypass the Dante Virtual Soundcard on the TriCaster mini? Or is it a distance thing that you need to go across Dante?
    Jef Kethley
    PIZAZZ
    www.pizazz.com

    Using:
    All models of TriCasters + 3Play, IPSeries
    Panasonic UB300 4k cams
    Tactical Fiber/converters, SDI2NDI converters, NDI-Viewfinder, and NDI2HDMI

  8. #8
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    The analog backup saved my butt. Small clinch as I muted the dante and assigned the analog. I will setup VLans before the next show this Tuesday.
    Jef, I do appreciate you share your experience. I'll let you know about the Vlans next week.

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Bali
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by brook286 View Post
    From Ubiquity specs, VLAN is available in the Unifi switches. I haven't been able to log into the Unifi switches yet.
    I wouldn't call myself an expert on Unifi but I've handled them quote often.

    You need to download and install the Unifi controller software or buy the cloud-key (unifi controller on a stick). Make sure the cloud key is gen 2 (usb-c slot), gen 1 (micro-usb slot) had issues.

    Adopt all the unifi switches into your site and upgrade their firmwares (just in case).

    Then create the Separate Networks for Dante and NDI, assign them different VLANS and assign the ports on the switch to the appropriate Network.

    You can youtube search "unifi vlan", there are tons of videos out there. The latest version of unifi controller has changed vlan configuration to be easier. In effect many of the youtube clips may not reflect 100% the new interface changes.

  10. #10
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    I finally got a loaner system to test this sync problem. Same thing. I've VLANed the system and the sync goes out about 500ms after a period of time.
    My question, is anyone using Tricaster Mini Advanced Edition with NDI and Dante inputs?
    This is making me knuts.

  11. #11
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    Any help would be welcome.
    Thanks

  12. #12
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NewTek
    Posts
    1,556
    Do you have IGMP snooping enabled for your network? I have been running a test with a Dante console here for over 24 hours and I have not been able to reproduce anything like this.
    Zane Condren
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    NewTek Inc.
    new.tk/call

  13. #13
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    Zane, are you also using Mini? . My system has 8 Dante channels, 3 NDI cameras and a Spark.
    I'm question whether the Mini can handle this load

  14. #14
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NewTek
    Posts
    1,556
    Edit: Saw that you contacted support already. Please PM me the case number.
    Last edited by Zane Condren; 06-28-2018 at 10:33 AM.
    Zane Condren
    Product and Vertical Market Manager - Digital Broadcast
    NewTek Inc.
    new.tk/call

  15. #15
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Plymouth, MA
    Posts
    24
    Hi Zane,
    I hope you received the case number and were instrumental in the steps taken for tech support to send me this email. Really great news. I took the system out of service for a few weeks and I'm hoping to have a fix by August. Thanks for your help.

    “Re: Major loss of audio sync and audio dropout.
    Hello Brook,

    I wanted to let you know that I was able to reproduce this behavior on a TriCaster Mini running the latest Advanced Edition software (5-1-180323) in conjunction with the Dante Virtual Soundcard. I have submitted this to our Engineering department to be evaluated and will update you with their findings. “

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •