View Poll Results: Should Layout / Modeller be integrated?

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  • Yes, just like 3D Studio Max!

    4 1.79%
  • Yes, just like Softimage XSI!

    32 14.35%
  • Yes, just like Maya!

    15 6.73%
  • Yes, but take all the best parts of other packages, mix it up and do a kickass NewTek version!

    84 37.67%
  • No leave it the hell alone!

    89 39.91%
  • Whatever, I'm really not bothered, I can adapt!

    18 8.07%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Should Layout / Modeller be integrated?

  1. #1
    Valiant NewTeKnight Matt's Avatar
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    Question Should Layout / Modeller be integrated?

    Just wanted to start a thread to check out the Poll feature, this seemed like a good topic for it!!!

    UI / UX Designer @ NewTek
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  2. #2
    You are missing a compromise, like seperate, but with better comunication, or a masterapp that connects them so they can do everything a unified app can do but keeping the feeling of seperate apps.
    There was a better discussion on this in the old forums, that actually asked people for what they imagine it to look like.
    What I found weird was that there were not that many posts in it, as some ideas in it even appealed to me (and I am a seperatist).
    My advice would be to get this thrad going again and then do a poll asking people which idea they like best. How about that?
    From the options you gave above I would rather choose to keep it seperate though...
    CU
    Elmar

  3. #3
    The biggest thing that is needed is a setup mode that is independant of keyframes, and has the power and tools of modeler. This is not and easy and smooth task with the current hub setup. I love the two apps apart with a hub. But the current direction of adding tool to connect them with a plugin here and a skelgon there is really putting to many bumps in the workflow and hurting lightwave. they need a real setup mode in layout if they choose to keep them apart. With reall nice muscle bones and curves/curvetools that are usable.

  4. #4
    Lightwave Pimp Skonk's Avatar
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    Keep them seperate but improve the hub, u dont want to have all that extra system resources used up when u dont need it cos ur just animating OR modeling, if u put them into one but do it in a way that keeps un-used tools out of the memory then switching to them would require a loading time so its no diff then using 2 apps. The only problem is that the comms between them at the mo isn't always very good (tho iv never had any problems) so thats all id want changed.
    There really is no reason why using 2 apps hooked together with a third app(the hub) cant work just as well as 1 intergrated app, but its just not perfect at the mo. There are no limitations that 2 apps have compared to one single app if its done right.

    Only MHO

    James..
    uh wha?

  5. #5
    OK..this may come as a surprise to some because I wanted a Federal law passed to keep them seperate..but I have come around to the otherside..
    Merge them !!!!
    Just as long as there are NO goofy icon pictures of some strange hiyroglyphics
    And the GUI asks if we want layout opened
    modeler opened or both
    And the first release of this new animal is free so we can see if we want it or change it back before the official release.

  6. #6
    i voted "whatever".
    "The hardness of God is kinder than the softness of men, and His compulsion is our liberation." - C.S. Lewis


  7. #7
    I definately want them merged. I like it seperate so I'll live if it stays that way, but I think that merging them is the best way for LW to move forward and improve workflow.

    Having them merged may use up a little more memory when you want to just animate or just model, but for all those times you switch between the two you're using up a lot more RAM because you need to have all the models and textures loaded twice. Wether merged or split, you run into situations where memory is being wasted but I think overall it will be more efficient to have them merged. And as for the hub, yeah it definately could be improved (synchronization with Layout should be realtime!) but that alone won't make up for all the shortcomings of having them seperate without lots of duplicate code in Layout and Modeler, so that would be more wasted memory.

    I also like prospector's idea about loading the modules seperately; that would save memory and you could still have your modeler and layout shortcuts with a switch added that launches only modeler or only layouts module, or if you wanted you could have a single shortcut that launches them both together.

  8. #8
    Newbie Member Alec Trevelyan's Avatar
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    DIVIDE AND CONQUER!!!!
    [size=1]"In the future I see, you're stalking elk through the damp canyon forest, around the ruins of Rockafellar Center. You'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life. You'll c

  9. #9
    My vote is No, but I too believe that there needs to be more consistant communication between the two. I like the dual monitor setup, but I want them to act like they are the same application.

    Just to reiterate my other thread... You should not have to save your objects just to jump from layout to modeler. Don't force me to save over something until I am ready to do it.

  10. #10
    3D Practitioner DigiLusionist's Avatar
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    My heart!

    Steve, what!!!??? YOU???

    I never thought I'd live to see the day when you'd even consider integration in LW. What the heck made you change your mind?

    By the way, my vote is: Integrate the hell out of the code. The interface can stay basically the same. Just make both apps run off of the say code.

    How's about we use the term Integrated Code Environment, instead of Integrated Interface Environment? The integrated interface environment concept really freaks some people out.

    Also, when the app code is integrated it can be programmed so those who want an integrated interface environment can customize the interface to look and behave as one app with toggled modes, while those who want LW to remain looking circa 1864 can set it up to look the same as it ever was.Integrate the hell out of the code.

  11. #11
    Super Member Red_Oddity's Avatar
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    Merge 'm,

    i can live with it should they stay seperated, but i do mis a LOT of features that would be possible if the 2 where merged.

    to name a few:

    -Image modeling (especially necessary for good compositing or tracking meshes over footage)
    -Weight painting/tweaking when character has been setup
    -Clips/texture and other references stay the way they should be than (even when you save them in the Modeler..unlike it does now)
    -Animated meshes (and don't come with the Endomorph excuses again people), like extrusions, points, booleans, etc.

    These are but a few, but the list goes on trust me...i find myself swithing to *cough other software cough* too many a days now for the more expensive clients as they wish things that can only be done in a fashionable time in another package but LW (i don't want to loose LW or use it exclusively for modeling in a year or so...), and yes, you can start calling me names now and tell me it's the person behind the program, not the program...bring it on.

    It think it is a necessary step forward into the future.

  12. #12
    Lightwave Pimp Skonk's Avatar
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    There is nothing that cant be done with 2 programs that can be done with 1, there are no limitations to how 2 programs can interact with eachother if its implemented right. They can even share the data stored in memory if u wanted, an object loaded into memory could be displayed in both layout and modeler, both sharing the same resources. Its just that how it stands now there is a lot of room for improvement.

    James..
    uh wha?

  13. #13
    1864?
    nah too far back...
    That was the era of Lightripple 1D.

    Just don't put those silly icons and I'm OK

  14. #14
    Originally posted by Jockomo

    Just to reiterate my other thread... You should not have to save your objects just to jump from layout to modeler. Don't force me to save over something until I am ready to do it.
    You don't have to save your objects to jump from Layout to Modeler, I switch back and forth all the time without saving the objects so I can preview changes. You just need to save the object before you close Modeler or Layout loses any changes you made.

    SpankDaddy: Yeah you can make the two apps communicate better so that they act like one program, but there would have to be a lot of duplicate code in both apps. You can also make a single program act more like two seperate programs but still have the benefits of a combined program and more efficient code.

  15. #15
    Lightwave Pimp Skonk's Avatar
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    I suppose i just dont want lightwave to end up looking like all the rest, its been 2 apps since the start so why change it?

    James..
    uh wha?

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