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Thread: Better Chroma Key

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  1. #1
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    Better Chroma Key

    A keyer on par or superior to the keyer in the TriCaster 2.0 would be lovely. Also, an option for a multi-pass render version of a chroma keyer for difficult keys would be peachy as well.
    Sandy Audio Visual LLC
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  2. #2

    key

    The best answer I have is Lighting.

    Screen lit well and even.

    Three point lighting on subject(s).

    Maybe even a slight magenta back-light to kill radiosity from screen.

    Several years ago I did a Roll-in for NABJ in DC. 12 interviews from around the country, boy talk about bad lighting, VT did a excellent job on them all because of the tweaking adjustments available.

    Pete
    Pete Draves
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  3. #3
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    Oh, that was you? I was there.

    You're right - ideal lighting is always "key," pun intended. But we rarely work under ideal circumstances, as you pointed out in your post.

    I'm using the whole product line: VT[5], TriCaster BROADCAST, and SpeedEdit. The keyer in SpeedEdit is inferior to the other two. I think it needs an upgrade.

    Doesn't seem much of a stretch since the code has already been written.
    Sandy Audio Visual LLC
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    TriCaster: All Models
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  4. #4
    Registered User ted's Avatar
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    csandy, again I agree with you.
    Of course we always light perfectly! But sometimes we gotta edit garbage that is given to us.
    Seriously, I would love for the keyer in SE to be improved.
    Ted R. Ruiz Sr.
    Ad-Venture Video Productions
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  5. #5
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    It needs a LOT of improvement

    Cheers,
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  6. #6
    Paintball Video Geek billmi's Avatar
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    The ability to feather the edge of the key, like we can soft edge a video layer, would be very nice to have. Vector estimation of the edge on color data (allowing cleaner keys on DV material like Sirius Magic did) would be even better, even though I'd expect those segments to often require background rendering.
    Toasting with NewTek since 1991 - Corinthian Media Services
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  7. #7

    edge

    That is the edge of the key content not the edge of the frame.

    Pete
    Pete Draves
    CV Productions
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  8. #8
    Toasting Since 1992 GregGerlach's Avatar
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    So... just how bad is the chroma keying in SpeedEdit?

  9. #9
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    SE keyers need Lightwrap capabilities...

    Cheers,
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  10. #10
    Paintball Video Geek billmi's Avatar
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    And noise removal to cut down stair stepped edging.
    Toasting with NewTek since 1991 - Corinthian Media Services
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by billmi View Post
    The ability to feather the edge of the key, like we can soft edge a video layer, would be very nice to have. Vector estimation of the edge on color data (allowing cleaner keys on DV material like Sirius Magic did) would be even better, even though I'd expect those segments to often require background rendering.
    Hmmm, I thought the folks that pulled that off, Billmi, was "XM" Magic...


    But seriously (sic), you guys are right. Keying in SpeedEDIT is not as fun as in NewTek's hardware alternatives.

    Q1

  12. #12
    Las Vegas Toaster
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    What ever happened to the old keyer that you could "paint" on the vectorscope the colors you wanted to key.... I once did a Green & Pink key because of one of those less than ideal keys...

    I always thought that was the best as you could really target the exact color you were trying to get rid of.
    Brett Beanan

  13. #13
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbeanan View Post
    What ever happened to the old keyer that you could "paint" on the vectorscope the colors you wanted to key.... I once did a Green & Pink key because of one of those less than ideal keys...

    I always thought that was the best as you could really target the exact color you were trying to get rid of.
    Hi Brett,

    That was the cross keyer...from Andrew himself.

    That was part of the VT system....I don't remember that being part of SE though.

    I hope that SE 2 will come with NT new keying system.
    and that it will also support better noise, edge, feather, color correction, lightwrap...and selection controls....with matte/alpha controls along with it.

    garabage matte controls would also be nice

    Cheers,
    Last edited by radams; 10-10-2009 at 10:08 AM.
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  14. #14
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    Even in HD with good lighting and a perfect screen, the keyer on SE is not usable here.
    We have to export to pull the alpha, and often have to composite outside as well -- SE really bogs on HD overlays, so dropping the clip from the outside keyer back into SE as a layer is a killer.
    For what we're doing, even the "old" keyer in the standalone Ultra (B4 Adobe) works well, but that package can't do .mxf or 1080, so I'm stuck with re-rendered 720 when I go that route. A project built like this is at http://www.hiddenpersuader.com/GUARD...dgeReport.html - This client has a limited budget and a quick turn time, so I have to keep it simple. (The guy in the 'office' is HD keyed in Ultra, the guy up against the big, truss-mounted screen was done SD in our TriCaster.)
    I love the interface in SE, all other systems seem archaic by comparison. I realize that SE can't be everything, better compositing and keying would be most welcome here. My two cents.....
    Stephen Self
    Happy NewTekie Since 1998
    www.n-ventivetv.com

  15. #15
    Registered User ted's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NVentive View Post
    My two cents.....
    I'm hoping the keyer in SE 2.0 is improved as well, but we use green screen a lot with better results than that.
    Is that the web video causing all that blockiness? There is huge edging on anything with solid lines like his shirt, jacket etc.
    Maybe I missed it but what format are you recording? It looks like mini-DV in a HD version.

    We'll see what 2.0 brings.
    Ted R. Ruiz Sr.
    Ad-Venture Video Productions
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