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Thread: merge modeler and layout in one app

  1. #1
    Registered User octopus2000's Avatar
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    merge modeler and layout in one app

    merging modeler and layout into one app will be a good feature for future releases of lightwave.

  2. #2
    I shared that opinion for a while. Now that I'm used to using the two as separate, I see the logic in keeping the independant, and I've come to appreciate the usefulness of having them as two apps.

    patricularly while working with multiple objects in a single scene.
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  3. #3
    As we all have heard that modelling is going to be integrated into layout, it's a moot point.

    The fact that it was expected 2 years ago and now has been dropped from the 9x cycle is a more pertinant one.
    http://www.newtek.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=18493&dateline=130857  4707

  4. #4
    dynamics...so much fun ;) prospector's Avatar
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    well let's hope it keeps getting dropped for more important stuff
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  5. #5
    Registered User Andyjaggy's Avatar
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    Here we go again

    As much as I would like to see them merged, there are a lot of other things I would rather see happen first.

  6. #6
    Dreamer Ztreem's Avatar
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    It really needs to be unified to one app, but until it is we can just hope they fix things so it's not as limited as it is now. We can only hope that it doesn't take too much time until the merge will take place.

  7. #7
    Super Member jburford's Avatar
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    Do not want it as one app!!! Like it how it is, if I want to model, then I do not need to have all modules loaded for lighting, rendering and such.... And in general, do not like most of the apps where it is unified.

  8. #8
    Michael Nicholson zapper1998's Avatar
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  9. #9
    Plus points

    Merged --

    Immense power and animation/rigging abilities when modelling commands can be animated. Fine tuning of deformations especially so when being able to manipulate sets and characters to camera. (A big thing for VFX work) Tools dont need to be made for 2 applications in future so Newtek can put all their development into one neat application.

    Separate ---

    If you have a REALLY old computer then it saves on system resources.
    A dedicated environment just for modelling seems to be neater?
    Layout doenst get 'cluttered' up with a small tab at the top which gives access to a load of useful tools?
    It doesnt upset people who dont like change?



    There is no REAL advantage to keeping them separate worth arguing over and the only people who really want them separate dont tend to be those using Lightwave to the full. They are not aware of the glass ceiling that is currently there.
    Of course, if you just model, then plop a model in Layout and render, It might be difficult to see what the advantage is, but nevertheless, there are HUGE benefits to a unified application, and there dont need to be any drawbacks for those that don't if it is designed well.
    http://www.newtek.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=18493&dateline=130857  4707

  10. #10
    Dreamer Ztreem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pooby
    Of course, if you just model, then plop a model in Layout and render, It might be difficult to see what the advantage is
    The advantage is that you don't have to save your model and load it in layout for rendering. With a merged app you can render in your modeler.

  11. #11
    I think I'd favor the single executable, but for myself, the appeal for LW is that the interfaces are completely separate. Finding that I'm not a lover of the Hub and the transfer mechanism between the apps, a single executable would more easily allow for different interfaces to access the same data, without having to move the data at all.

    So the option I'd propose instead, is go with a single .exe, then allow for a user preference:

    a: Exe loads with only the animation/render interface
    b: Exe loads with only the modelling interface
    c: Exe loads with both, which the user can switch between with a button or keypress, etc.

    A fourth option would be:

    d: Exe loads with an interface that is both modelling/render/animation.

    The fourth option presents the biggest challenge, and is another complete rewrite of the interface (maybe not the framework underneath..).

    The other options I would think would be more easily attainable, once the data sharing code is re-written (which would probably have to be done for all options). Also, if the interface was designed more as a module, it could be like all the other windows, just part of a dockable-window solution. Then perhaps all users could be appeased.

  12. #12
    I hope they do merge them for the benifit of having tools that do multiple functions for modeling and animation. A tab for modeling and layout in the same GUI/Open GL space, but tools that work in both areas.

    One thing I hope they don't do is contain all information in one data file like Max does. I have had corruptions and issues in Max that couldv'e been solved easy if Max got the geomertry from an object file.

    I like having LWO and LWS files seperate. Never loose that feature!

  13. #13
    Registered User zardoz's Avatar
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    I've been reading this request for ages now...ah well. Some people want this, some don't, others don't care...
    In my case, I think more important things are needed.
    About merging...well, today when you see the amazing stuff some people are doing you go and check where it was done, and it was modeled in modo, animated in maya, displaced in zbrush, textured in photoshop, rendered in lightwave (and where you read modo, maya, zbrush, lightwave you can put any other software or change between the ones presented here). So when the developers at newtek created layout and modeler as separate programs they were seeing the future.

    I agree that some features of modeler I'd like to have in layout like being able to adjust weight maps.

    But I don't need to model in layout.

    Anyway, there have been so many requests that newtek should do this.
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  14. #14
    Member SCS5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zardoz
    So when the developers at newtek created layout and modeler as separate programs they were seeing the future.

    I agree that some features of modeler I'd like to have in layout like being able to adjust weight maps.

    But I don't need to model in layout.
    The only reason they're separate is because two different people wrote them! It wasn't a design decision, it was a limitation of programing skills. The only reason I upgraded to 9X was to animate modeling in Layout. Right now, I feel as if I've been sold a Yugo disguised as a jaguar. Wow, we've gotten lots of irrelevant new stuff we weren't promised, but, we haven't gotten the major stuff we were promised. Newtek, when will you add real Modeling to Layout so I can ANIMATE modeled changes FAST over time. And to all the fan-boys out there, NO WORKAROUNDS! I'm sick of them! Workarounds are for software that's broken. I'd like to work with software that says you want to do what??? ...Sure try it, because you CAN!....I want to animate all the things I can model,...ALL... booleans, shapes building them selves, bulging mussels as they flex, pull points, animate, cut, animate, add details, animate, DONE! No more exit Layout, model, save, load, animate. Want changes again? Exit Layout, Model, save, load, animate..Oops, not what I wanted? Go back AGAIN! PLEASE give me what I've already been promised and PAID FOR!
    Last edited by SCS5; 01-29-2008 at 06:04 AM.

  15. #15
    Registered User zardoz's Avatar
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    SCS5, I know why we have two separate softwares...but in my workflow having the two programs separate is good, because I work in a company with different softwares, so Lightwave's modeler is perfectly integrated with the rest...so to me it's the same if they integrate modeler with layout.
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