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Thread: Thing I would like to see for NAB

  1. #31
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    Yes, its OT , but since it was already mentioned:

    I agree :agree: with Chribba that an additional type of trim window would be nice ... with the incorporation of a scrub bar/pointers in combination with some stuff already created within SE for other uses. A dedicated Edit/Trim Window with scrub-bars, IMHO, is a major element missing from SE 1.0 for many types of personal workflows and types of projects.

    I actually don't see this as "old" --- it is a workflow that many of us find absolutely necessary. I think SE will pull fewer converts from FCP, Avid etc without it. SE's many methods of trimming are great --- I wouldn't change a single one of them. But I think a traditional Edit/Trim Window would open SE up to a broader base of users.

    Below is a jpg of a proposed interface. It is very Newtekian and SE-looking, and is derived mainly from stuff already in SE ... plus a scrub and pointer bar.

    For what it's worth in 2.0

    Mark.

    This window would be much larger than the current Trim Bay ... possibly scalable. The red, black and green pointers are all scrubable. In this single Edit/Trim Window the IN/OUT points can be selected in virtually every imaginable way: on the fly at speed (mousing in/out buttons), by timecode, by dragging a pointer, via keyboard shortcuts, or using a jog/shuttle. The grey areas on the ends of the scrub bar represent the handles of the clip (the frames not selected). Everything would work similarly to the way this type of setup works in other major NLEs ... except that it has a "Newtekian" design. Unlike the deck controls on the main GUI, the controls in this Window play only the selected clip. Audio heard is only from the selected clip. (The clip can be selected by clicking on an icon from either the TIMELINE view or the STORYBOARD view). Basically, all the essentials would be in a single, lean Trim Window, along with a scrub/pointer bar. Other features could be customized via the "options" buttons, or a whole slew of further options could be in a drop box "more options."


  2. #32
    LiveSet Making Machine joseburgos's Avatar
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    Have you tried using the Selected Clip Properties window (F8)?
    I does this but does not have the FF and Rewind buttons.

    I mean if it will get more people to switch, the only thing I see missing from the Selected Clip Properties window is FF and Rewind so maybe that could be added.
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  3. #33
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    Well I hate trim windows but I think DVEs on Overlays would ROCK!!!!!!

    Mattes as welll, hope to meet you all at NAB

  4. #34
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    The proposed Edit/Trim Window I've experimentally designed above has definitely borrowed elements from the Clip Props Window, (I tried to use SE-type features to make this hypothetical Edit/Trim Window), but they are not the same windows.

    Clip Props lacks the Scub/Pointer bar (a major element of the kind of window familiar to users of other NLEs), nor does it have a complete deck control. And Clip Props is jammed (and I mean, REALLY JAMMED) with lots of other terrific stuff ... but not stuff that I'd want in front of me while trimming. The proposed Edit/Trim window would be large in size (perhaps scalable), but lean in on-screen stuff.

    Clip Props is a GREAT asset in SE, (which is why I stole the monitor layout from it to create the proposed Edit/Trim Window), but Clip Props doesn't serve the full function of the Edit/Trim Window I'm proposing.

    It's tough to explain the functional differences in words ... vetran Newtekians may not have ever used a similar window with a scrub/pointer bar (it would be FCP, Avid etc types that would have encountered it). I would guess that those who have brought up the subject of the "traditional" Edit Window were all exposed to other major NLEs prior to SE (or VT).

    I think this discussion is a really helpful one for us "old fashioned" types that like the scrub/pointer type of workflow. Thanks. Mark.

  5. #35
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    May I suggest that if you guys want to chat about a trim/edit window...that you start a new thread....

    To be honest....I am an old timer....and long time editor.
    SE has a much faster way of working without having to pre cut and save off....you can do this all on the fly and yet still make your cuts and edits...very quickly and simply right on the timeline or in the storyboard...all interactively....

    The one thing that I miss is NOT trimming a single clip...but seeing the out point of one clip and the in point of the other...that is something that would be helpful...Now lets get back on TOPIC...what you would like to see NT show off or state at NAB...

    Cheers,
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  6. #36
    Visually Developed Monkey cholo's Avatar
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    My first NLE was a Vlab Motion. I've been around the nle circuit and I don't miss the trim window either. I understand why they invented it, and it made the transition from tape to the computer lots easier, but these days my preferred workflow is throwing my clips on the timeline, slice and dice them, move them around, drag my precut version back onto the filebin or just leave them around on the timeline and cut/paste them as needed.
    Last edited by cholo; 02-09-2007 at 12:48 AM.

  7. #37
    XDCAM HD production ScorpioProd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by radams
    The one thing that I miss is NOT trimming a single clip...but seeing the out point of one clip and the in point of the other...that is something that would be helpful...Now lets get back on TOPIC...what you would like to see NT show off or state at NAB...
    :agree: And ironically something that Newtek's Flyer could do 13 years ago.
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  8. #38
    I would like to see an feature for mark in/mark out----->paste/overlay....why?

    I have not yet found a easy way of doing this if i have 30 minutes clips and only want 3 second here and there.... I dont want to take the whole 30 minutes clip to timeline over nad over again, i dont want to scrup in the storyboard... I want to mark in and out the 3 seconds i want and paste/overlay them where i choose.. Why? because i want to.....

    Possible to get that function for NAB?

  9. #39
    Registered User ted's Avatar
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    Chribba, we do this all the time. Just bring the clip in once, cut off what you need and scrub to the next piece you want and cut that part. You should only need to bring it on the timeline once. If you want one of those pieces again, copy it to where you need it again.
    I usually bring in the large clip ahead of the project so I don't have to keep moving things around.
    I might be missing your point though???
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  10. #40
    Visually Developed Monkey cholo's Avatar
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    chribba:

    If you cut your long clips on the timeline and then drag the pieces back onto the filebin (you can even drag them into a new directory), you'll have placeholders for those small segments referencing the long clip. They look and act like clips on your harddrive, but the original file doesn't get duplicated or anything. They even retain attributes such as scaling, positioning, color correction, etc...

  11. #41
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cholo
    chribba:

    If you cut your long clips on the timeline and then drag the pieces back onto the filebin (you can even drag them into a new directory), you'll have placeholders for those small segments referencing the long clip. They look and act like clips on your harddrive, but the original file doesn't get duplicated or anything. They even retain attributes such as scaling, positioning, color correction, etc...
    I totally agree with you Cholo...and Ted.

    But this is something that some don't understand or prefer to work in a different way...I love your suggestion thou Cholo.... My I also suggest opening up another SE...just to do your cutups...then drag over into your production SE....
    It shouldn't be that much to create a skin that helps you emulate that other workflow...there is one for VT...so it should be able to be done with SE as well...I just wouldn't need or use it...anyone out there interested in skinning something up ?

    Cheers,
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  12. #42
    ted,cholo,radams...

    If one would ask you what kind of production you are doing, what would you say?... Whats the deadline time?

    chribba

  13. #43
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    From short form to long form...from Theater to web...

    Deadline...from months to yesterday...

    I had an Corp marketing image peice setup that had a 8 day turn around from shooting in 4 cities to finished product...several spots were cut from the main 5 minute piece...to longer individual segement that were up to 15 minutes...

    Now I needed fast cutups....SE was what I used....cause the output was for computer based presentation on both HD projection....and for web output...

    Chribba...If you question our editing background...I think you'll find that those you questions here have been at Editing and production for a LONG time....I've been editing from the ACE and CMX days...so I started analog linear...I've been part of this whole change... I've worked with Avids, Sphere, etc...over the years...I've put together whole workflows and pipelines..that included FCP and Adobe,

    I understand their strengths and weaknesses depending on what you'r needing to do.

    I've worked in Film, TV broadcast, and Corp Video production....

    Do you want a full CV ?

    I'm not a NT cheerleader... There are things about SE I do not like and would like to see changed...but a trim window isn't one of them. I can do more faster with NT workflow being open then being forced to use a trim window to put anything on the timeline... I could easily be done in half the time with SE's method than with "old Method". Seriously !!!

    Bute even with that said...SE is flexible to be setup to do exactly what you want....setup your own skins and options...remember this whole app can be customized...

    Cheers,
    Last edited by radams; 02-10-2007 at 06:17 AM.
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

  14. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by radams
    From short form to long form...from Theater to web...

    Deadline...from months to yesterday...

    Chribba...If you question our editing background...I think you'll find that those you questions here have been at Editing and production for a LONG time....I've been editing from the ACE and CMX days...so I started analog linear...I've been part of this whole change... I've worked with Avids, Sphere, etc...over the years...I've put together whole workflows and pipelines..that included FCP and Adobe

    Cheers,
    This was not a trimwindow.... this was to select in/out....in a preview window.
    No not background... type of production today. I will try to get the workflow we use/need in some sort of video online for you to see and then someone can make the same with SE and then we can discuss whatīs needed or not. This way we getting nowhere...

    chribba
    Last edited by chribba; 02-10-2007 at 07:04 AM.

  15. #45
    Production Wizard radams's Avatar
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    Please then move this discussion to another thread...we are way OFF TOPIC here...

    Cheers,
    Ray Adams
    FX and Production Supervisor

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