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Thread: Learning a new 3d software but still using LW question?

  1. #16
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    I have the latest version of MD, but decided to get one of the cloth dynamics plugins for the free software. The free software has about three commercial plugins that are not as feature rich as MD, but the kind of pillows, blankets, and furniture-ish stuff that I need, the plug does fairly well especially with 2.9. There is even a free plug that does an ok job with the cloth sewing stuff of MD.

    I got too frustrated with native LW cloth dynamics or even Syflex. I found MD to LW a pretty good workflow. But MD is becoming too pricey for me to maintain.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mummyman View Post
    C4d. Only saying so because I'm in that same boat. If you're looking for doing it cheaply, then Blender. C4d is pretty darn easy. 15 day trial though. Not that long to play.
    Yep fully agree. You get what you pay for. It's easy to learn but efficient and powerful.

    Quote Originally Posted by raymondtrace View Post
    There are a lot of salespeople here.
    Just honest opinions from what I've seen here.

    If someone has been using various 3D applications and plugins, the picture is pretty clear. And most ex-LW users (once getting used to a modern workflow and more efficient tool) state that they should have moved much earlier - if only they knew.

    To me LW is just a fun and niche tool in my 3D arsenal but it's not easy to justify and find use cases for it nowadays.

    Quote Originally Posted by RPSchmidt View Post
    For me, C4D and similar subscription software is a non-starter...
    Get your facts straight before you write. C4D is still available with perpetual license. For most LW users, Cinema is beyond their tight budget, so there is Blender (which is very good in its latest incarnations).

  3. #18
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    OK so here is one of the reasons. I am looking to face capture to animate my model which I already do with another program and then back into lightwave. However there have been vast improvements for face capture using just webcams in recent years and I know blender has it built in, but I found it difficult to get to grips with blender and for some reason, even though I followed the tut on YouTube, it wouldn't work the same. Most new software like dynamixyz which looks good only have plugins for the major players like Maya etc and often I am finding this. You spot some software, think that looks good, then no plugin for LW.
    I love LW and I've used it for so long I don't really want to change completely but to move forward I feel I know have to learn another program to help me take advantage of new tech/software out there.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by genesis1 View Post
    new tech
    Yes NewTek != NewTech :-)

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Yes NewTek != NewTech :-)
    Ha!

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by genesis1 View Post
    OK so here is one of the reasons. I am looking to face capture to animate my model which I already do with another program and then back into lightwave. However there have been vast improvements for face capture using just webcams in recent years and I know blender has it built in, but I found it difficult to get to grips with blender and for some reason, even though I followed the tut on YouTube, it wouldn't work the same. Most new software like dynamixyz which looks good only have plugins for the major players like Maya etc and often I am finding this. You spot some software, think that looks good, then no plugin for LW.
    I love LW and I've used it for so long I don't really want to change completely but to move forward I feel I know have to learn another program to help me take advantage of new tech/software out there.
    Ah, OK. iClone, then.

  7. #22
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    Yes, iClone is great for things like face cap. I have been looking at this iPhone app: https://www.bannaflak.com/face-cap/index.html

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Get your facts straight before you write. C4D is still available with perpetual license. For most LW users, Cinema is beyond their tight budget, so there is Blender (which is very good in its latest incarnations).
    You know what? You seriously need to relax.

    Perpetual Lightwave (the software I have been using primarily) costs $995.

    Perpetual Maxon C4D costs $3495.

    As I said, roughly three times as much.

    I do not have the luxury of adding another subscription beyond what is already subscribed to (Adobe CCE) as I stated originally.

    Those are the facts.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by RPSchmidt View Post
    You know what? You seriously need to relax.

    Perpetual Lightwave (the software I have been using primarily) costs $995.

    Perpetual Maxon C4D costs $3495.

    As I said, roughly three times as much.

    I do not have the luxury of adding another subscription beyond what is already subscribed to (Adobe CCE) as I stated originally.

    Those are the facts.
    Very relaxed over here :-) I don't want to 'sell' or protect any software or company or participate in a flame war but I dislike incorrect statements.

    You wrote "For me, C4D and similar subscription software is a non-starter..." - which is not correct as it's available perpetually.

    That has nothing to do with the price.

    "Roughly three times as much" as you said but for me easily 5x the product I get in regards to features, stability and usability. You get what you pay for - except with Blender where you get a lot without paying anything.

    Yes, I paid 3.5k+ for Cinema and 1k for LW, yearly updates plus tons of other similar priced graphic and audio software and almost all available plugins for Cinema and LightWave as well as render engines available perpetually - as a hobbyist - but never opted in for subscription (not even Adobe) and I don't regret the purchases. I can use them for many years to come, install them on different machines whenever I like and give them to my kids to use.

    Having said that, my 11 year old son has way more fun and gets positive results, finds out things by himself using Blender and Cinema compared to the grey, uninspiring LW UI and its unforgiving workflow. Actually he likes Blender the most with some cool modeling addons.

    I agree with you about subscription software in general but Cinema is not rental-only (yet).

    However due to the new MAXON (ex-Adobe) management and its forced online activation in the latest two releases I stopped upgrading and will continue using R20 (and R21 which was included in my MSA) with the various addons. Anyone who didn't purchase C4D R20 Studio really missed out in my opinion.

    And if VizRT or NewTek ever decide to implement a glorious online check / license activation they will not get any more $ from me too.

    Just my personal opinion and experience, everybody is not the same.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    You wrote "For me, C4D and similar subscription software is a non-starter..." - which is not correct as it's available perpetually.

    That has nothing to do with the price.
    My statement was actually two separate points, not one whole - I definitely could have further separated the two, but neither is incorrect.

    1. Subscription software is a non-starter for me; I can't sell my employer on more subscription software.
    2. C4D costs three times as much as Lightwave.

    Each of those individually is a bar to adopting C4D in my workplace.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    "Roughly three times as much" as you said but for me easily 5x the product I get in regards to features, stability and usability. You get what you pay for - except with Blender where you get a lot without paying anything.

    Yes, I paid 3.5k+ for Cinema and 1k for LW, yearly updates plus tons of other similar priced graphic and audio software and almost all available plugins for Cinema and LightWave as well as render engines available perpetually - as a hobbyist - but never opted in for subscription (not even Adobe) and I don't regret the purchases. I can use them for many years to come, install them on different machines whenever I like and give them to my kids to use.

    Having said that, my 11 year old son has way more fun and gets positive results, finds out things by himself using Blender and Cinema compared to the grey, uninspiring LW UI and its unforgiving workflow. Actually he likes Blender the most with some cool modeling addons.

    I agree with you about subscription software in general but Cinema is not rental-only (yet).
    And that is great - it is always satisfying when you get everything out of an investment that you personally put into it. But as I pointed out in my post, it's not my money that I would be spending (subscription or otherwise) and my employer is not interested in investing beyond what they have invested.

    On a personal / professional note, Lightwave combined with 3d Coat does practically everything that I need it to do. What it doesn't do, I do with Blender.

    It's not about automatically dismissing any software; but if cost is a discriminator, C4D is pretty high on that list, subscription or otherwise.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    However due to the new MAXON (ex-Adobe) management and its forced online activation in the latest two releases I stopped upgrading and will continue using R20 (and R21 which was included in my MSA) with the various addons. Anyone who didn't purchase C4D R20 Studio really missed out in my opinion.

    And if VizRT or NewTek ever decide to implement a glorious online check / license activation they will not get any more $ from me too.

    Just my personal opinion and experience, everybody is not the same.
    Can only hope that if Lightwave survives VizRT, they won't ever go the subscription route.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Very relaxed over here :-)
    Perhaps it's a regional thing, but "Get your facts straight before you write." sounds like a pretty confrontational opening line to me and a good distance from relaxed.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by RPSchmidt View Post
    Perhaps it's a regional thing, but "Get your facts straight before you write." sounds like a pretty confrontational opening line to me and a good distance from relaxed.
    Yes I concur, that was indeed confrontational, I apologize for that. Maybe I wasn't that relaxed when I was writing it after all.

    Thanks for explaining.

    On the other hand if your employer pays for the licences (if I understood well) you could try to convince him about the higher cost for increased efficiency, quality and even enthusiasm with a different software - if it's important to you.

    But considering what you get with free software today it's not easy to win this argument.

    Since you're using LightWave since many years depending what you do there might not be a big benefit changing software. And complementing LW with 3D-Coat and Blender is certainly not wrong.

  12. #27
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    Cinema4D has always been in the too expensive leage for me, if you are foremost hobby artist, Lightwave and blender has been the best value for money packages out there, with Houdini indie..some things have changed though, but itīs easier to learn both Lightwave and blender than Houdini.

    That said, Cinema4D has some great stuff indeed, but itīs not enough ..for me anyway.

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