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Thread: What is Happening with LW?

  1. #946
    It's really simple. If you want to see these kinds of things done, I have to be in charge and by that I mean in full. I have always had a plan to make this work and work well. I constantly refine that plan and adapt it to changes on going in the industry as well as accurately predicting shifts in the industry yet to take place. Priority must always be placed on making the software easier to use for all users in all verticals of the markets it can be made use of in while addressing many of the reasons for why people left the product to go to others in the first place. Those issues need to be address more so than "new features" because if they are fixed and done right, you basically get a whole knew competitive advantage out of a product that still has its advantages in terms of user experience and general capabilities. Once those things are addressed, advancements in the technology under the hood, some of which may be needed to confront those issues for user departure - set the stage going forward in ways where the "training wheels" are taken off in terms of capability of the product but still can be used by mere mortals. This attracts new users to the product while retaining older users of the product while at the same time bring about the return of users who left, to the product as these needs are addressed in ways that ways that says "Yes, we are serious about this and here is the proof."
    And then do it again and again and again in rapid succession.
    Further to that, the product must make money through other means. Seat sales alone won't do it in a way that helps grow the user base quickly. The current price of the product and cost of upgrades is a detriment to advancing sales numbers to a level where they should be, because development stalled, letting other products zip past. The solution to this is to shore up seat sales, discounted from current pricing, with ancillary product, services, tools, training, and more. That's what liberty3d.com was actually founded to do (in part, we will see what happens next). Ecosystems for software based communities provide stability in terms of revenue generation and growth as well as opportunities for the users and 3rd party developers to generate further interest in their skill sets, products and services and you know what that translates into? More seat sales, more products, services, tools, supporting developers and use because the product at the center cannot be destroyed through bad moves of management easily or even if they really really try because at that point it has a foundation under it that cannot be driven to total failure through a single or series of centralized actions. Why? Because any bean counter would go "what the frak are you doing!?" and stop it from being mucked with right there and then. Revenue streams coming from multiple touch points that drive further growth and interest in the use of the product creates more revenue streams and you get the cycle over again.
    I can make this happen.
    DJ Lithium | KAT! =^..^=

    Black Tiger Recordings
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  2. #947
    pass:sword OFF's Avatar
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    Those issues need to be address more so than "new features" because if they are fixed and done right, you basically get a whole knew competitive advantage out of a product that still has its advantages in terms of user experience and general capabilities.
    This is the same meaning as what I said. You can wait for the newfangled tools and functions - but the main thing is that the platform itself, the foundation itself, is comfortable and reliable. In my opinion, the structure of the LW itself is not worth changing (yet), but it is worth investing in the development of overall performance. And then add some innovations on this basis.

  3. #948
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    Just a heads up that I will not allow this conversation to develop into one which bashes individuals - whether former members of the team, former or current members of the forum, etc., etc. Just so everyone knows ...
    --
    Regards, Steve
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  4. #949

    Cool enough...

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  5. #950
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry_g View Post
    this is a race to the bottom,
    I believe I've told this story before...but I'm going to tell it again.

    Many years ago, I was at work and a DJ who was filling in at our venue saw the graphics I had done and asked me, "how much to do stuff for my outside gigs?"
    I gave him my rate(s) (I had one for hours involving modelling and scene set up, and a lower rate that was just to cover rendering)
    He said to me, "My nephew has Maya and he could do this for me for $100."
    I told him, "Wow!, that sounds like a bargain. Sounds like he is using cracked/student software on a computer his parents bought him. I had to pay for my software and buy my own computer. You should hire your nephew because that's my rate and that's what I'm worth."

    With sites like "Fiver" you are competing against people who think $25 is a good day rate for a gig. Hard to be competitive against that.

    The internet has created a global market for our skills. If you want to keep afloat you better have the chops to justify your rate, and have the fortitude to stand by your worth. Not "drop trou'" just to get a gig.

    (And in the interests of full disclosure, my skills are no longer competitive. 3D is merely a hobby to me these days.)

  6. #951

    cheap stuff is fine, but people selling it can't afford it in the long run.

    this leads to >
    - the creator goes "bankrupt" can't pay bills.
    - the client gets into trouble since he/she can't find similar price/quality elsewhere.

    both parties lose in the long run

    same can be said about a too high cost.

    and if you are willing to work for peanuts, great, but I do feel sorry for you.

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  7. #952
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    Fiver is not a good example of a content store.
    But if you look at DAZ, their development is impressive.
    This is how Daz generates its revenue and has attracted some great content developers.
    Maya, Modo, C4D they all say they have a hard time. With Only Modeller like Silo, it seems even harder to develop profitably. The only one I can think of that continues to evolve is Metasequoia.
    It seems like only software that goes its own way will survive.
    Houdini with the ability to learn before renting it.
    Blender and DAZ Studio, free and with a large content store, and a lot of bridges to other render software.

  8. #953
    Registered User Rayek's Avatar
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    Just look at what reallusion is doing: selling the dream with tools and asset generation that allow even a complete noob to create nice looking 3d stuff. The key is integrating high quality assets with great customization tools and allow for a seamless 3d pipeline conversion to other DCCs. Selling the dream of creating your own high quality CG movie/animation without the need to even learn basic 3D asset generation skills. Give the base tools away for free with some nice looking free assets.

    I've seen one guy create an AAA game with their tools and Unreal within the scope of one year, or so. On his own. Obviously this does not come cheap (couple thousands of dollars for the software, tools, and assets), but it is still ridiculously inexpensive compared to other AAA titles which employ hundreds of people.

    That's where Kat is absolutely correct. Offer an ecosystem of tools to allow 3d punters, hobbyists, AND professionals to get where they want to be quickly and efficiently.

    And Reallusion is marketing this stuff for professionals too: why bother spending time and money on a high quality 3d character asset with excellent topology when Character Creator gets you there 10 times faster with full control over textures? Export, place in your scene, adjust the textures, add some more detail with sculpting, bake, done.

    Do I see this happen with Lightwave as Kat has planned? Only when Lightwave is placed in the hands of a dedicated company / person with a strong mid/long-term plan. In the case of Blender Ton Roosendaal stepped into that role, and he always placed Blender as a 3d package with which anyone can make "their" 3d movie dream a reality. It caught on and is still going strong. Good art attracts.

    Vizrt is not interested or invested in Lightwave. This is indeed similar to what happened to Truespace. Or Softimage. A company with no real interest in the software other than scavenging the know-how and/or human resources attached to it.

    All that's really needed: a strong vision with a dedication to develop the software to assist its users to accomplish their CG "dreams". Get that integration up and running. Free and cheap quality assets generation.

    For Lightwave to survive, Lightwave needs to be put in such dedicated hands before it peters out completely.
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  9. #954

    all auto-pilot from here on...
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  10. #955
    "For Lightwave to survive, Lightwave needs to be put in such dedicated hands before it peters out completely."
    That would be me. I have the mechanisms in place to execute on this and the experience to do it. I can turn the product around in short order by focusing on what is really important to users as a user myself that has had to go from lowly artist level (and treated as such, sometimes by people who claimed to know better, but ultimately fell flat when push came to shove) to supervisor level while retaining the ability to still "drive the box" from end to end. Meaning from previs to final composite. When you understand the big picture you see exactly where the little details scream out their importance and why those things have to be executed on right from technique to tool functionality in order to deliver. Furthermore I have the business acumen to do it. I've worked practically every job in sales and support that you can shake a stick at, from retail sales in electronics to pizza to patents and production services. I've done it. In addition to this I have the corporate experience to facilitate proper business model structures as well as corporate organizational considerations dealing with everything from financing and public company listings and compliance. On the business development side I've been able to get major companies to engage with my efforts in other business dealing I've had in the past in the form of strategic partnerships to technology licensing and co-development efforts. I'm actually doing that now with a very well know brand on another front but circles back to LightWave3D. Everything I've done for the last 15 years or so, has been to prepare for this moment and I will have my chance.
    DJ Lithium | KAT! =^..^=

    Black Tiger Recordings
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    Founder and Citizen of Liberty3d.com
    www.liberty3d.com

  11. #956
    Registered User Rayek's Avatar
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    @KAT Yeah, I think if anyone is motivated and qualified to take on that job, you would be able to be that person. But will you be able to convince Vizrt management and Newtek to sell Lightwave source code and its brand to you? All depends on that.

    I wish you the best luck. If you do set up a patron or kickstarter, or something, I will donate (even if I am a Blenderhead now).
    Win10 64 - i7 [email protected], p6t Deluxe v1, 48gb, Nvidia GTX 1080 8GB, Revodrive X2 240gb, e-mu 1820. Screens: 2 x Samsung s27a850ds 2560x1440, HP 1920x1200 in portrait mode

  12. #957
    One of the things I would also like to stress, is that it is not enough to simply sell the product. Support the product. You need to get the users work. That means picking up the phone and cutting deals with studios and producers to put teams of LightWave artists back to work around the world, around the clock in the form a single large (but independently owned and operated local or regional teams with their own sales people supported by the larger group) VFX/CG/Animation production company or network of companies. Teaming up LightWave3D artists around the world with VFX coordinators, supervisors, producers and going to town bidding against the larger houses while remaining more cost effective than those competitors, supported and backed up by the rest of the global teams is how you get the users back to work. It's how we get the product back on the small and silver screen and elsewhere. It's how you attract new users to the product by pulling them in and doing apprentice programs. This is where you link up with the Fusion community who have similar desires and challenges in finding good 3D artists to pair or team up with to tackle jobs that they can bid on if they have those artists available.
    The next step is to start producing and owning our own content with an eye of eventually forming a larger studio presence that can grow into a sizable force on the world stage. Give the artists a piece of that. Directly. Factor them in as above the line talent rather than "techs" and you have a formula that will quickly strengthen the underlying product as each show will drive development and grow the development team working with contractors to bring on line advanced technologies typically only found in-house at major facilities before they see the light of day at the consumer product level. Beat those products to it and leap frog development of other products by having that development paid for by budgets for these productions. Which we now own a piece of.
    DJ Lithium | KAT! =^..^=

    Black Tiger Recordings
    http://www.blacktigerrecordings.com
    Founder and Citizen of Liberty3d.com
    www.liberty3d.com

  13. #958
    Quote Originally Posted by Rayek View Post
    @KAT Yeah, I think if anyone is motivated and qualified to take on that job, you would be able to be that person. But will you be able to convince Vizrt management and Newtek to sell Lightwave source code and its brand to you? All depends on that.

    I wish you the best luck. If you do set up a patron or kickstarter, or something, I will donate (even if I am a Blenderhead now).
    Yes.
    DJ Lithium | KAT! =^..^=

    Black Tiger Recordings
    http://www.blacktigerrecordings.com
    Founder and Citizen of Liberty3d.com
    www.liberty3d.com

  14. #959
    Vacant, pretty vacant pinkmouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djlithium View Post
    Yes.
    Delphic...
    Al
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  15. #960
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vncnt View Post
    NevronMotion was introduced as a separate plugin, but it should have been an integral part of LightWave so we could have reused animations.
    Yes, at that time when both Chronosculpt and nevronmotion was released, at list for chronosculpt I was very sceptic to chronosculpt to survive, and I said that this will not work out well ..
    unless it wasnīt implemented in Lightwave directly.
    I think someone there at newtek said itīs not gonna happen sort of, a bit annoyed with so many asking for that.
    And perhaps Nevron should be worked out within Lightwaves native tools as well.

    I Guess they tried to reach other markets, users from other software and attract them with this sales approach instead of a full bundle within lightwave,
    daring attempt but it also didnīt make Lightwave itself more attractive for the at that timecurrent users or new users.

    https://forums.newtek.com/forumdispl...9-ChronoSculpt
    https://forums.newtek.com/forumdispl...2-NevronMotion

    I actually got the chronosculpt program due to some recognition I guess..for being a frequent user or to make up for the long silence and such that was during that times, but I have honestly not really used it, why?
    ...I wanted and want a solution inside of lightwave without all that jumping between the modules, we allready have the modeler to layout modules to worry about.

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