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Thread: Going from AE2 to AE3

  1. #1
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    Going from AE2 to AE3

    As there is no sticky like the one for AE2 in the forum or a 'this is what has changed/what is broken' easily searchable on the Newtek Site or Forum I thought I'd ask and hopefully save myself some time.

    What operational changes are there between AE2 and AE3 and are there any HW changes such as Surface Mapping etc...?

    Looking at changing to something supported as we recently put a TC8000 into service and loaded it up with the latest (legacy) release of AE2 and it was stable for about a day before having random UI glitches. Usual factory restore etc... done before giving up and downgrading several versions.

    Probably the most pertinent question given our experience with the various versions of AE2 would be how stable is AE3 and are end-users still doing QA on public builds?

    Cheers,

    Shaun
    Last edited by smw; 05-19-2020 at 11:45 PM.

  2. #2
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    AE3, for us anyway, was very stable. But then again - so was AE2, so I'd suggest fixing what is wrong with your machine instead of trying AE3. Our machine started popping out black-screens during the productions so that was our cue to get a TC1. I suspect it is a graphics card thing, but I've not dug back into it yet.

    Operationally, AE2 was a better system from a user-standpoint. AE3 did some things and moved some things that made some of us users very unhappy. But then again, it added some nice things into the mix as well, but nothing that was really a killer-app sort of thing. The only reason we stopped using our AE3 is because MS stopped supporting the operating system.

    My advice is to save the $ you'd use for AE3 and get yours fixed.

  3. #3
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    Thanks for that, it does not seem there are many gotcha's from your comments. The upgrade licenses were purchased ages ago, so it is purely a what do we need to be aware of rather than is it worth the cost.

    As you say it is the current supported version and is always best not to be running outdated software where possible if it is production ready.

    Almost every issue we've ever had with these units has been a software bug requiring a sw fix rather than a hardware issue except for one dead drive and one internal network patch cable not quite seated in the $0.20 RJ45 thru-connector that reverted to 100Mb throughput when it got hot.

    Our current issue with AE2 is a software exception rather than H/W I/O failure which we think we may have found the root cause of by comparing the old and new systems windows installations.

    Some people, like yourself, seem to have rock-solid systems and others do not - it doesn't take much of a search on here or talking to others in the industry to find that out. As you'll know there are so many variables with these systems between the PC parts, the Factory restore images, driver version, installed windows updates etc... of the various versions and it seems to be very much luck of the draw which side you end up on.

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    My experience is that at one point under AE2 we were getting random BSOD. It might have been resolved in other ways but never have had any in AE3.

    I've liked the various changes in AE3 except for the surface comp controls changed and isn't quite as ergonomic as before.

    Also, having just launched premium access on our 8000, it has the holy grail of the audio mixer available in live panel. Not sure what your use case is of your system but I can definitely see that for many applications premium access is a godsend. One thing that I'm going to look into is our audio setup since we use Livewire/AES67 digital audio in our studio.


    Fritz Golman
    Museum of Broadcast Communications

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    Also, just wanted to mention that our TC8k saw a lot of use on the road. It was routinely strapped to a pallet in a shock-mount road case and shipped via truck freight all over the nation. It never so much as hiccuped on the road. From what you are posting, I would suggest a RAM test, and then a disc test. Failing drives can have bad sectors that pop up and can play hell with stability. Bad RAM can cause what appear to be unrelated and random access issues, BSOD's, and loads of other problems - in addition to the standard memory errors. If you have to replace the hard drive for any reason it is buried underneath the disc array in the case. Not terribly hard to get to, but it is buried in there. You can get a replacement hard drive from some of the vendors on here, I believe. I think NewTek may also have them, but I do not know for sure.

    You may need to also swap over your graphics card to a newer model in order to run AE3. I know we did, and my suspicion is that it was the source of the black-screen issues we had at the end of our 8K/AE3 use. I am going to swap the old one back in and try a downgrade to AE2 to see if that stabilizes it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fgolman View Post
    My experience is that at one point under AE2 we were getting random BSOD. It might have been resolved in other ways but never have had any in AE3.

    I've liked the various changes in AE3 except for the surface comp controls changed and isn't quite as ergonomic as before.
    Thanks, can you elaborate on the surface comp control changes you are referring to? Just checking you mean the physical H/W panel.

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    Hi dhodlick, we aren't having any H/W issues with our unit and our current S/W issue seems to have been fixed by downgrading the factory restore image NVIDIA driver to one that works. Brand new unit with brand new drives, brand new ram etc... like I said other than normal wear on a drive and a slightly suspect factory network patch setup we have always been a-okay on the H/W front. The unit live in a rack and never shifts or gets re-patched

    One of these days it would nice for the S/W updates from Newtek to conform the system you are updating so all the drivers and updates etc.. match as closely as possible to what they are using for QA.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by smw View Post
    have been fixed by downgrading the factory restore image NVIDIA driver to one that works.
    What version of Nvidia drivers are you using?

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    Hi, I've not been back near the system or notes for the last few days but we ended up downgrading to 388.71 the shipped version wasn't much higher than that but it's been fine for 5 days with no random symbol exception errors.

    You'd expect it to work from the 'factory version' of everything but we've all been down that road, fool me once and what not. I'll test out the latest versions of NVIDIA and Intel when I get chance as what ever was bust has likely been fixed in the 2 years between versions.

    I think we'll be sticking with our 2 year old software setup as having gone back through my emails every newer version we tested ended up in a week of back and forth newtek support trying to solve that one new bug and not getting anywhere or determining it was driver mismatch but never finding out what the version used for QA was and restoring back.

    RANT: Seriously though, if they can't bundle drivers stick the details in the readme or make version matrix or something. Surely it would cut down the amount of back and forth with newtek support. This guy summed up what this feels like for an end-user, control panel aside: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5ny_PrQAmA

    Thanks anyway forum users.

  10. #10
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    BTW, I've been getting that error message about Intel driver updates at session launch that I've been bypassing.

    What is the correct version (for an 8000) and where do I get it? Assuming that the driver is, in fact, out of date.

    And, I'm not sure if this would have anything to do with this but is anyone aware of quality issues streaming? Very choppy to both Facebook and YouTube, even with the very lowest settings in the stream configuration AND then tweaking them down further! We're getting 89 Mbps down and 17 Mbps up on a Comcast internet connection. Not sure if this is because there just are SO many people streaming on those sites these days (EG, it did on occasion seem somewhat better after business hours).

    UPDATE: It really seems that it's the TriCaster. I just took in an NDI stream from the TriCaster to OBS out to YouTube, same stream as what I was attempting on the TriCaster, and it seemed much, much more solid. Is it possible that the streaming encoder on my 8000 has some issue in the 5/15 update? Can anyone test this out and see if they are having ANY issues streaming from the 8000/AE3 5/15? If not the encoder, would something have happened with the IP stack? Given that this device has never been updated from Microsoft, perhaps it's time now (if not only for just security sake)?

    Thanks!

    Fritz Golman
    Museum of Broadcast Communications
    Last edited by fgolman; 05-26-2020 at 09:22 PM.

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