View Poll Results: Would you want Facebook or this Forum as the main forum for discussions?

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  • I Want this Forum

    66 66.00%
  • I want Facebook

    5 5.00%
  • I want this Forum renewed

    47 47.00%
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Thread: Would you want Facebook or this Forum as the main forum for discussions?

  1. #46
    www.Digitawn.co.uk rustythe1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    I disagree with in principle all you say here..
    I think You are looking at in the eyes of a too much subjective opinion based on history posting of negative comments as an excuse, a part of the complaints is in fact due to the lack of engagement in the forums, and newtek is just as responsible for the forums lack of functionality as lightwaveīs lack of functionality in some areas, the lack of modeling updates etc is of course something that transcends in to the forum..itīs not the forum fault but newteks responsibility to deal with the software in the first place.

    And of course, here is how the forum looks like in blender, it is unavoidable....there is nothing to it than facts, had the lw forum been as good implemented as the blender forum, I wouldnīt even had considered talking about this.
    trying not to sound offensive, but you proved my point in your first few lines you advertised and said how much better blender is, Twice, and then yet again in your next post (I know your only referring to the forum, but its still a grass is greener over the hedge statement)
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  2. #47
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rustythe1 View Post
    trying not to sound offensive, but you proved my point in your first few lines you advertised and said how much better blender is, Twice, and then yet again in your next post (I know your only referring to the forum, but its still a grass is greener over the hedge statement)
    I have no idea of what you are talking about...yes, refering to the forum, grass over there better? and that is to clarify what? that it often isnīt the case or what?
    I am not sure if you are over there in the blender forums, I do not put any competition value in to this..I just have a much more better experience and feel it being more as a forum should be..there is nothing more to it than that?
    Fact is..they have thumbs for the artwork done..directly on the main page, lightwave has not, they pay attention to new tools direcly on the main page...lightwave does not, blenders forum is all about blender mostly...newteks are not, blenders forum by itīs sections is more structured and cleaned up, lightwave is not.

    It is just pure neglectance of reviving this forum, and given the face of that, this forum will be in danger of thriving on off topic threads.
    In general it is the format and structural design of the forum that needs renewed, the actual community behavior is a bit seperated and what we care to post about..wether or not a revival and migration to lightwave3d will make it better, that we can only see when it happens.

    What was your point that I was proving? I am lost in understanding that.

  3. #48
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    ...but I do not think it will be anywhere near in the way facebook does it with itīs algorithms to decide what to target you with.
    Facebook only knows what to show you based on what you tell it to show you.

    I have a bare bones Facebook account for work, because my company markets on Facebook. I don't "friend" people with this account. I don't like or otherwise interact with any random posts with this account. I don't wander anywhere off topic with this account. The only thing I do (aside from what I do for my company) is monitor the LW Facebook groups. Facebook does not know any other thing about me so I only see LW posts. There are times where I get to the bottom of the FB feed and it stops...Facebook does not know what else to distract me with.
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  4. #49
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    I started a poll on blender forums as well, without even mentioning having one here on lightwave so trying to avoid any lightwave blender discussion or what people bring to the table in the various forums, I am just more interested to see how
    they perceive facebook working for them over there, vs using the blenderartist forum, to see what similarities And differences there may be.

    Of course, If I had a facebook account... and could post a poll there, the outcome may probably be in favour for facebook.
    15 voters so far over there, not much to go by..but all of those are 100% for their blenderartist forum as prefered forum and none for facebook, not meaning they would be excluding facebook...just prefered.
    wether or not these polls can give a fair poll on most users Is left to be discussed, and wether or not we users find a regular forum of more use, and developers and marketers of a software find facebook more of use.
    I reckon this has two faces ..one for the users, and one for those in charge of the software.

    https://blenderartists.org/t/what-do...cebook/1205176

    A quote from the blenderartist forum.
    "Ace_Dragon
    Member
    3h

    Most of the “new-school” networking sites (even Reddit) have the issue of topics quickly getting buried and then lost forever (because who is going to dig down and search for them)?

    The classic message board is still the best solution for keeping topics alive and keeping older information within easy reach. It also remains the best medium for project threads (because they float back to the top whenever you post an update)."

  5. #50
    www.Digitawn.co.uk rustythe1's Avatar
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    well problem is, if you don't use FB you don't know what tools are available, how you can organize and recall stuff, it may look like a simple single long thread, but its not if you know how to use it,
    for example, units, can divide everything up almost like a forum so I can very quickly go back to something of interest from a couple of years ago.
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    lots of people prefer places like FB or Discord because you can have multiple interests, groups etc all with in one interface, even cross talk and link, you can control who sees what so you have a better level of privacy, multi chat live groups, Discord is great for getting instant help, exchanging info and files either with groups or individuals,
    on FB you can click on files and see everything that was shared and get what you missed or lost with out much searching, im not saying the forum doesn't have its place, im saying more people have moved with the times to different social environments and integrated it with the way the live or work.
    you say you don't like the tracking on FB, but what about the Blender forum, its absolutely awash with advertising and tracking, every 2 or 3 reply's in threads and I am greeted with one of these full width banners (yes I have been a member for a while as are many people here and on LW FB), then again at top and bottom of the page, and then down the right hand side how can that be considered clean and easy to follow, but hang on, isn't this exactly how FB looks?
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  6. #51
    www.Digitawn.co.uk rustythe1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishhead View Post
    I really donīt know much about whatīs possible with the fb site. Still have no fb account, so most stuff is hidden to me. Please enlighten those who are ignorant: Is it possible to link to discussions, have older entries present with a few clicks, search the posts for topics in a halfway meaningful manner?

    These forums here are so full of useful information that you can link to, search for, etc. More than just a few times it happens that a years old thread is revived and helps to solve current problems. Is all that possible over on the fb site?
    Yes, see my last rant above, you have a search box for the group, the pages can be pre sorted into units, you can save posts into your favs and organise, set up notifications for conversations, and each post can collapse into contained conversations or threads
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  7. #52
    Not a fan of facebook at all. Closed my account there a while ago.

  8. #53
    Registered User gdkeast's Avatar
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    I really like this forum a lot. Reading some of the threads is actually pretty entertaining.

    A while back at the university I attended, I saw a spray painted message that said: Friends don't let friends Facebook.

  9. #54
    www.Digitawn.co.uk rustythe1's Avatar
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    but then you can look at 2.37 billion people disagree, that's over a third of the population of the planet, why wouldn't you concentrate your efforts on a medium that has that kind of reach,
    im not saying which I prefer as being face book by the way, im merely pointing out the reasons I see that they would concentrate any efforts that way and would neglect the forums, and as false as people may be on FB, it still allows me to be connected to people I would have usually lost contact with,
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  10. #55
    Member pming's Avatar
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    Hiya!

    Forums. Easy.

    Facebook? Er...no thanks. It makes zero gee dee sense to me. Can't find anything I'm looking for, and when I do there are so many other visual distractions on the page that trying to read a comment gives me a head ache.

    Forums may be old...but they get the job done in an easy to use and easy to read way. One thread, one series of replies to that thread with zero other "things" going on all around the screen. Easy to link to/from other sites just as easily, from what I can see. With a well-organized Forum, why anyone would prefer FB is just beyond me. o_O

    Then again, I'm not "the normal internet user"; I don't have FB (well, I have a 'fake' account), I don't have Instagram, I don't have twitter, hell, I don't even OWN a cell phone! The only 'social media' I am 'on' is BitChute, Youtube, Minds.com and Gab.ai. ...and I never really use the last two.

    So yeah...Forums FTW!
    ^_^

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  11. #56
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    only 32 votes all in all in the blender forums, 32 votes for their own community forum, facebook 0
    They seem even more decicated to prefer their own forum..

    My perception on it...though yet perhaps too early and with too little participants in the poll, I would guess that most users over here and there tend to prefer a dedicated forum ..not facebook, while
    a Company responsible for the software..seem to prefer to use facebook for increasing vicinity and possible increased sales along with that..and thus they spend little effort on their own forums.
    I donīt see anything wrong with any of it..except when no maintainance at all is done to make their own forums more vibrant.



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  12. #57
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rustythe1 View Post
    but then you can look at 2.37 billion people disagree, that's over a third of the population of the planet, why wouldn't you concentrate your efforts on a medium that has that kind of reach,
    Why wouldnīt they care about customer support? they must be aware of that many customers do not want to discuss lightwave topics on facebook, they can treat facebook as they want for increasing sales, but just donīt let forums fade..
    So ok, we got a working forum...but not a particular good one, this is a root community where you can build Lightwaves reputation as well..as beeing a great resource, easy to get help..easy to share artwork etc.

    I am not opposed to the whole prospect or disagree that facebook could help their sales, but I think they shouldnīt concentrate All their efforts only there...I see value in these forums I guess from a different perspective than you I guess...it may not be as
    distinct or easy to evaluate what impact the forums has for sales or attracting new customers, but the value for the whole community when engaging in the Lightwave world and in fact how that can further sustain the use of Lightwave is very hard to get a grip on I guess.
    I just think they underestimate the importance of this forum, and is neglecting it with nothing to renew it.

    Considering Facebook is so large with so many users, I am a bit surprised that lightwave isnīt on the top selling charts yet...but maybe those records of it is hidden? or perhaps...had it not been for facebook,
    Lightwave would be out of business by now?

  13. #58
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    And...as for concentrating sales to facebook, why not try the approach of supporting third party devs better...as with engaging people in others artwork and knowledge with thumbs to artwork Directly on the main page as blender does, they could as I also mentioned have ads directly on the front page for third party plugins, or free ones as well for that matter to notify the community on tools to enhance lightwave experience all in all.

    Sample below not intended asad for blender or blender tools, but showcase for adnet.


    but nada.Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #59
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hypersuperduper View Post
    These forums are about 70% just a place for kvetching about nonsense. At best 30% useful information. And less than 1% cool stuff. The Facebook group on the other hand is about 60% interesting lw work being shared, 30% useful information and 10% kvetching.

    There are very real reasons to avoid Facebook, but currently as it stands, the Facebook group is far better place for lightwave info and inspiration It shouldn’t be that way but it is.
    And that is why I suggested renewal, simple things like the gallery thumbs will instantly notify of art of interest rather than hidden in a non thumb gallery, I am certain it would increase engagement and discussions about artists, the art and techniues around it rather than a forum "made for discussion Only"
    Same principle with tools being made for lightwave where the author can have it being displayed on the mainpage with adnet as in blender forums.

    Mind you..how many of us thought the earlier thumb gallery was at least better than today, and how much better wouldnīt it be if improved be be on the front page.

    So I am utterly convinced these forum could be back to a more vibrant forum with talk about artwork, the tools behind it (lightwave and plugins) if it is constructed to work to benefit discussions around it..currently it isnīt.
    All that is a small part of guiding the forum back to a good place, there will still be main issues that spawns from the actual Lightwave Development and communication...the renewal of these forum will not fix that, but it will be one part of the journey.

    The assertments of lightwave facebook being more inspirational? what is it about it that makes it that way?
    Is it artwork published instantly..combined with a non existent sections for discussions that simply avoids ramblings and longer debates?, at least one of those factors can be implemented in these forums, the other factor may be dealed with under the course of time when we in fact get better tools to deal with forum artwork etc.

  15. #60
    AFAIK there is only one "official" Lightwave FB page and that is as dead as a door nail. The "unofficial" Lightwave FB that is moderated by Andrew Comb and others is very active and interesting, but is not run by Newtek.
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