Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: New Hardware general question, Gaming vs Graphics

  1. #1
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Boston, M
    Posts
    556

    New Hardware general question, Gaming vs Graphics

    when Windows 7 came out, I read somewhere that new hardware for gaming, will not be optimized for graphics production (2D, 3D, and video editing).
    Is it because gaming needs the graphics processor, but doesn't require fast CPU, multi threads, and fast bus?
    I'm still using a Windows 7 computer and need to shop for something, and don't want to make a fundamental error.
    Loathe the idea of going to Windows 10, but abandoned Apple years ago, and don't have patience for configuring Linux.
    Your thoughts much appreciated.

  2. #2
    Super Member OlaHaldor's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    1,005
    Gaming = few, but fast cores is better. Better GPU is.. better.

    3D graphics and animation; You need to make up your mind what you'll do the most;
    - Rendering: Balane between fast, and many cores. You can't have them both. Especially not at a decent price. There is a sweetspot in there somewhere though. Right now AMD Threadripper seems to be that sweetspot.
    - Modeling/sculpting: Few but fast cores is better. Modeling and sculpting is mostly single core stuff.
    - Texturing (substance painter for instance): Not sure how much the CPU is utilized, but it's very GPU dependant. Better/faster GPU with a lot of RAM is better. The Nvidia RTX GPU's are blazing fast at baking! Recommended if you do a lot of UDIM or materials.

    Do you plan to be on Windows 7 when you upgrade? Make sure you know whether the hardware will run with Windows 7. I've no idea if new motherboards and GPU drivers will support Windows 7.
    Last edited by OlaHaldor; 01-21-2020 at 03:09 PM.
    3D Generalist
    Threadripper 2920x, 128GB, RTX 2080 Ti, Windows 10

  3. #3
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,042
    I'm curious about the source of what you read. It seems to be more of an opinion.

    What's to loathe about Win10, especially if you can most likely upgrade from Win7 for free?

    Quote Originally Posted by medicalart View Post
    ...don't have patience for configuring Linux...
    It isn't relevant to this LW forum (as LW does not officially run on Linux)...However, anybody can get a linux machine up and running (installing OS, detecting/attaching hardware) faster than Windows.
    LW4, 7.5D, 2015, 2018, 2019, 2020 running portably on a USB drive on an Amiga 2500 running Wine.

  4. #4
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Oxford, UK
    Posts
    913
    Quote Originally Posted by raymondtrace View Post
    What's to loathe about Win10, especially if you can most likely upgrade from Win7 for free?
    I am still also running Windows 7 and not experienced in Windows 10, but I find W10 a loathsome experience whenever I encounter it. It reminds me of the old tape and disc hardwrare "smart" players which would automaticaly start playing when media was inserted, trying to second guess the user without having a clue what the user might actually want. The "intuitive" interface is horrible to me, but I know other people seem to get on with it and even like it. I do feel they may have crossed a certain threshold of the eye brain thing with a certain type of person and just plain overcomplcated it. Probably in the minority though.

  5. #5
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    6,770
    Quote Originally Posted by raymondtrace View Post
    However, anybody can get a linux machine up and running (installing OS, detecting/attaching hardware) faster than Windows.
    Getting that "quickly configured" Linux box secure enough to reliably let it sit continuously exposed to the Interwebs is a bit of a different story. Doable, but requires non-trivial effort (more than Win7 or Win10).
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.4 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),64GB RAM, NV 980ti

  6. #6
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,042
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    ...but I find W10 a loathsome experience whenever I encounter it...
    I suspect what you're seeing are Win10 systems where the user did not turn off the noise during installation/setup. While there are plenty of articles available to "tame" the perceived loathsome parts of Win10, most of it is squelched at the first run. Just turn off all the snoopy stuff when the "choose privacy settings for your device" screen appears during setup. Those "services" are primarily what makes Win10 different from Win7.



    Quote Originally Posted by jwiede View Post
    Getting that "quickly configured" Linux box secure enough to reliably let it sit continuously exposed to the Interwebs is a bit of a different story. Doable, but requires non-trivial effort (more than Win7 or Win10).
    I don't know if you're confusing security. Any OS starts in a locked down state and only lessens security when the user opens doors (ports) and welcomes guests (installs apps). What Linux trauma have you experienced to assume it is less secure? What's so complicated about it?
    LW4, 7.5D, 2015, 2018, 2019, 2020 running portably on a USB drive on an Amiga 2500 running Wine.

  7. #7
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Boston, M
    Posts
    556
    OlaHaldor** Helpful info, thank you.* Will put it to good use, I hope.
    raymondtrace** My concern about Windows10 is from various articles on the internet. Hopefully, overblown, but it's always a time-sink making adjustments. And**TheLexx's*comments will likely predict my user experience. Also read*jwiede*similar caveats about Linux, though I get the point that it's not all difficult.*Thanks for commenting.*

  8. #8
    Super Member OlaHaldor's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    1,005
    I too don't see a reason not to upgrade to Windows 10. The "time sinks" are really not an issue. Set it and forget it.
    The few times I've installed Windows 10 it's basically what raymondtrace says: privacy settings, disable stuff the first time it pops up, and you're done.

    The biggest change from Windows 7 might be the start menu and how some things are in the Control Panel and other things are in the Settings panel. I don't have a good answer why they've done this, but you'll seldom have to deal with either.
    3D Generalist
    Threadripper 2920x, 128GB, RTX 2080 Ti, Windows 10

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Right here
    Posts
    1,736
    If you use new hardware (Ryzen9 or similar) you need an up-to-date Windows anyway. Also some new applications cannot be installed anymore on Win7. For security reasons I wouldn't want to use 7 anymore. Installing and updating a Win7 system today would require endless updates and restarts.

    I would recommend to install a fresh Windows 10 - Build 1909 from the respective ISO file (USB stick) instead of upgrading an existing system. Much cleaner and faster then updating. On new fast hardware it's a matter of minutes (+couple of updates afterwards).

    If you don't like the Windows 10 start menu and other UI stuff you can use ClassicShell or similar tools. As mentioned by others, disable all options in the privacy settings.

    If you know what you're doing (but only then), disable services you don't need. Remove startup applications you don't need and remove entries from the Task Scheduler.

    Windows Update can be annoying when the machine is online and the update scheduling is not watched.

    Other than that I agree with others, there is really no reason not to use Windows 10. I run Win10 1909 on 5 machines with zero issues.

  10. #10
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Oxford, UK
    Posts
    913
    I do understand when people talk about security issues, but the main consideration for me is keeping old software alive, some of which likes a 32 bit envoronment with an older OS. The solution appears to be to buy old cheap machines from Ebay from time to time rather than obssessing over W10 being backwards compatibLe. I have heard of the open source Reactos project, designed to reverse engineer a Windows environment and be free for all, so maybe that will evolve better over time.

    Re. Windows 10 - presumably one can buy it, activate it, then keep it offline frozen on that build (just like W7), take an image file to restore from as necessary, with internet not compulsory or will it stop working after a while unless updates are forced ? The Microsoft site seems to indicate to buy once for a single device and never pay again, but if the machine fails then buy another for a new machine (as I understand it). Are you guys generally content with Home or Pro is much better ?

  11. #11
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Boston, M
    Posts
    556
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    ... but the main consideration for me is keeping old software alive, some of which likes a 32 bit environment with an older OS.
    My solution will likely be to get a new machine running Win 10, and slowly migrate programs and work to it. I'll keep the Win 7 machine around for the older software.

  12. #12
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,042
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    I do understand when people talk about security issues, but the main consideration for me is keeping old software alive, some of which likes a 32 bit envoronment with an older OS. The solution appears to be to buy old cheap machines
    The solution is much easier (and cheaper) than that. Just install VirtualBox (free) on your new system and then install a virtual guest Win7 OS to run old programs. In the virtual machine settings, keep networking connections (except for sharing a folder with the host) closed down so you prevent remote exploits on an unsupported system.

    What programs do we think will break in Win10? My company has a Visual Basic 6 32 bit app written 20 years ago that still runs in Windows 10. I've been praying for Windows upgrades to break it for the past 10 years...but it still works and I'm still stuck supporting it for our customers. Windows 10 still supports 32 bit executables.

    LightWave 4 still runs in Windows 10.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	win10lw4.png 
Views:	40 
Size:	67.7 KB 
ID:	146706

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    ...Are you guys generally content with Home or Pro is much better ?
    Pro offers a few more advanced features like serving remote desktop. That's the only ceiling I've hit as a Home license user. The Win10 Home version only functions as a client to remote desktop. But you can often work around these by installing non-Microsoft alternatives like VNC.
    LW4, 7.5D, 2015, 2018, 2019, 2020 running portably on a USB drive on an Amiga 2500 running Wine.

  13. #13
    Super Member OlaHaldor's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    1,005
    Chrome Remote Desktop is also a very good solution. I use it all the time from PC to PC and phone to PC. Very handy if I have a render going but I'm on my way somewhere, or in bed and can't sleep etc.. Just to check in.
    3D Generalist
    Threadripper 2920x, 128GB, RTX 2080 Ti, Windows 10

  14. #14
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Right here
    Posts
    1,736
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    I do understand when people talk about security issues, but the main consideration for me is keeping old software alive, some of which likes a 32 bit envoronment with an older OS. The solution appears to be to buy old cheap machines from Ebay from time to time rather than obssessing over W10 being backwards compatibLe. I have heard of the open source Reactos project, designed to reverse engineer a Windows environment and be free for all, so maybe that will evolve better over time.

    Re. Windows 10 - presumably one can buy it, activate it, then keep it offline frozen on that build (just like W7), take an image file to restore from as necessary, with internet not compulsory or will it stop working after a while unless updates are forced ? The Microsoft site seems to indicate to buy once for a single device and never pay again, but if the machine fails then buy another for a new machine (as I understand it). Are you guys generally content with Home or Pro is much better ?
    Forget ReactOS (in my opinion). Too slow progress and will not support (all) special applications ever or use modern acceleration technology. But I have to admit it's long I looked at it.

    Beside virtualization software (I use VMware Workstation), Windows 10 has compatibility settings for older software (right click - Properties on the exe file). Doesn't always work but worth trying in some cases. Also there is HyperV built-in but that I have never used.

    Instead as you mentioned, perfectly fine to keep a Win7 machine "frozen" and offline forever or at least as long as the hardware works. Win10 the same, once activated and from then on offline it should never expire (at least I have never seen that or heard of it). So install Win, activate, apply all current fixes and then stay offline. That's fine if you use software that doesn't need online activation (which is one reason I loath any online checking that, specially the periodic ones). But also be careful from what sources you install new software as your system is not up-to-date with security and antivirus patches.

    Just be aware that if the machine is online once again, it will force you to install updates and some applications may not run again (for example VMware 12.5 or earlier in Win10 190x).
    Last edited by Marander; 01-22-2020 at 05:23 PM.

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •