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Thread: Development of LWCAD 3ds Max terminated

  1. #1

    Development of LWCAD 3ds Max terminated

    Viktor posted this yesterday on his site.

    "I am very sad to announce that the LWCAD 3ds Max version is officially terminated.

    Main reason of the termination are very poor sales of the plugin.
    Although the 3dsMax has the biggest user community, very small portion actually using purchased license.
    Combined with AutoDesk's pricing policy (milking users), there is very little space for a small third-party developers to succeed with commercial plugins.
    Next reason is very low stability of 3ds max sdk and plenty of unreasonable compatibility breaks, which makes development of the plugin very time consuming and expensive.

    LWCAD plugin development will continue with LightWave 3D and Cinema 4D."


    I would urge everyone to support Viktor and his LWCad set of tools. There is so much there for every user no matter what type of models you create.
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  2. #2
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Yeah, I've been really satisfied with both LW & C4D versions of LWCAD!

    I'm not entirely surprised to hear that about Max LWCAD, when it comes to arch-viz-type tools there's already a LOT out there for Max (as well as having some similar native tools, albeit not as deep). The situation's a bit different for Cinema4D, where there just aren't as many of those kinds of parametric arch-viz modeling tools available.
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  3. #3

    strange, thought the 3DSmax community would run for such a plugin.

    seem to me they don't know what they're missing out on.

    time for NT to hire Viktor by the way.


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  4. #4
    Almost newbie Cageman's Avatar
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    I am not surprised at all regarding 3DS Max.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post
    strange, thought the 3DSmax community would run for such a plugin.
    First, they would have to hear about it... Programming is the easiest part of entire process of production. Much harder is to reach clients and persuade them to buy it..
    To reach clients you need to spend substantial amount of money on marketing (Google, Facebook, YouTube ads).

  6. #6
    Almost newbie Cageman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sensei View Post
    First, they would have to hear about it... Programming is the easiest part of entire process of production. Much harder is to reach clients and persuade them to buy it..
    To reach clients you need to spend substantial amount of money on marketing (Google, Facebook, YouTube ads).
    3DSM still contains the most users who still pirate stuff as well (because of the HUGE userbase). The worst thing about Autodesk is that with every release of a new version, SDK has changed and you need to fix stuff, that shouldn't have been touched (and doesn't make sense), in order to release for the new version.

    I have plenty of stories about the SDK thing, but I would have to break my NDA in order to tell those stories.
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  7. #7
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post
    strange, thought the 3DSmax community would run for such a plugin.
    You're missing the point: Between Max's own native (parametric) AEC extended objects, and similar third-party parametric objects/tools, the Max community already had access to many types of "LWCAD-like functionality" (for quite some time). Cinema4D had a few similar tools as well, but offering nowhere near as broad or as deep capabilities compared to what was already available for Max.

    A video showing Max's native AEC objects (from 2010):



    LWCAD Max just faced a number of market challenges that weren't present at same level for either C4D or LW LWCAD offerings.
    Last edited by jwiede; 01-05-2020 at 01:44 AM.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sensei View Post
    First, they would have to hear about it... Programming is the easiest part of entire process of production. Much harder is to reach clients and persuade them to buy it..
    To reach clients you need to spend substantial amount of money on marketing (Google, Facebook, YouTube ads).
    Yes that seems very true to me.

    LWCAD for C4D is an awesome plugin (way better then the LW version) but almost unknown to most Cinema users / the community.

    There is another suite of ArchViz plugins for C4D which seems more popular and established.

    To be honest if I didn't know LWCAD from LightWave I would have maybe never heard of it. There seens to be no marketing. I don't think I even saw postings in any of the Cinema forums.

    The (in my opinion) not well chosen name also doesn't help.

    The LWCAD web page is poorly done and doesn't help sales. There's no appealing images, screenshots, showcases, customer references, features listed, just links to LightWave LWCAD Youtube videos (which again are not well done). If I would be a user who doesn't know it yet I would lose my interest when visiting that page.

    The version is 2018.x in 2019 and early 2020, another poor sales decision.

    I know nothing about marketing or sales but these things are obvious to me.

    Another reason may be the slow development pace. It took Viktor more then a year to release LWCAD for R20. I know he had to do alot of redesign but most other Cinrma plugins were ready within a short time after the release. Of course it is a lot of work for a single developer to maintain versions for 3 platforms. A lot of work goes into this NURBS and Mesh TR thing which I guess is required specially for LightWave but I personally don't have any use for it (unless it's a fully capable and parametric NURBS toolset).
    Last edited by Marander; 01-05-2020 at 03:47 AM.

  9. #9
    ack ack Markc's Avatar
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    3ds max users don’t deserve LWCad......

    Edit: Anyone know how long the ‘last chance to upgrade’ is gonna last?
    Last edited by Markc; 01-05-2020 at 06:19 AM.
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  10. #10

    A video showing Max's native AEC objects (from 2010):
    ah, didn't know, less use for LWcad then, i can see that.

    There seems to be no marketing.
    from recollection, on a 100Mill Movie, the big guys sometimes use around 50Mill on marketing.
    Last edited by erikals; 01-05-2020 at 09:21 AM.
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  11. #11
    www.Digitawn.co.uk rustythe1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cageman View Post
    3DSM still contains the most users who still pirate stuff as well (because of the HUGE userbase). The worst thing about Autodesk is that with every release of a new version, SDK has changed and you need to fix stuff, that shouldn't have been touched (and doesn't make sense), in order to release for the new version.

    I have plenty of stories about the SDK thing, but I would have to break my NDA in order to tell those stories.
    yes, and quite clearly he cautiously worded it to reflect that "Although the 3dsMax has the biggest user community, very small portion actually using PURCHASED LICENSE"
    when ever I get certain types of work from "did it on the cheap" to fix, its quite evident it was made in a non legit copy of max.
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  12. #12
    ack ack Markc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markc View Post
    3ds max users don’t deserve LWCad......

    Edit: Anyone know how long the ‘last chance to upgrade’ is gonna last?
    Got the upgrade to 2018, didn’t want to miss the saving..... (especially with a free u/g to 2020)

    Thanks Viktor....
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  13. #13
    The main reason I think LWCAD got well established with Lightwave users was the fact that it was packed in with the Lightwave 8 release along with Vue if I remember correctly. I think it was maybe LWCAD version 1.5 or something but it had all the basic CAD tools and snapping to get me completely hooked on it! I have used it and upgraded ever since. I think Viktor may have to try and do something like this again somehow with C4D to grow the user base. People just don't know what they are missing.

    With that said if Viktor wanted to create a version for another 3D program I think a version of LWCAD for Modo could do fairly well with the right marketing strategy. Many Modo users already know what LWCAD is anyway so that would help. LWCAD still does many things better than similar Modo native tools. Maybe the Foundry would be willing to pack in LWCAD with Modo for 1 release to give every one a taste just like what was done for Lightwave 8.

    As a Lightwave user and LWCAD user I rely on both of these tools and have for many years. I want to see both products continue to be developed and succeed.

    If you own LWCAD be sure to upgrade when you can to support the product and if you don't already have it consider getting it to enhance your workflow and toolset.
    Last edited by Nicolas Jordan; 01-05-2020 at 12:01 PM.
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  14. #14
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    Is it right that LWCAD has capabilty way beyond architecture ? Like parametric primitives - is that when one is able to do, say, a hundred modelling steps and can edit any single step and it will update to ripple down the chain ?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    Is it right that LWCAD has capabilty way beyond architecture ? Like parametric primitives - is that when one is able to do, say, a hundred modelling steps and can edit any single step and it will update to ripple down the chain ?
    I think you can sign up for a trial account to try out it's capabilities for yourself. http://www.lwcad.com/html/login/logi...d!download.php

    I personally find it's traditional CAD curve/line tools the most useful. Some of the most basic features it's accurate snapping system and the ability to trim, join and extend lines should not be under estimated. Anything drafted with curves and lines can then be converted to polygon surfaces. Real time interactive booleans are also a favorite of mine. These are the tools I use the most for my work.
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