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Thread: Cinema 4D R21 now requires login. Now only Lightwave is left to truly own, I think..

  1. #1
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    Cinema 4D R21 now requires login. Now only Lightwave is left to truly own, I think..

    Next version of Cinema 4D R21 now seems login only, even for Perpetual version.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Yaceh0tfSg#t=52s
    Upcoming Cinema 4D R21 FAQ

    Though I don't exactly see a herd defecting from Cinema 4D to go LW, it is nevertheless of some value if LW is perceived as the "last man standing" for outright ownership, so learning paths and any bug fixes may be a thing to focus on over next few months. Lightwave is not bad software at all, so it just needs a push....

    (If too off-topic irrelevant, mod delete )
    Last edited by TheLexx; 07-30-2019 at 12:25 PM.

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    A push and also a little modernization. They should lock a few of their talented developers in the basement of Newtek labs with a 5 year mission of building a brand new modeler in Layout. They don't regain their freedom until their mission is complete. They can copy what works in classic Modeler and improve upon what doesn't. I'm not exactly on team 'Unified app', but I do finally see the merits of their developers having to code for one app instead of 2+.

  3. #3
    Super Member JohnMarchant's Avatar
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    Blender.

    No LightWave is not BAD at all, well Layout, Modeler got left in the 20th Century.
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    Yeah absolute BS. VERY disappointing and sad to see (but expected in a way with the new CEO).

    It leaves NewTek LightWave and Blender as the only remaining offline 3D packages available with a user friendly licensing system.

    Also as I side effect, only subscription users will get Cineversity access. And not all future releases will be available perpetual. "Some future Cinema 4D upgrades may be available only to subscription customers, while others may be available as perpetual licenses at upgrade pricing." - WTF.

    I will get R21 perpetual within my MSA but for most parts continue using R20 / RedShift / Vray that works completely offline.

    It's clear where that is heading to. As much as I love C4D, MAXON just lost a customer.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLexx View Post
    Next version of Cinema 4D R21 now seems login only, even for Perpetual version.
    No, only at first start or when switching machine, but "Single-user licenses associated with a MAXON Account require internet connection for initial activation and must connect every 14 days for continued use."

    BS licensing.

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    I suspect a good chunk of 4D loyalists will become ex-loyalists as a result of this. And now we have Maya Indie at $250 a year.
    This is surely Blender 2.8 stoking fear into them. It must be. Quite funny in my view.

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    Kind of a big deal that perpetual license now costs 4000$, there is no cheaper Prime, Visualize. There are a few different rental variants, but the annual costs are 1000$ and upwards for more features.

  8. #8
    I really don't get the big deal people have with login based licensing.
    Zbrush, Modo, Marvelous Designer, Marmoset all use it and I love it. Really if logging in is the best problem you have with software, enough so that you won't use it, well I wish I had your issues. In most cases, I log in once and forget its even there. But then I'm always on an internet connection so maybe if you're working in a bomb shelter through 20 feet of concrete without a landline, ok but I imagine any company using it in their pipeline will do what they need to.

    And the new subscription option is really cheap. It would take several years of paying for subs before you met the match of buying a perpetual license and keeping it current. And 20 bucks a month for Redshift? Looks pretty great to me. I don't need C4D now but nice to know its an option now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Free4Ever View Post
    Kind of a big deal that perpetual license now costs 4000$, there is no cheaper Prime, Visualize.
    I hadn't spotted it as starkly as that. So the plan appears to be to kill off perpetual licensing by seriously hampering any advantages it previously had. It is a mystery why anyone would buy such a license commencing from R21...

    Those from the UK might remember an anarchic cult TV comedy called Bottom starring Rik Mayall and Adrian Edmondson. I once went to see the stage play, and at the end a big curtain rolled down with the very large writing "That's it, F**k Off". Seems Maxon have the same sense of humour...

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    One big deal with login licensing, is what Autodesk just did with 3dsmax 2016 perpetual license. They will not issue new licenses needed when you upgrade your PC, effectively killing your perpetual license that probably cost 4000$.

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    I can understand the desire to own your software if you are running a company and need lots of seats, and are very careful with system updates and stuff Particularly if you invest in developing a lot of custom plugins, and want to ensure compatibility. But for small teams and independent artists I really don’t see the problem with subscriptions. OS updates often render cause older software to function wrong for example and since old versions aren’t usually supported you need to upgrade anyways at which point you are effectively stuck with a de facto subscription unless you plan on maintaining a machine that is years behind, which is just asking for trouble. True, if civilization collapses, I will still be able to use lightwave on my squirrel-powered computer, while I won’t be able to connect to Adobe’s servers to use my photoshop subscription, but barring that, I quite like the ability to rent software.

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    The biggest problem is that most are switching to rental and killing perpetual licensing at once. If there always were 2 options, buy OR rent, it would be less of a problem...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Free4Ever View Post
    One big deal with login licensing, is what Autodesk just did with 3dsmax 2016 perpetual license. They will not issue new licenses needed when you upgrade your PC, effectively killing your perpetual license that probably cost 4000$.
    Exactly. Here's also a nice little info: "Please note, Maxon may retire releases which are 3 years old. Once retired, a release will no longer be available for download from the Maxon User Portal and will not be eligible for support."

    That can also mean they cannot be activated anymore (see AD). Or don't get updates and so on.

    I don't want my machines to be online for various reasons. For example I have virtual machines running with different network topologies, some of them expose services (for example Docker micro services to other machines). Also I don't want to have a Windows update interrupting my render or any other service. I don't like my machines, data or customer developments exposed to various internet threats (yes of course they are behind hard and software firewall but that's just one layer of security). Therefore I have dedicated laptops that are online and only connect a workstation online via USB WiFi stick when required (and that is not to start an application).

  14. #14
    Registered User Romizer's Avatar
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    I hope that Lightwave will never go that way.
    Hate forced connection.
    Freedom (even with software) is the highest good.

  15. #15
    Wow, so there actually a shot for lightwave now, since the big 3 have effectively become anti consumer. Anyway LW still has tough competition from blender.

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