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Thread: SketchUp goes subscription

  1. #1
    Super Member Snosrap's Avatar
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    SketchUp goes subscription

    Another one bites the dust. https://blog.sketchup.com/article/a-...QUpJVVMzIn0%3D

    If LW ever goes this route, I'm done.

  2. #2
    Registered User calilifestyle's Avatar
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    But there still is the free version. you know what, yeah this is lame. "Proudly introducing SketchUp subscriptions." On their page kind of annoying
    Last edited by calilifestyle; 02-06-2019 at 11:25 PM.
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  3. #3
    Registered User Rayek's Avatar
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    [sarcasm mode on]

    That's an amazing new dashed line feature update. Worth the upgrade in rent alone! And WOW! a ruler upgrade too!

    [sarcasm mode off]

    Poor Sketchup users.
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  4. #4
    Yes, how these plans are usually presented can seem condescending, now with subscription options! Many independent users don't see the benefits, and only see it as a benefit to the vendor. I do agree that it doesn't look like a impressive list of new features (but I don't use the program so can't really say either way).

    Truth is though, a lot of people do use subscription software and it appears to be a more sustainable business model as people buying a perpetual license and sitting on it for however long and upgrading at their whim of course sounds great to a buyer on a budget, but doesn't always provide regular revenue which a company needs to pay development costs. Modo for instance offers both a perpetual license and subscription based services, but subscription was 75% of revenue last year.

    kind of like Allegorithmic's recent acquisition/merger with Adobe. You'd swear by internet outrage by customers that they were going to lost most of their customers. The truth is, they're likely to gain more revenue even if they did go to subscription only (not to mention probably just getting a huge influx of cash from people rushing to buy a perpetual license, fearing that they're going to go away).


    But again, I don't use Sketchup and don't know if most of their user base are professional or indie hobbyists or freelancers. Most professionals would just consider a software cost either subs or perpetual with upgrades a cost of doing business if the software was essential for them.

  5. #5
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    Any software going rental or online activation I immediately stop supporting, as it happened to Vray, Vue xStream, Substance and more to come I guess.

    As a perpetual license owner I have a free Vue Enterprise subscription now for a couple of months but never even installed the new version, couldn't care less. For Vray I have one year free rental but after installing the new version I noticed that it requires an online connection all the time - uninstalled immediately. Same for Corona of course. Then I considered Octane 4 with a dongle - LOL you need to verify and update your dongle every couple of months. What a pile of &@!# software.

    Sooner or later all big software will go rental only in my opinion. To me that means I will continue using the last perpetual version I have and save a lot of money for maintenance and upgrades.

    For corporate users subscription can be a good option but not for individuals or hobbyists.

    There is already software that can not be activated anymore because the company was sold or they changed the activation system that doesn't support old version anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by hrgiger View Post
    Modo for instance offers both a perpetual license and subscription based services, but subscription was 75% of revenue last year.
    ...
    Well Modo with its online activation licensing system is not much different from subscription (except you pay once) because you can not do a single thing without Foundry giving you permission. There were reports where the Modo activation system didn't work and users couldn't finish customer projects on time. I might have purchased Modo with the previous licensing system but not anymore.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rayek View Post
    [sarcasm mode on]

    That's an amazing new dashed line feature update. Worth the upgrade in rent alone! And WOW! a ruler upgrade too!

    [sarcasm mode off]

    Poor Sketchup users.
    Yeah that's just ridiculous and the blog post is written like they lost their marbles. I guess they will get their fair amount of sh..storm.

  7. #7
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
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    Subscriptions are not inherently bad. If well-implemented, they can be beneficial to development and to users. Substance offered a perpetual license after the user had paid for a year's subscription. Even a free program like Blender offers subscriptions.

    You are correct that software activation after a developer shuts down is a major concern. The Adobe CS2 situation was hilarious. At least they remained in business to offer unlocked software after their licensing servers were pulled.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marander View Post
    Then I considered Octane 4 with a dongle - LOL you need to verify and update your dongle every couple of months. What a pile of &@!# software.
    Totally agree with that. I'm glad someone finally called Octane out, the paper tiger. Their so-called "all you can eat" licenses are more like "all you can choke on" licenses in my view.

    Well Modo with its online activation licensing system is not much different from subscription (except you pay once) because you can not do a single thing without Foundry giving you permission.
    Those with the previous offline Modo license are pretty lucky. Foundry could always rename their baby Modeler: The Second Coming and donate to Newtek if they want...

  9. #9
    Marander, as I said, your view is not uncommon among a lot of indie artists. However, I suspect you're not the target audience of some of these apps moving to a subscription service. And I think you're mistaken about the cost of perpetual vs subscription services in a lot of cases so saying it's not feasible for Indie artists or hobbyists isn't always the case. In Modo's case, you would have to buy and maintain a perpetual license for something like 6 to 7 years before you would beat the cost of subscription in that same length of time . It's similar with Adobe, $600 a year for all of their apps vs what it was before for what, $2500-$3,000 for the creative suite? In some cases (and I know this was true for me) I was able to afford software that I would have never otherwise been able to under a perpetual license.


    as far as what you read about the Modo licensing system, yes there have been hiccups, it is a new system, but its not as common as people would have you believe. And people do have the option of an offline license any time they want, all you have to do is write support and ask that you be switched over to a DRM license.


    The good news is for users like yourself that have taken a hardline stance on subscriptions isthat LW will never go to subscription.

  10. #10
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    @hrgiger

    Yes, you're right, there are subscriptions that are more reasonable than others. Adobe offers good value for the price. What's missing is a PS + AI + AE bundle for a good price in my opinon. The new VUE Professional (that you need in order to export) on the other hand for $79 a month is just greedy in my opinion.

    But with LightWave, Cinema, Affinity, Photoline, Corel Apps, Vue, Terragen, Gaea World Machine, Geoglyph, Substance + Vray (current versions), tons of plugins and the amazing Blackmagic Design software I have a giant package of perpetual software of which I can hardly ever use to its full potential. Not to forget the free software like Blender, Krita or Inkscape.

    Too bad for Modo indeed - such a good software - with its online activation and I agree that it probably only single occurrences when it didn't work and not an issue for many users. For myself I just don't want my workstations to be online. Never say never but I also don't think LW will ever go rental or online activation only.

  11. #11
    Plays with fire sadkkf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hrgiger View Post
    Marander, as I said, your view is not uncommon among a lot of indie artists. However, I suspect you're not the target audience of some of these apps moving to a subscription service. And I think you're mistaken about the cost of perpetual vs subscription services in a lot of cases so saying it's not feasible for Indie artists or hobbyists isn't always the case. In Modo's case, you would have to buy and maintain a perpetual license for something like 6 to 7 years before you would beat the cost of subscription in that same length of time . It's similar with Adobe, $600 a year for all of their apps vs what it was before for what, $2500-$3,000 for the creative suite? In some cases (and I know this was true for me) I was able to afford software that I would have never otherwise been able to under a perpetual license.


    as far as what you read about the Modo licensing system, yes there have been hiccups, it is a new system, but its not as common as people would have you believe. And people do have the option of an offline license any time they want, all you have to do is write support and ask that you be switched over to a DRM license.


    The good news is for users like yourself that have taken a hardline stance on subscriptions isthat LW will never go to subscription.

    I think your numbers are off. Last Adobe upgrade I made was to CS6 Master collection for ~$800. If I'd subscribed since that same time, I would have paid more than $6000.

    I know some people appreciate the rental model, but for me it's way too expensive and I like knowing I can still open my files without having to pay Adobe for the software to do so.


    Edit: Looks like I didn't upgrade to CS6 10 years ago, but 7 years ago, which means I would have paid $4200, not $6000. Still, that's 4x what I paid for the perpetual license.
    Last edited by sadkkf; 02-07-2019 at 12:24 PM.
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  12. #12
    That's not what I recall the bundle price being Sadkkf. Your $800 price makes no sense, especially when Photoshop alone sold for $600 by itself. Unless you got some student pricing or something or it was an upgrade (which you would then have to consider the original purchase price), that is not what the creative bundle was selling for.


    EDIT: Here's this article which shows that you could buy the standard CS 6 design suite for $1299 and the master collection for $2599. https://mashable.com/2012/04/23/adob.../#omlrvFoQRGqx
    Last edited by hrgiger; 02-07-2019 at 12:57 PM.

  13. #13
    Super Member Chris S. (Fez)'s Avatar
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    They had deals. Like 1800 bucks to upgrade from Photoshop to the suite was about the best I saw but that was a firesale toward the end. I hate subscription but not having to pay a lump sum is huge for indy artists and small businesses.

  14. #14
    Plays with fire sadkkf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hrgiger View Post
    That's not what I recall the bundle price being Sadkkf. Your $800 price makes no sense, especially when Photoshop alone sold for $600 by itself. Unless you got some student pricing or something or it was an upgrade (which you would then have to consider the original purchase price), that is not what the creative bundle was selling for.


    EDIT: Here's this article which shows that you could buy the standard CS 6 design suite for $1299 and the master collection for $2599. https://mashable.com/2012/04/23/adob.../#omlrvFoQRGqx


    Mine was an upgrade, not a full license. At the time I had a Design suite of some kind with a separate license for AE and I recall it being cheaper to upgrade to the MC than the others individually.

    Even if I paid twice that, it would still be cheaper than renting it over the same 7 years.

    For reference, here's an article about pricing that shows $900 for an upgrade to MC. https://www.cnet.com/news/adobe-has-...grade-pricing/
    Last edited by sadkkf; 02-07-2019 at 01:24 PM.
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  15. #15
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
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    There's a misconception that the indie or SMB market is different from the wealth of the corporate world. My employer (very corporate, certainly not indie) has settled on CS6. For the work we do, I know we are not missing anything in CC.

    The CC customer is not leasing software. They're just funding corporate buyouts of Magento, Marketo, Allegorithmic...

    As more software development companies move to subscription, they're not just finding a model for steady revenue. They're developing an audience that makes them valuable for corporate buyouts.
    LW7.5D, 2015, 2018, 2019 running portably on a USB drive on an Amiga 2500 running Wine.

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