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Thread: LightWave 3D« 2019 is Now Available - Official Discussion Thread

  1. #391
    Not so newbie member lardbros's Avatar
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    The standard material still exists, but you'd have to rewrite the importers to work with the new systems.

    Backward compatibility is impossible for PBR materials back to how LightWave used to do things. It's the same in 3ds Max now it has Arnold.
    No converters do a conversion from Standard 3ds Max shaders to the new PBR or Physical materials... You can write your own though.

    It would be cool if someone just took it on board and wrote a converter that did the materials, but I don't think it's something that's overly easy to do. I for one won't ever go back to LightWave 2015.
    Bringing models over to 2018 or 2019 is fairly easy with the rmb menu in the surface editor though.
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  2. #392
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scross View Post
    Wouldn't NewTek want to assure backwards compatibility?
    Isn't that why there is an export option for LWO2 (2015)?

    What are folks that have importers based upon this format to do?
    Use the object they exported and try to re-shade it as good as they can, you can┤t apply any type of lw 2015 shaders, in 2018-2019, since they are not there...the standard material (which is a different thing) is still there if you apply it
    on to the object, so that shouldn┤t be much of a difference.

    In short..if you need to export an object made in 2019 to 2015, with standard materials..you can do that..but don┤t expect being able to export any shaders that aren┤t there, you have to set that up once you import it to
    lw 2015.

    I do not see much of a problem here, if you want pbr materials, you use 2019, if you want shaders from 2015..and thus need to export from 2019, you use standard materials when you export to lwo2 2015 versions, and then fiddle with the lw shaders needed.

  3. #393
    Personally I just wish more third parties like 3D-Coat and HitFilm would update to accept LWO3. It's a real pain having to export as LWO2 every time I want to open it in another program.
    Last edited by Philbert; 09-25-2019 at 06:48 PM.
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  4. #394
    Axes grinder- Dongle #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by SBowie View Post
    Funny this comes up this morning. Just last evening I discussed this with someone in senior management. Here is part of my email:

    "I’ve often thought that the arcane knowledge required in some domains had lagged somewhat deliberately, having as much to do with job security as real demands of the field. Imagining that this sort of ‘guild’ approach can continue indefinitely in this new millennium is usually going to be a mistake.

    Most of the upcoming generation have the attention span of a flea on amphetamines, and no patience with documentation. They’ve become accustomed to UI conventions from the cradle, and quickly become frustrated with the unfamiliar, complex or tedious. You’d best have a very good reason for not following standard Microsoft or Adobe practice; simply because you’ve got a better way is not good enough. Nor is the fact that making the presentation of a feature simpler, more intuitive, will take a little extra engineering time."

    A salute, then, from one curmudgeon to another.
    Blender.org TRIED to buck the "LMB Select" train.... they've finally thrown in that towel, thank god.

    But watching them contort themselves into pretzels to try to justify an obviously unpopular UI mechanic was reminiscent of watching SONY pushing Beta.

    I think they didn't really GET how painful it was to users to try to put aside decades of muscle memory.
    They only call it 'class warfare' when we fight back.
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  5. #395
    The first thing I did whenever installing blender was change the Select button to LMB. And then of course add the LWO importer.
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  6. #396
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philbert View Post
    The first thing I did whenever installing blender was change the Select button to LMB. And then of course add the LWO importer.
    Same here.

  7. #397
    Oh yeah and change the rotation to turntable. I know not everyone loves that but the trackball method drives me crazy. I with I could make Modeler use turntable when I Alt+Drag in Perspective.
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  8. #398
    Registered User scross's Avatar
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    "It would be cool if someone just took it on board and wrote a converter that did the materials, but I don't think it's something that's overly easy to do."

    What would be cool, would have been if NewTek simply kept the LWO2 (2015) format just as it was.
    But instead, it appears that they have denigrated the format in an effort to force the adoption the new LWO3 format.
    Last edited by scross; 09-26-2019 at 02:13 PM.

  9. #399
    Quote Originally Posted by scross View Post
    What would be cool, would have been if NewTek simply kept the LWO2 (2015) format just as it was.
    But instead, it appears that they have denigrated the format in an effort to force the adoption the new LWO3 format.
    They have kept LWO2 just as it was. And they updated it to eliminate all the roadblocks that it was causing and so now we have a new and improved LWO3 format that is perfectly happy reading LWO2 objects. You make it sound as if they changed it for change sake. There were massive limits with LWO2 that are no longer there not only from a user perspective (node limits etc.) but from development as well. This change allows progress. It's a good change.
    Last edited by Tim Parsons; 09-26-2019 at 12:50 PM.
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  10. #400
    Registered User scross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    Use the object they exported and try to re-shade it as good as they can, you can┤t apply any type of lw 2015 shaders, in 2018-2019, since they are not there...the standard material (which is a different thing) is still there if you apply it
    on to the object, so that shouldn┤t be much of a difference.

    In short..if you need to export an object made in 2019 to 2015, with standard materials..you can do that..but don┤t expect being able to export any shaders that aren┤t there, you have to set that up once you import it to
    lw 2015.

    I do not see much of a problem here, if you want pbr materials, you use 2019, if you want shaders from 2015..and thus need to export from 2019, you use standard materials when you export to lwo2 2015 versions, and then fiddle with the lw shaders needed.
    The file large that I have in LW 11.6.3, when imported into LW 2019.1.3, loads just fine.
    All of the materials and textures are present.
    The materials are all set to the Standard material type.

    It appears that the Standard material used in LW 2019.1.3 equates to the material used in LW 11.6.3?

    But it sounds like you're saying that it's not.

    So, how is it different?

  11. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by scross View Post
    It appears that the Standard material used in LW 2019.1.3 equates to the material used in LW 11.6.3? So, how is it different?
    Yes they are for the most part, but if you hit render they will look different - in come cases close, but not the same. What's different is the render engine. The shading aspect of applications go hand in hand with the rendering engine - change one or the other and you need to change the other generally speaking.
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  12. #402
    Registered User scross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Parsons View Post
    Yes they are for the most part, but if you hit render they will look different - in come cases close, but not the same. What's different is the render engine. The shading aspect of applications go hand in hand with the rendering engine - change one or the other and you need to change the other generally speaking.
    Rendering is not a concern.
    I use Modeler and not Layout.
    So, whats the render engine got to do with saving out a compatible LWO2 file?

  13. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by scross View Post
    Rendering is not a concern.
    I use Modeler and not Layout.
    So, whats the render engine got to do with saving out a compatible LWO2 file?
    Well LW is a modeling and rendering package. And with 2018-19 you can save a compatible LWO2 object, but it will be stripped of any shading data. I think that's been mentioned. Even Photoshop will have issues if you save a PSD in CC2019 and expect to load it into CS2. That's just the way it is - they make underlying improvements.
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