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Thread: LightWave Suggestions and Speculations

  1. #61
    The problem with talk focused only on the current product, it completely ignores land standing customer complaints about problems they have been experiencing for years and imo creates more angst. It also is what drives people to other solutions that are either providing those solutions today, or talking about where it is looking to solve those problems in the future.

    And in my view, not talking about future releases or what development may or may not be working on, its pretty much what has led to the largest amount of speculation on these forums and elsewhere. When people don't know anything or are pretty much starved of information like they were in the two years leading up to the LW 2018 release, they start to speculate. The two years prior to LW 2018 fueled the greatest speculation fest that I have seen in the 18 years since I bought my first copy of LW in 2000.

  2. #62
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    On the other hand, talking about what is, rather than what might be, is naturally more inclined to being accurate. Frankly, as time has shown repeatedly, damned if you do, damned if you don't ... the latter seems less likely to raise accusations of deliberately misleading anyone.
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  3. #63

    crossing fingers, and no matter what, 3D is here to stay, LightWave or not.

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  4. #64
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    You can't fall back on something you've never done. LightWave has been stuck for decades in a conversation that virtually completely ignores the current product and is always about what is coming next and when, and the community has always been just fraught with angst. NewTek was at fault for fostering much of that focus, and isn't going to foster that any more.
    Hmm, I can think a few quarter-or-longer periods where the communication we received as customers was quite similar to what you're describing -- in those extended "silent periods", there was very little forum presence by Newtek at all, and certainly no substantial forward-looking discussion of LW by Newtek staff. Meanwhile, other channels (such as the newsletter) continued cranking out articles about third-party development, tutorial content, customer profiles, and so forth. One such period occurred not long after the Core cancel, another after the Ikeda departure. Yet another began shortly after Rob's departure, but I'm guessing that's due to the adoption of the current policy in question.

    In terms of the types of content received by customers, how has/will what you're describing as current policy yield substantively different results from what customers received during the prior extended "silent periods"?
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.5 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),64GB RAM, NV 980ti

  5. #65

    a quarterly development update would be nice, or even half-year.

    but honestly i don't care all that much anymore. the proof is in the pudding
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  6. #66
    NewTek Social Media Chuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwiede View Post
    Hmm, I can think a few quarter-or-longer periods where the communication we received as customers was quite similar to what you're describing -- in those extended "silent periods", there was very little forum presence by Newtek at all, and certainly no substantial forward-looking discussion of LW by Newtek staff. Meanwhile, other channels (such as the newsletter) continued cranking out articles about third-party development, tutorial content, customer profiles, and so forth. One such period occurred not long after the Core cancel, another after the Ikeda departure. Yet another began shortly after Rob's departure, but I'm guessing that's due to the adoption of the current policy in question.

    In terms of the types of content received by customers, how has/will what you're describing as current policy yield substantively different results from what customers received during the prior extended "silent periods"?
    For starts, no silence. We're here and engaging, but about the current available product. Also, there were not regular maintenance releases during the long silence, like the 7 and a drop-in hotfix that followed 2018.0.

    Re HRGiger's comment that such conversation ignores long-standing customer complaints - no, really not. The team is always working bug reports and evaluating feature requests, and there will be times we'll comment directly to confirm we are aware, ask for more info, and yes, even sometimes let folks know if a fix is coming up in the imminent patch, etc. Getting any further ahead than that has not ever been productive, and a stream-of-consciousness from development actually does not help you get more done today with LightWave 3D. Nor does it help development to get more done with LightWave, when it comes to that.
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    Please note that any statements regarding future product development are forward looking and subject to change without notice.

  7. #67
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SBowie View Post
    On the other hand, talking about what is, rather than what might be, is naturally more inclined to being accurate. Frankly, as time has shown repeatedly, damned if you do, damned if you don't ... the latter seems less likely to raise accusations of deliberately misleading anyone.
    If customers feeling they've been misled about product plans and roadmaps represents such a serious problem, that's generally a symptom of a larger problem around not meeting customers expectations (stemming either from setting unclear/unrealistic expectations, or simply failing to reliably deliver).

    Just taking away all forward-looking product discussions is unlikely to address the core problem in such a case, nor provide any significant long-term improvement in product fortunes. In fact, if anything, that approach is likely to magnify the problem, because the company is no longer participating in customer expectation-setting whatsoever. That approach allows the company to deny any accountability for customer expectations, sure, but doing so does nothing to improve customer satisfaction, nor will it improve the company's accuracy at consistent, reliable planning and delivery.
    Last edited by jwiede; 01-15-2019 at 07:00 PM.
    John W.
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  8. #68
    Axes grinder- Dongle #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Parsons View Post
    Why not have or get somebody to do that now?
    $$$$$

    +++

    If LWG needs a target for their money, I suggest they could do worse than shoveling some towards Mark Warner: his techniques and tutorials are innovative, interesting and of high quality.

    Not that he asked me: just sayin'.
    Last edited by jeric_synergy; 01-15-2019 at 06:30 PM.
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  9. #69
    Super Member Chris S. (Fez)'s Avatar
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    Autodesk does not make forward-looking statements either. Seems we have a Thanos situation: "Dread it, run from it, destiny arrives all the same."

  10. #70
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwiede View Post
    That approach allows the company to deny any accountability for customer expectations, sure, but doing so does nothing to improve customer satisfaction, nor will it improve the company's accuracy at consistent, reliable planning and delivery.
    Did someone say it would? On the other hand, the alternative didn't improve customer satisfaction either. It's been clearly demonstrated that opening up that discussion is a can of worms. Not going to happen, nor much point in arguing about it.
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  11. #71
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    yeah, wasting your time.

  12. #72
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SBowie View Post
    Not going to happen, nor much point in arguing about it.
    Message received, thanks.
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.5 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),64GB RAM, NV 980ti

  13. #73
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gar26lw View Post
    yeah, wasting your time.
    Entirely, it appears.
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.5 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),64GB RAM, NV 980ti

  14. #74

    NewTek has always gone their own way about it, and will continue to do so, no one can change that.
    we've had hundreds of similar discussions before. (Giger, Me, and others trying to receive more info)

    so, like with many other apps, customers just have to wait and see...

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  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by erikals View Post
    NewTek has always gone their own way about it, and will continue to do so, no one can change that.
    we've had hundreds of similar discussions before. (Giger, Me, and others trying to receive more info)

    so, like with many other apps, customers just have to wait and see...


    For me it was never about receiving more info, well, not really(obviously I liked seeing info as much as the next person and it is a type of interaction). It was about engaging your customer base, marketing the product, doing presentations, tutorials (and not just taking what your users may contribute) especially when you don't have a regular release schedule like most every single other app out there (Autodesk, Foundry, Sidefx) Blender is the other odd man out but then again, they have no problem in showing people what they're working on so when it will be out has been prioritized less than what will be coming out eventually. Don't know what forward looking statements Autodesk currently engages in, but when I was following more closely, I always signed up for their webinars where they were talking about things they were working on and gave people a chance to vote or add their input.
    It became clear to me after a while that either NT wasn't interested in selling/promoting LW or they simply lacked the basic belief that it was necessary to do so.

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