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Thread: Help me identify where a multi-NDI source low FPS issue is coming from

  1. #1
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    Exclamation Help me identify where a multi-NDI source low FPS issue is coming from

    hello all! I have been a big proponent of NDI but I have continuously run into an issue where when i try to stream our LAN parties and have multiple input sources from different computers (5-6 total), none of them seem to hit the OBS streaming computer smoothly. So here's the setup:

    https://imgur.com/a/8LurCJr
    That picture represents the living room of my house with 8 gamers. 4-5 of them have NDI output enabled at 1280x720 30fps in OBS. Sometimes there are 3-4 more computers off to the side (not pictured).

    Here us a room layout diagram:
    https://imgur.com/a/3G7a3LV

    now, here is the resulting stream:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1jNLwmpchY

    If you skip around in the stream, you'll see that it isn't exactly performing smoothly...except for that overhead cam shot. That overhead cam shot is my microsoft surface book's webcam outputting via NDI, over wireless AC wifi. So it isn't going thru either switch in the room, but rather wirelessly via wifi directly to the main router/switch i have in that side room.

    My computer was outputting my OBS over NDI the traditional way, but i also set a filter for the webcam, desktop audio, and microphone so they can have their own scene on the streaming PC seperate from my main OBS window. The result of this: the feed on the streaming PC from OBS NDI ran mcuh worse than everyone else who simply just enabled NDI then minimized their OBS and forgot about it. Every PC in the room is pretty high end, with mine being a 6-core/12-thread Xeon E5-1650v2 at 4.5ghz and most everyone else having a 6700k, 7700k, Ryzen 5, or 8700k. My Surface Book was set on an upper ledge my living room has, with the webcam pointing down at us for an overhead shot.

    The streaming PC is USUALLY a system with a 4c/8t Xeon E5-1620 and 8gb ram. For this specific stream though, it was a Ryzen 2700 8-core with 16gb ram. Didn't seem to help all that much, i thought it would.

    So what could i do to improve the smoothness of the NDI sources? Is my main gigabit switch not a good enough one? Too much bandwidth for it to properly handle? Its a Zyxel GS1100-16 : https://www.zyxel.com/us/en/products...GS1100-Series/

    Is my stream PC not being directly connected into the same switch as most the other computers part of the problem? The surface book'a webcam seems perfectly smooth (towards the end of the YouTube video stream linked above, especially, since people patching early on would screw things up) and it isn't going thru the main switch...
    Currently the stream PC gets it's own port on the router/modem (Asus rt-68u I think), and the switch in the main LAN room gets it's own port (obviously) from one of then open ones on the Asus router/switch. Could this config be causing some sort of bottleneck?

    any help would be greatly appreciated, thank you.



    I started a thread over on reddit at the same time i meant to start this one (had to wait for authorization) hoping to get some help and there was a lot of info shared there too if you want to check it out. Info there seemed to point to needing better networking devices, including a 10g link on the encoding PC.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Twitch/comm...ource_low_fps/

  2. #2
    Are all of the computer NDI signals being feed into the streaming PC at the same time?

    Is it smooth when a single computer outputs via NDI? If so, how many computer does it take before it starts having problems?

    Have you tried using other screen capture software to see if that improves performance? Like NDI Scan Converter included with NDI Tools 3.6?
    Kane Peterson
    Solutions Architect
    NewTek, Inc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kanep View Post
    Are all of the computer NDI signals being feed into the streaming PC at the same time?

    Is it smooth when a single computer outputs via NDI? If so, how many computer does it take before it starts having problems?

    Have you tried using other screen capture software to see if that improves performance? Like NDI Scan Converter included with NDI Tools 3.6?
    Yes all of them are sending at the same time. Its hard to tell at which point it no longer is smooth since when i've set it up, it was all rapidly. However, I have run 3 total systems on a single switch (2 gaming PCs + one streaming PC) without issue, but this switch wasn't the one i use for my LAN parties. Haven't been able to test tools like NDI Scan Converter either unfortunately as during the LAN party setup, i don't really have time to sit down and troubleshoot/install software on other people's computers.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Helgaiden View Post
    Yes all of them are sending at the same time. Its hard to tell at which point it no longer is smooth since when i've set it up, it was all rapidly. However, I have run 3 total systems on a single switch (2 gaming PCs + one streaming PC) without issue, but this switch wasn't the one i use for my LAN parties. Haven't been able to test tools like NDI Scan Converter either unfortunately as during the LAN party setup, i don't really have time to sit down and troubleshoot/install software on other people's computers.
    Time and troubleshooting is what is will take to work out where the performance issue is coming from. I know it stinks, but I'd start with one system and add one at a time to see when things have problem. If it is okay with single system but has issue as you add more, it most likely is a network issue. If you have issues even when working with a single system, then it sounds like a problem with a computer.
    Kane Peterson
    Solutions Architect
    NewTek, Inc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kanep View Post
    Time and troubleshooting is what is will take to work out where the performance issue is coming from. I know it stinks, but I'd start with one system and add one at a time to see when things have problem. If it is okay with single system but has issue as you add more, it most likely is a network issue. If you have issues even when working with a single system, then it sounds like a problem with a computer.
    Well I guess I'll try my best in another 3 months when we do our next LAN party

  6. #6
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    I would launch resource monitor on your streaming Pc and check your network utilization of your Nic. My guess is that you are pegging your Nic between 90-95%.
    Zane Condren
    Senior Integrated Production Specialist

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zane Condren View Post
    I would launch resource monitor on your streaming Pc and check your network utilization of your Nic. My guess is that you are pegging your Nic between 90-95%.
    In my usual setup, it uses around 100-125mbps bandwidth but thats just with the one main NDI output, but during the LAN party i wasn't able to check this. Just too much going on.
    Adding a filter for dedicated NDI output on the devices i previously mentioned, does that create an entire full new NDI output? Like each one is sending out around 100mbps more-or-less so each dedicated one i add further loads down the NIC/switch? It wasn't very clear to me if it just tries to sort of "package" it into the main output or it just creates "more main outputs" so to say.

    Is there an ideal setup/network setup/physical configuration you all would recommend based on the information in the first post/reddit thread?

  8. #8
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    Make sure the network of each connected PC is set to WORK or PRIVATE - when set to PUBLIC, don't expect much out of NDI, doesn't barely work

    Thanks

    Jeff
    Jeff Pulera
    Streaming Broadcast Solutions - Newtek Elite

    TriCasters: Mini with AE, TC1
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