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Thread: What's next for Lightwave

  1. #16
    Registered User ianr's Avatar
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    Lightwiki posts are being visited by devs, even this week, one saying

    'yeph that's been fixed & will be in the next point release.'

    Gotta be a good thang,U 'all.

    also: https://www.3dartistonline.com/news/...-new-features/

  2. #17
    Super Member Snosrap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hypersuperduper View Post
    I really get the sense that they are actively working hard on fixing the specific issues that affect me as a user if I report them.
    No question. Of course a lot of that is the result of a bug reporting feedback agent that actually works. Kudos to them for that.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianr View Post
    Lightwiki posts are being visited by devs, even this week, one saying

    'yeph that's been fixed & will be in the next point release.'

    Gotta be a good thang,U 'all.

    also: https://www.3dartistonline.com/news/...-new-features/
    notice the first comment to that feature

  4. #19
    Super Member Chris S. (Fez)'s Avatar
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    Meh. Blender trolls post anywhere and everywhere they can. Modo. Max. C4D. No forum is immune.

  5. #20
    Registered User Wickedpup's Avatar
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    The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wickedpup View Post
    The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI
    what he says is correct. lightwave needs the ui, workflow, scene loading/reference and modelling tools updated. it’s a fair review. it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but it’s doing nobody any good to ignore it.

  7. #22
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    I think there are far more workflow changes than he acknowledges. Applying Modifiers and properties on a mass scale is VASTLY improved for example and he just clicked right past it saying “same as before” Why write a review when you just putz around in the demo scenes in the trial version? Who is the intended audience? People who can’t be bothered to play around with the trial version themselves?

  8. #23
    Engineer/Entrepreneur Sekhar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gar26lw View Post
    what he says is correct. lightwave needs the ui, workflow, scene loading/reference and modelling tools updated. it’s a fair review. it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but it’s doing nobody any good to ignore it.
    I actually thought it was unfair...and dismissive. Saying stuff like "There is (sic) no new features really, except for some render improvements and a few quality of life things and some view port things" is rather glib and doesn't earn you any credibility points. By all means we should point out what's missing, but we need think and put ourselves in the developers' (and NewTek's) position before mouthing off. By far the biggest MEH is coming from the crowd that wants modeler/layout integration, it seems...anything short of that won't satisfy them.

    NT: I suggest opening a sticky thread inviting input on new features. I think you had something like that a while back, it'd be a great way IMO to make this constructive.

  9. #24
    Dreamer Ztreem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wickedpup View Post
    The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI
    I feel that this is quite a fair review even if he passes a few of the new features. The point is that LW needs to go over the whole structure of UI and workflows of all the old features and not just add new ones. But this is my view and if you feel different then thats OK and you will still use and enjoy LW, good for you.

    I look at it this way, I always thought that NT and I had the same vision for LW, a unified app with a modern UI with fast workflows and nice features. I just realised that maybe we don’t have the same vision of future Lw, and that is OK. As they never say what is coming and all new versions is lacking any evidence of progress of features that actually help you do the daily work effective besides rendering. I feel that too much is missing and the workflows are too clicky and cumbersome to be effective... its time to move on. Its not NT or LW that is the problem here, its me. I took for granted that we had the same future vision without even asking NT about it. Feels good when I realised this... Now back to explore the other wonderful world of a unified app.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sekhar View Post
    NT: I suggest opening a sticky thread inviting input on new features. I think you had something like that a while back, it'd be a great way IMO to make this constructive.
    did you ever see the multitude of feature request threads on here. bevel for instance. bucket loads of good ideas and examples on improving ui, workflow, tools. what’s happened? seen a better bevel tool ? how about edge rounding? uv’s?
    someone wrote an epic rant about this on another forum, regarding the focus on a pathtracer. it was quite amusing but at the same time, so disappointing given the time period all these requests and threads have ran over.

    it’s worth a shot but like buying a lottery ticket. i hope finally, nt will listen to its users and put in what they request.
    there’s some evidence of that now so i remain positive. most of what is requested is in modo. luxology listened and put in a lot of great stuff, newtek should mimic them, if they can get past the chip on the shoulder

    i get the feeling that when someone says, hey maya has this great feature, can we get that, nt looks the other way and thinks, no way! we don’t want to be maya, to the detriment of the ui, feature set, workflow etc. consequently new users will not adopt it.

    even as a very keen long term lw user and enthusiast i personally find it extremely hard to justify using it, even with the new renderer. as Ztreem said, it’s gotten very clicky and the dropping of simple fast ways of setting up things in favour of nodes has slowed it down.
    i feel they fixed what wasn’t broken in 2015 and destroyed the speed of use.
    if you use the menus you will probably observe that the ui and ux need someone who actually uses the program a lot to give input and explain why and how things should be laid out and tidied up.
    just look at the object properties panel or the strang changes to the backdrop image section. the lack of fast setup and management of nodes and surfaces. reduction in ease of mass edit changes in the surfacing panel.
    removal of shaders, so scene wide surfacing is out with no shadermiester.
    it really is time to put all effort into the rest of the program. as bugzilla says, perhaps their objective now is to make a renderer and expect all work to be done elsewhere but imho, it will kill it slowly over time through user attrition.

    this is why we as users need a roadmap. so we can see if our needs and objectives for our 3d businesses align with nt way of thinking and plans for lw dev. without it, we must assume they do not.

    as i said, it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but it’s doing nobody any good to ignore it. i want to keep using lw and be able to get others to adopt it but without end user feature requests being implemented and things added that won’t happen.

    example - add maya nav. i know most at my work just wont touch it without that basic feature. it’s an easy first stumbling block to fix that’s blocking uptake in new users minds.
    they don’t seem to want to add it. it does not compute in my mind

    imho nt need to stop listening to the fanboys and start listening to the rest, who are the majority.
    Last edited by gar26lw; 02-03-2018 at 09:04 PM.

  11. #26
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    Which one should i take more serious? Ryan Roy with tools and top-notch tutorials and projects or Bugzila from nowhere with wonderful art gallery?

    LoL the answer is obvious.

    Time for me to unsubscribe from this thread and wish you all a warm and lengthy discussion.

    Thanks everybody.

  12. #27
    Super Member vncnt's Avatar
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    Reading all this I wonder, should we learn to think like a developer in order to ask the right questions?
    Shouldn't we describe our problems (and let the program designers come up with solutions that they can offer) and specify the weight of our problems (to determine profit vs priority).

    Examples:

    - "We need a modern user interface" vs "I keep updating render parameters when I only have the intention to switch between preview and final render quality, even in VPR mode: 10% loss of my time"

    - "Unification asap please" vs "Adjusting weight maps without having realtime feedback keeps me busy for 15% of my time."

    When "nothing" has changed, according to a user, while 75% of the engine has changed, the development team should consider "nothing" as a very good compliment.

  13. #28
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farhad_azer View Post
    Which one should i take more serious? Ryan Roy with tools and top-notch tutorials and projects or Bugzila from nowhere with wonderful art gallery?

    LoL the answer is obvious.

    Time for me to unsubscribe from this thread and wish you all a warm and lengthy discussion.

    Thanks everybody.
    Dont listen to these guys too much..try for yourself and see if Lightwave feels better..In quality. ..speed..workflow...and what you can do with the new stuff.

    One of the guys seem overly positive without any remarks..and makes a living with Lightwave. .and the community who uses it..and one guy made a video saying lw was killed...thus painting himself in a corner of having seen lw back as a zombie....same dead Lightwave. ..but growling a bit different.
    Your gut feeling...check that foremost.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by vncnt View Post
    Reading all this I wonder, should we learn to think like a developer in order to ask the right questions?
    Shouldn't we describe our problems (and let the program designers come up with solutions that they can offer) and specify the weight of our problems (to determine profit vs priority).

    Examples:

    - "We need a modern user interface" vs "I keep updating render parameters when I only have the intention to switch between preview and final render quality, even in VPR mode: 10% loss of my time"

    - "Unification asap please" vs "Adjusting weight maps without having realtime feedback keeps me busy for 15% of my time."

    When "nothing" has changed, according to a user, while 75% of the engine has changed, the development team should consider "nothing" as a very good compliment.
    good idea

  15. #30
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    Youtube reviews in general exist to get views and are as such more troll bait than any sort of nuanced appraisal of the subject. There are exceptions of course but the bugzilla review was not an exception.


    A SERIOUS appraisal of the software would probably come to the conclusion that the product is hit and miss with some new potential but a lot of old shortcomings, more than a few bugs, and a lot of changes that break old workflows. Whether or not the reviewer recommends the software would be based on weighing these factors along with the price.

    A SERIOUS reviewer would at least attempt a small test project with the software instead of just loading up and scrubbing the timeline in the demo content.

    A SERIOUS reviewer would then go on to summarize the good and bad of his experience, and attempt to help the viewer make a purchase decision based on their needs.

    A SERIOUS reviewer does not, based on a half day's piddling around with a trial version, waste everyone's time time making uninformed assumptions as to what the developers strategy is. Is Newteks strategy to make lightwave an output platform for content produced elsewhere? Who knows? I doubt it personally, but i can say one thing for sure: this reviewer absolutely does not know.

    Most importantly, A SERIOUS review would, ultimately, be informative.

    For reference: here is a youtube reviewer who does a good job and actually provides helpful reviews.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TZm6SaoZuc&t=20s
    Last edited by hypersuperduper; 02-04-2018 at 08:50 AM.

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