Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 109

Thread: My thoughts on Lightwave....

  1. #1
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Northern Minnesota
    Posts
    7

    My thoughts on Lightwave....

    Hello Lightwave community. I have not purchased the program yet, I think the decision has been made that I will do so soon, but I have been on the fence for quite some time now. First let me say that CG is just one of many hobbies for me, I don't expect to get a return on my investment. I have worked in a 3D environment for many years on the engineering side of things, mainly with Solidworks and Autocad, and CG has been a pastime for about 20 years as well. I currently use Silo, Zbrush and Hexagon for my geometry mainly.

    The target application for my efforts is mainly Poser (the shame, huh?) Most users of Poser (or Daz) purchase their content ready-made, but I have always made as much of it myself as possible. I make all of the buildings, furniture, and environments myself, and I have recently made my own conforming clothing as well. I bought Zbrush about a year ago, and it is great for a lot of stuff, but in many cases I find it easier to make the base shape in silo first and finish the model in Zbrush. Zbrush is not a program where you would set up a entire scene and render it, it is basically just a modeler. Also, most of the amazing Zbrush images that are out there have very high poly counts. You can make good low poly meshes, but it is a lot more work, and the Zremesher loses a lot of detail the lower you go, so it is hand retopo that is the key. I really have a yearning lately for a more powerful modeler. I have been popping in on the Lightwave site a couple times a year, look around, and check on the price for many years now. Recently, with the current price-point, I am seriously considering it, and I have done a lot of research.

    The first issue, I think, is LW dead or not? Coming in from the outside it is worrisome. I have a long history of investing in software that has died. Truespace died a sudden death, and I believe that Poser is near death at the moment. Then there was Eovia, I bought Carrera, Amapi Pro and Hexagon from them shortly before they went under. Carrera and Hex ended up under Daz control, and withered on vine so to speak. Right Hemisphere croaked shortly after I bought Deep Exploration, Deep Paint and Deep UV. Poser and LW seem to be in a similar situation, a lot of loyal users that are active in the forums, but the future of the software is in doubt. I will probably buy it anyways, a lot of LW users in another post stated they would continue to use LW until hardware/OS issues stopped them. I would would happily join that crowd if I do buy LW.

    The second issue as I see it is LW does not support physically based materials as of yet. I did see a plug-in that could convert them, but that is not so good as having them supported in the software. Poser has had physically based materials for about two years now, since they implemented Blender's Cycles into Poser. I am mainly interested in LW as a modeler though, so it is not a deal breaker. However, when and if I buy LW I will definitely rig, render, animate with it as well. I know that PBR is a promised feature of LWnext, but everyone here knows the situation with that. (That is to say we don't know, actually)

    I was not aware of the fact that LW is split into two separate apps until I really started to research it. I think for me that is OK, I don't know. It depends on how seamless the integration is. I currently use many programs in my workflow, so I don't see myself being too upset about it. I realize that some LW users prefer it that way while others, not so much. More research is required on my part, like actually using the trial, which I am holding off on until after X-mas. When the trial ends I am either buying it or not, so after X-mas would be better timing for me to do that.

    One reason I have been on the fence for so long is the lack of information about the software itself. Granted, the price has kept me away, being I am not a professional and I do have other interests as well. What I am saying is NewTek does not promote the product very well. The LW web page is flashy enough at first glance, but I need to see the software in action to get excited about buying it. When you start to dig into the web site you find some videos of a guy making a box, and spinning a rather plain model of a tricycle around. There is a pretty cool mechanical arachnoid model that is everywhere, but I want to see some hard core modeling action, proving to me that the software is very capable. The videos of making a box and translating stuff should be for people who already bought the program, and need to learn some basics. I was disappointed in the actual promotional content on the web site. I was thinking, I can do this with silo, why would I spend the money on Lightwave? I did see some modeling action on YouTube, and I got a little more excited about Lightwave, but I can see why LW is not attracting a lot more new customers. One thing I picked up on from YouTube and this forum is that LW feels very natural to the people who use it. Hexagon is that way, ten minutes in the first time I used it I had that feeling. I'm starting to feel that way with Zbrush now, a year later, but I was busy all summer doing other stuff, to be fair. I have tried Blender, like everyone else, and that natural feeling is just not there. I don't think it will ever get there either, too many cooks in the kitchen maybe.

    Decisions, decisions, I am wondering if I should wait until LWnext comes out? I will surly want the physically based materials and any other goodies when it does. The price will go up, that is a gimme. In a lot of cases I've found a more cost effective route is to buy the old version first, then upgrade. The price is considerably hacked right now, but if LW does actually die there will certainly be a huge price drop, on it's last gasp. I really hope that does not happen. I have not been a user yet, but I have been a fan for years, and I would be proud to own it.

    So that's my thoughts on Lightwave. I retired a couple years ago, bought a house in a small town on the edge of the wilderness in N Minnesota. It is very cold here in the Winter, and I spend a lot of time indoors doing my CG hobby. I spend some time in the Summer as well, but there is so much stuff to do outdoors here that takes priority. I'm looking at a long Winter and I'm really wanting a more powerful program to make some Sci-Fi with. I don't have a lot of cash to play with, I have to be conservitive, but LW seems to be within reach right now and it is the one program I've wanted for a long time. I have no interest in Autodesk and Blender is just no fun for me. Modo would be nice, but it costs 3X what LW does. Also I have read Modo users comments lately who have switched back to LW because Modo is getting bloated to them, among other reasons. I'm 90% sure that I am sold on getting the program at this point. I want it today, but I have to get some stuff for those Grandkids for X-mas, or I would just not feel right, so I'm waiting until January most likely. I would be interested to hear the thoughts from LW users, pro and con, about the topic. Maybe some of you could push me off of that fence I've been on one way or the other. Thanks!
    Last edited by Chuck; 12-11-2017 at 12:28 PM. Reason: added line spaces for readability

  2. #2
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    sweden stockholm
    Posts
    15,124
    I need to qoute every single word from you here, someday and I wonīt include the blank spaces
    I think you should go back and enter some paragraphs between the sentences, to make it easier to read.

    Mind you, we got loads of similar threads and questions about lightwave being dead etc, I think itīs likely that your thread may be moved in there soon by a moderator.

    My advice, wait til Lightwave next is out, donīt buy a pig in the sack...go with what you got so far, and try out blender for free..since itīs upcoming version will likely rock the boat for some major commercial software providers.
    and also check houdini apprentice, and indie if you find that comforable for you.
    But for now...do not invest in something that isnīt out.

  3. #3
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    587
    Pig in the sack... directly translated Swedish expressions are adorable.

  4. #4
    RETROGRADER prometheus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    sweden stockholm
    Posts
    15,124
    Quote Originally Posted by hypersuperduper View Post
    Pig in the sack... directly translated Swedish expressions are adorable.
    indeed

  5. #5
    Robert Ireland bobakabob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Nottingham UK
    Posts
    2,757
    Quote Originally Posted by ribroast View Post
    Hello Lightwave community. I have not purchased the program yet, I think the decision has been made that I will do so soon, but I have been on the fence for quite some time now. First let me say that CG is just one of many hobbies for me, I don't expect to get a return on my investment. I have worked in a 3D environment for many years on the engineering side of things, mainly with Solidworks and Autocad, and CG has been a pastime for about 20 years as well. I currently use Silo, Zbrush and Hexagon for my geometry mainly. The target application for my efforts is mainly Poser (the shame, huh?) Most users of Poser (or Daz) purchase their content ready-made, but I have always made as much of it myself as possible. I make all of the buildings, furniture, and environments myself, and I have recently made my own conforming clothing as well. I bought Zbrush about a year ago, and it is great for a lot of stuff, but in many cases I find it easier to make the base shape in silo first and finish the model in Zbrush. Zbrush is not a program where you would set up a entire scene and render it, it is basically just a modeler. Also, most of the amazing Zbrush images that are out there have very high poly counts. You can make good low poly meshes, but it is a lot more work, and the Zremesher loses a lot of detail the lower you go, so it is hand retopo that is the key. I really have a yearning lately for a more powerful modeler. I have been popping in on the Lightwave site a couple times a year, look around, and check on the price for many years now. Recently, with the current price-point, I am seriously considering it, and I have done a lot of research.
    The first issue, I think, is LW dead or not? Coming in from the outside it is worrisome. I have a long history of investing in software that has died. Truespace died a sudden death, and I believe that Poser is near death at the moment. Then there was Eovia, I bought Carrera, Amapi Pro and Hexagon from them shortly before they went under. Carrera and Hex ended up under Daz control, and withered on vine so to speak. Right Hemisphere croaked shortly after I bought Deep Exploration, Deep Paint and Deep UV. Poser and LW seem to be in a similar situation, a lot of loyal users that are active in the forums, but the future of the software is in doubt. I will probably buy it anyways, a lot of LW users in another post stated they would continue to use LW until hardware/OS issues stopped them. I would would happily join that crowd if I do buy LW.
    The second issue as I see it is LW does not support physically based materials as of yet. I did see a plug-in that could convert them, but that is not so good as having them supported in the software. Poser has had physically based materials for about two years now, since they implemented Blender's Cycles into Poser. I am mainly interested in LW as a modeler though, so it is not a deal breaker. However, when and if I buy LW I will definitely rig, render, animate with it as well. I know that PBR is a promised feature of LWnext, but everyone here knows the situation with that. (That is to say we don't know, actually)
    I was not aware of the fact that LW is split into two separate apps until I really started to research it. I think for me that is OK, I don't know. It depends on how seamless the integration is. I currently use many programs in my workflow, so I don't see myself being too upset about it. I realize that some LW users prefer it that way while others, not so much. More research is required on my part, like actually using the trial, which I am holding off on until after X-mas. When the trial ends I am either buying it or not, so after X-mas would be better timing for me to do that.
    One reason I have been on the fence for so long is the lack of information about the software itself. Granted, the price has kept me away, being I am not a professional and I do have other interests as well. What I am saying is NewTek does not promote the product very well. The LW web page is flashy enough at first glance, but I need to see the software in action to get excited about buying it. When you start to dig into the web site you find some videos of a guy making a box, and spinning a rather plain model of a tricycle around. There is a pretty cool mechanical arachnoid model that is everywhere, but I want to see some hard core modeling action, proving to me that the software is very capable. The videos of making a box and translating stuff should be for people who already bought the program, and need to learn some basics. I was disappointed in the actual promotional content on the web site. I was thinking, I can do this with silo, why would I spend the money on Lightwave? I did see some modeling action on YouTube, and I got a little more excited about Lightwave, but I can see why LW is not attracting a lot more new customers. One thing I picked up on from YouTube and this forum is that LW feels very natural to the people who use it. Hexagon is that way, ten minutes in the first time I used it I had that feeling. I'm starting to feel that way with Zbrush now, a year later, but I was busy all summer doing other stuff, to be fair. I have tried Blender, like everyone else, and that natural feeling is just not there. I don't think it will ever get there either, too many cooks in the kitchen maybe.
    Decisions, decisions, I am wondering if I should wait until LWnext comes out? I will surly want the physically based materials and any other goodies when it does. The price will go up, that is a gimme. In a lot of cases I've found a more cost effective route is to buy the old version first, then upgrade. The price is considerably hacked right now, but if LW does actually die there will certainly be a huge price drop, on it's last gasp. I really hope that does not happen. I have not been a user yet, but I have been a fan for years, and I would be proud to own it.
    So that's my thoughts on Lightwave. I retired a couple years ago, bought a house in a small town on the edge of the wilderness in N Minnesota. It is very cold here in the Winter, and I spend a lot of time indoors doing my CG hobby. I spend some time in the Summer as well, but there is so much stuff to do outdoors here that takes priority. I'm looking at a long Winter and I'm really wanting a more powerful program to make some Sci-Fi with. I don't have a lot of cash to play with, I have to be conservitive, but LW seems to be within reach right now and it is the one program I've wanted for a long time. I have no interest in Autodesk and Blender is just no fun for me. Modo would be nice, but it costs 3X what LW does. Also I have read Modo users comments lately who have switched back to LW because Modo is getting bloated to them, among other reasons. I'm 90% sure that I am sold on getting the program at this point. I want it today, but I have to get some stuff for those Grandkids for X-mas, or I would just not feel right, so I'm waiting until January most likely. I would be interested to hear the thoughts from LW users, pro and con, about the topic. Maybe some of you could push me off of that fence I've been on one way or the other. Thanks!
    If you invest, you get a very powerful app that enables you to model animate and render. It's non subscription, integrates well with other software, works on W7 and 10 and capable of phenomenol professional results. The renderer alone imho is worth the price of admission.
    Art and photography Flickr site
    Animation, facial rigging, modelling ArtStation
    Assorted animations Robert Ireland

  6. #6
    I certainly would not invest in LightWave until we know that it is not in fact dead and that they have a plan moving forward. We've literally been cut off from any type of communication from LWG since their last blog post in February.

  7. #7
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    6,513
    Quote Originally Posted by bobakabob View Post
    If you invest, you get a very powerful app that enables you to model animate and render. It's non subscription, integrates well with other software, works on W7 and 10 and capable of phenomenol professional results. The renderer alone imho is worth the price of admission.
    There have been reports of issues in W10, incl. UAC conflicts, mouse handling issues, and issues accessing network volumes (often due to "split tokens", a UAC issue). If running Win10, best to try the LW2015 demo and make sure everything important to you works okay before purchase.
    Last edited by jwiede; 11-26-2017 at 05:48 PM.
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.4 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),32GB RAM, NV 980ti

  8. #8
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    587
    If you are concerned about the current pricing, and whether or not it will go up or down I would suggest contacting Lightwave3DGroup, and tell them your concerns about buying into a software that may be dead. They may be able to tell you if the current “limited time” $695 price will remain once the new version is actually announced, but hasn’t been released.

    They won’t tell us when the new version comes out, but that is a question that they might actually answer.

    The mystery surrounding it’s development status notwithstanding, Lightwave is VERY capable, even if it’s modeling tools are a little old fashioned. There is a reason why a lot of us still hang out here when all the cool stuff is happening elsewhere. If you download the demo people on this forum will be happy to help you out with any technical issues you may have.

  9. #9
    Super Member JohnMarchant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Murcia, Spain
    Posts
    3,017
    Quote Originally Posted by jwiede View Post
    There have been reports of issues in W10, incl. UAC conflicts, mouse handling issues, and issues accessing network volumes (often due to "split tokens", a UAC issue). If running Win10, best to try the LW2015 demo and make sure everything important to you works okay before purchase.
    Im runing LW 2015.3, many plugins LWCAD, TFD and a host of others and had no real issues so far with Windows 10.
    Dell XPS 15
    15.6-inch (3840 x 2160) 4K 282ppi IPS LCD
    Intel i7 7700HQ 2.8GHz
    Windows 10 64Bit
    NVidia GeForce GTX 1050 Ti
    1TB SDD
    32Gb Ram

    LightWave 2019.03

    Very nice Laptop

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by hypersuperduper View Post
    If you are concerned about the current pricing, and whether or not it will go up or down I would suggest contacting Lightwave3DGroup, and tell them your concerns about buying into a software that may be dead. They may be able to tell you if the current “limited time” $695 price will remain once the new version is actually announced, but hasn’t been released.

    They won’t tell us when the new version comes out, but that is a question that they might actually answer.

    The mystery surrounding it’s development status notwithstanding, Lightwave is VERY capable, even if it’s modeling tools are a little old fashioned. There is a reason why a lot of us still hang out here when all the cool stuff is happening elsewhere. If you download the demo people on this forum will be happy to help you out with any technical issues you may have.
    They've already announced the pricing a couple years ago. And someone wrote them recently and was told it was the same. http://www.cgchannel.com/2015/09/new...twave-pricing/

  11. #11

    like the rest of us 40+ Wavers, i think you'll be just fine with LightWave Next... when it comes out.



    [cricket-sound...cricket-sound...cricket-sound...]
    LW vidz   DPont donate   LightWiki   RHiggit   IKBooster   My vidz

  12. #12
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    a place
    Posts
    1,855
    do you mean age or that there are 40 of us left? :-p

  13. #13
    Man of many cells. shrox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Eureka, CA
    Posts
    6,962
    Quote Originally Posted by gar26lw View Post
    do you mean age or that there are 40 of us left? :-p
    Us olde guys...
    shrox www.shrox.com
    -----------------------
    Heavy Metal Landing


    -----------------------
    I build the best spaceships, the biggest spaceships, they're great, you'll love them.

  14. #14

    do you mean age or that there are 40 of us left?
    hah, more like 4  :]
    LW vidz   DPont donate   LightWiki   RHiggit   IKBooster   My vidz

  15. #15
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    587
    Quote Originally Posted by hrgiger View Post
    They've already announced the pricing a couple years ago. And someone wrote them recently and was told it was the same. http://www.cgchannel.com/2015/09/new...twave-pricing/
    Yes, but according to those prices someone could save about 200 bucks by buying 2015 now for $695 and upgrading for $295 vs waiting and just buying the new version for $1195. The question is whether a potential buyer can wait until more concrete signs of the new version arrive, such as a release date, and still get that price. Or if the price of 2015 will go back up to $995 at that point. It may be worth asking Newtek.

Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •