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Thread: Is this because I bought junk signal converters?

  1. #1
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    Is this because I bought junk signal converters?



    What could be causing this stuttering?

    I go out of the camera with HDMI to an HDMI-SDI converter. SDI cable about 200ft to an SDI-HDMI converter. HDMI into my PC.

    I'm going down my checklist:

    Did I buy the correct coaxial cable?
    It is RG6 75ohm cable over about a 200ft length.

    I terminated the BNC ends myself, did I do it wrong?
    My understanding of digital signals is that it either works, or it doesn't. There is no range in between right?

    Is it the camera settings?
    OBS auto detects the camera settings and matches them. I also plugged a different camera into the PC directly via HDMI and had no issue.

    Is it the cheapo signal converters?
    I plugged a different camera into the SDI-HDMI box with a 2ft SDI cable and it came thru perfectly.


    So the only thing I can think of is maybe the HDMI-SDI box above the ice? But what are the odds that I got two duds delivered together?

    If that isn't it, what else could I possibly look for?

  2. #2
    Registered User GThomas's Avatar
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    Which signal converters did you buy?
    Gabe Thomas

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    Some stuff off Newegg that doesn't even have a brand name. It came directly from China.
    I just went up there with a different HDMI-SDI converter to test it out and the video does the same exact thing. Our electrician says maybe because we used a short un-grounded extension cord we might be getting interference? That doesn't sound right to me though, considering both feeds are having an identical stutter, and are 190ft apart.

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    There are a lot of potential points of failure in your set-up. You're going to have to systematically isolate and test each one to determine the cause of the problem. Your electrician could possibly be right. Testing it would be as simple as swapping the extension cord, moving closer to power, or using an alternate power source like a UPS.

    Make sure it's not your camera by using a different camera at the end, or by testing your camera with a different shorter connection.

    Test your HDMI cables by connecting your camera with HDMI into an HDMI monitor

    Test your HDMI to SDI converter by connecting the SDI out directly into something that can read an SDI signal (Swapping with different converter you know works is fine)

    Test your SDI cable by connecting an SDI source and SDI monitor on each end, or by using the same set up with different SDI cables (preferably ones you already know work)

    Test your SDI to HDMI converter by plugging in a working SDI source on one end and an HDMI monitor on the other. (Swapping with different converter you know works is fine)

    - - - Updated - - -

    you may also want to consider using an HDMI to Ethernet converter instead of and HDMI to SDI converter.

  5. #5
    Registered User GThomas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by m_covert View Post

    you may also want to consider using an HDMI to Ethernet converter instead of and HDMI to SDI converter.
    Or a Connect Spark for NDI...
    Gabe Thomas

  6. #6
    Registered User Red Dog Records's Avatar
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    It looks like your converters might not be keeping sync.
    Plus, you are running at 60p which is probably the maximum they can handle.

    We use DAC70 converters and they have been rock solid for us for years - we use up to 250ft of SDI (quad shielded, quality cable).
    If you are basically trying to extend your HDMI to your PC (and the application running on your PC can use the NDI signal), then the suggestion of a SPARK running over LAN would be a simple solution. You will need to determine how much latency the SPARK adds to the signal to determine if it will meet your needs.

    Since you already have the SDI cable, I would try getting some better converters and seeing if that solves things.
    We have also used decimators and the Black Magic Designs converters in the past (still have them), but the DAC70 is always our 'go to' model since it simply always works.

    Hope that helps!

    Andrew

    ps - Buy the converters from a retailer that will let you return them if they do not solve your issue.
    Tricaster 460AE3 + LC-11
    Flypack: Router, switch, backup encoders, captioning devices, audio mixer, UPS, etc
    Cameras: Sony Z280, Z150, Spark & Bird Dog converters
    http://reddogrecords.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog Records View Post
    It looks like your converters might not be keeping sync.
    Plus, you are running at 60p which is probably the maximum they can handle.

    We use DAC70 converters and they have been rock solid for us for years - we use up to 250ft of SDI (quad shielded, quality cable).
    If you are basically trying to extend your HDMI to your PC (and the application running on your PC can use the NDI signal), then the suggestion of a SPARK running over LAN would be a simple solution. You will need to determine how much latency the SPARK adds to the signal to determine if it will meet your needs.

    Since you already have the SDI cable, I would try getting some better converters and seeing if that solves things.
    We have also used decimators and the Black Magic Designs converters in the past (still have them), but the DAC70 is always our 'go to' model since it simply always works.

    Hope that helps!

    Andrew

    ps - Buy the converters from a retailer that will let you return them if they do not solve your issue.
    Would LOVE to use SPARK but the budget for this project was basically nil. Which is why I even terminated my own cables instead of buying pre-made SDI cables. As far as converters not keeping sync: is the length of the cable run a factor in this happening? I plugged a different camera into the SDI-HDMI converter with a 2 ft cable and it was fine.

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    You said you tested your same set up with different converters and you still had the same problem, and you tested the converters with a different camera and a shorter SDI cable and the problem was eliminated.

    At this point, you can definitely rule out the converters themselves. (did you test your electrician's theory and run power with a grounded extension chord?)

    You need to test this new(different) camera with the longer cable you terminated yourself. If the new camera eliminates the problem, you know the problem has something to do with your other camera. If it doesn't solve the problem, then that only leaves your 200ft SDI cable.

    At this point, it really looks like your SDI cable is most likely the problem.
    Last edited by m_covert; 10-23-2017 at 06:15 PM.

  9. #9
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    If it's your cable, You might get luck re-terminating the cable, but if you find yourself getting ready to just buy a 200FT SDI cable, consider buying this instead:

    https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Matters...ernet+extender

    The adapters combined with 200Ft of Cat6 are cheaper than a single good quality 200ft SDI cable.

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    My capture card can't handle 1080p60 video.
    When I insert a different camera on the end of the line and send a 720p60 signal through the HDMI-SDI converter, the entire length of the SDI cable, through the SDI-HDMI converter, and into the capture card it works perfectly. When I switch to 1080p it immediately stops functioning.
    Unfortunately, I am unable to change the output settings on the consumer camcorders we purchased (Canon Vixia HF R62). I can change the settings for recording media, but it only defaults to 1080p60 when I do HDMI out.

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    Do you have an HDMI computer monitor?
    Instead of plugging the HDMI signal into your HDMI capture card, try plugging it into an HDMI computer monitor. This will allow you to verify whether or not the 1080p60 video signal is perfectly fine before it gets to your capture card. Even though you've gotten 720p60 video through just fine, there's still a small chance the issue is with your SDI cable. This test will allow you rule that possibility out.

    You should also look at the documentation for your capture card. It should tell you if it is designed to handle 1080p60 or not.

    If your capture card is supposed to be able to handle 1080p60 but your tests confirm that it isn't, the problem might be something else in your computer or computer settings. You might only need to update drivers.

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    What capture card and PC/Mac are you using?

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    It says it can handle 60i but not 60p. Do you know for sure the signal your camera is outputting is progressive and not interlaced? I tried to look online but I can't find that information on your camera. Only that it can record AVCHD in both 1080i60 and 1080p60.

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    Click image for larger version. 

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    All these conversion devices work fine when I run my Sony cam at 720p60 through them, including both a short SDI run and the full 250FT SDI run. Immediately switching to 1080p60 knocks it out which made me certain it was the camera settings.
    Until I plugged my Canon directly into the HDMI Capture Card and it worked.

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