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Thread: Daktronics All-Sport Data Feed

  1. #1
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    Daktronics All-Sport Data Feed

    Does anyone have any experience transporting Daktronics All-Sport data via fiber?

    Not directly via fiber... here's my idea... We have a multiplexer that allows us to plug all of our cameras, mics, etc into a box that sends all the data over to our central production room via fiber and then we split everything back out in the production room. I've had no issues with cameras/ccus, monitors, and mics but I can't seem to pull the feed from the All-Sport. We have rj45 jacks on both ends of the multiplexer to be used for transporting the data. My end goal is to use serial to cat5 converters to pull the feed thru the fiber line (via multiplexer) and then send it into my Tricaster 460. Here is my flow...

    Daktronics All-Sport > serial-cat5 converter > rj45 jack on multiplex > FIBER RUN > cat5-serial > Daktronics All-Sport CG > Serial to USB adapter > Tricaster.

    When the feed hits the multiplex is when it drops. I've tested the rj45 connections on both ends by sending a network connection to the remote site and it works just fine. The only suggestion I've received so far is to try using serial to ethernet instead of serial to cat5.

    Sorry if this is a scattered post, getting to be that time in the day!

    I appreciate any help!

  2. #2
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    Hello.

    There are several ways to achieve this:
    1. Use a dedicated Daktronics fiber converter. We use those on both ends of our fiber runs. Works well. You just need multi mode fiber running between the two sites. Just call Dak support to buy.
    2. Use SportzCast Score Bot. That allows you to convert the All Sport data feed to Ethernet, and is sent up to their servers. You can then retrieve the data feed from anywhere.
    3. You can run the data feed over a dry pair using a null modem.

    What you tried to do is unlikely to work. Maybe if you try to convert the serial feed out of an All Sport CH, but I haven't tried that...

    Does this help?
    Imry

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    Quote Originally Posted by imryh View Post
    Hello.

    There are several ways to achieve this:
    1. Use a dedicated Daktronics fiber converter. We use those on both ends of our fiber runs. Works well. You just need multi mode fiber running between the two sites. Just call Dak support to buy.
    2. Use SportzCast Score Bot. That allows you to convert the All Sport data feed to Ethernet, and is sent up to their servers. You can then retrieve the data feed from anywhere.
    3. You can run the data feed over a dry pair using a null modem.

    What you tried to do is unlikely to work. Maybe if you try to convert the serial feed out of an All Sport CH, but I haven't tried that...

    Does this help?
    Imry
    Thanks for the reply.

    How much does a Score Bot cost?

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    Depending on the use of this there may be some hiccups. Daktronics highly discourages 3rd party products being plugged directly into the AS5000. It can cause issues that may be sporadic. Speaking from experience, we have Stat Crew data that went to our old Stat Boards and when Network TV came in and tried to hook up a third party device, it would interrupt that data from Stat Crew and no data would update. Your best option would to be purchase an All-Sport CG from Dak. I think they run around $1K and will provide you with a serial output that can integrate with LiveText or any other CG software. They also have a video output that can overlay that same data if you are without a CG. You would just need to make sure you have an available J1-J3 outputs available from the AS5000 (1/4 outputs). Dak provides these adapters with the All-Sport CG.

    We had ASN come in with a Score Bot this past year and the only way we would let them hook into the system was through our DSTI TV Feed. With all the different types of interfaces I have seen come through, Score Bot was the only one that would not work with the serial data. I would be a little cautious of purchasing one.

    Just note that if you plan on using any type of dry copper lines you have, you would need two 22 AWG minimum, and the run is suggested to be under 1500 feet before you will get signal loss. You could also output the Serial data from the AS-CG and convert that fiber. Not sure you would need a Dak specific converter for that. I do know that the Dak fiber converters are standard Multimode. If you have single mode you will be paying significantly more as they have only started using single mode recently in MLB stadiums for countdown clocks between at bats, and between innings.
    Last edited by jbins07; 07-07-2017 at 11:39 AM.

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    I think I'd probably try to move the All-Sport CG to the other side of your diagram and then convert serial-ethernet for transport over the fiber. Depending on your multiplexer, it might be expecting ethernet-style traffic on that RJ45 jack rather than just passing along the serial connection. That sounds like that's the case with your testing. I haven't done it with All-Sport data, but I've done long-distance serial camera control and video transmission from our building to remote locations across town using MOXA NPort boxes. https://www.moxa.com/product/NPort_5110.htm

    I'd try this -
    Daktronics All-Sport -> Daktronics All-Sport CG -> Serial to Ethernet -> Fiber Run -> Ethernet to Serial -> Serial to USB adapter -> TriCaster

    That would let you still use everything you've already got in place and know to be working. The new component would be just converting the serial data to ethernet before trying to pipe it down the fiber. I think you are really close and with a few adjustments to your idea it should be possible.

    Kris
    TriCasters: Mini, 410, 460, 850, 850 Extreme, 855 & 8000
    Replay: 3Play 820
    CG: LiveText3 - With LT[Scoreboards]
    Cameras: Sony NX5
    Macros: YoungMonkey MasterControl, Belkin N52

  6. #6
    Registered User ZachSchuster's Avatar
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    Check to see if the controller is wireless. If I recall correctly, the All Sport CG comes in wired or wireless models, but not both. I could be wrong about that, but I seem to recall an old discussion about this and was disappointed it didn't do both.

    But if the controller is wireless, you could put the All Sport CG anywhere in range and then go wired to your LiveText machine.

    ScoreOCR options exist too, but in my experience they are troublesome outdoors on partially cloudy days due to the contrast of the digits against brightly lit scoreboard facing, then overcast lighting, then back to brightly lit, etc... indoors they are exceptional.
    Zach Schuster
    SuiteCG- Sports Scoreboard and Stat Tools
    Tricaster 855/460
    Zeplay Instant Replay
    ScoreOCR
    Sony NX5U

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    Sorry all, should've specified that the fiber run connects our soccer field (across campus) to our central production booth so wireless solutions aren't an option.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kltv View Post
    I think I'd probably try to move the All-Sport CG to the other side of your diagram and then convert serial-ethernet for transport over the fiber. Depending on your multiplexer, it might be expecting ethernet-style traffic on that RJ45 jack rather than just passing along the serial connection. That sounds like that's the case with your testing. I haven't done it with All-Sport data, but I've done long-distance serial camera control and video transmission from our building to remote locations across town using MOXA NPort boxes. https://www.moxa.com/product/NPort_5110.htm

    I'd try this -
    Daktronics All-Sport -> Daktronics All-Sport CG -> Serial to Ethernet -> Fiber Run -> Ethernet to Serial -> Serial to USB adapter -> TriCaster

    That would let you still use everything you've already got in place and know to be working. The new component would be just converting the serial data to ethernet before trying to pipe it down the fiber. I think you are really close and with a few adjustments to your idea it should be possible.

    Kris
    I believe I tried using the All-Sport CG on both ends but I'm going to give it another shot

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    The Score Bot has no issues. Connects to one of the J connections, which are one-directional. Many models available. Ours cost $300, with $300/year for the service.

    You really don't need a DSTI or an All-Sport CG. They would be redundant in your setup, if you use IP transmission for data.

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    Just make sure you are converting to network data, rather than just wiring the serial to the cat5 cable style. Those little MOXA boxes take the serial data and turn it into actual network traffic (with IP addresses and all that) to send down your multiplexed feed. Since you mentioned that a network signal down the fiber works fine, converting the serial data to ethernet and then back to serial on the other end should work fine. You'd need a MOXA box or similar device on either end and the All-Sport CG would still be at the field end of the run. Without those MOXA boxes your multiplexer probably doesn't know what to do with what is coming in since it is expecting ethernet signals. Those MOXA boxes cost about $115 each. http://www.buymoxa.com/product-p/nport%205110.htm

    Kris
    TriCasters: Mini, 410, 460, 850, 850 Extreme, 855 & 8000
    Replay: 3Play 820
    CG: LiveText3 - With LT[Scoreboards]
    Cameras: Sony NX5
    Macros: YoungMonkey MasterControl, Belkin N52

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    Quote Originally Posted by imryh View Post
    The Score Bot has no issues. Connects to one of the J connections, which are one-directional. Many models available. Ours cost $300, with $300/year for the service.

    You really don't need a DSTI or an All-Sport CG. They would be redundant in your setup, if you use IP transmission for data.
    Problem with our situation is all the J outputs are used during basketball games when we have TV, so they have to use the truck dock feed that we provide. That being said, the ScoreBot did not work. First third party device like that I have not seen work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kltv View Post
    Just make sure you are converting to network data, rather than just wiring the serial to the cat5 cable style. Those little MOXA boxes take the serial data and turn it into actual network traffic (with IP addresses and all that) to send down your multiplexed feed. Since you mentioned that a network signal down the fiber works fine, converting the serial data to ethernet and then back to serial on the other end should work fine. You'd need a MOXA box or similar device on either end and the All-Sport CG would still be at the field end of the run. Without those MOXA boxes your multiplexer probably doesn't know what to do with what is coming in since it is expecting ethernet signals. Those MOXA boxes cost about $115 each. http://www.buymoxa.com/product-p/nport%205110.htm

    Kris
    Thanks for the input. Would I need to purchase two of the Moxa boxes or just 1?

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    Another possibility would be to set up a virtual serial port. At your soccer field feed the All Sport CG into a remote computer and identify IP address. On control room side identify computer that will run LiveText. Within whatever virtual serial port program you are using plug in this IP address and you should be able to bring in Data just as if you were connected locally. There are quite a few of these programs available, we haven't tried in a while however but when we did we were successful.

    If the location of the LiveText computer isn't too important you could also leave it at your soccer field and utilize one of the RJ45 jacks on your multiplexer to get on same subnet as control room. You could run TeamViewer or an equivalent program to control remotely from control room and then bring in via NDI.

    Just a few ideas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jbins07 View Post
    Problem with our situation is all the J outputs are used during basketball games when we have TV, so they have to use the truck dock feed that we provide. That being said, the ScoreBot did not work. First third party device like that I have not seen work.
    Not that it's very relevant here, but the J ports just have a current loop in them. So if you need more, you can just use a 1/4" TRS splitter. No problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kltv View Post
    Just make sure you are converting to network data, rather than just wiring the serial to the cat5 cable style. Those little MOXA boxes take the serial data and turn it into actual network traffic (with IP addresses and all that) to send down your multiplexed feed. Since you mentioned that a network signal down the fiber works fine, converting the serial data to ethernet and then back to serial on the other end should work fine. You'd need a MOXA box or similar device on either end and the All-Sport CG would still be at the field end of the run. Without those MOXA boxes your multiplexer probably doesn't know what to do with what is coming in since it is expecting ethernet signals. Those MOXA boxes cost about $115 each. http://www.buymoxa.com/product-p/nport%205110.htm

    Kris
    I'm looking at a similar setup as the original poster. Would this work for a setup through multiple switches? The PC at the end is running Character Works and Scorebridge Mono.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriCityStorm View Post
    I'm looking at a similar setup as the original poster. Would this work for a setup through multiple switches? The PC at the end is running Character Works and Scorebridge Mono.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    We're about to do this with an All Sport CG outputting to a Lantronix device server. Will let you know what I find with our setup, but I don't anticipate any issues.

    One problem I see in your signal flow is on the receive end. You will either need a IP to serial converter at your PC, or do a virtual COM port. I know Lantronix provides virtual com port emulation software, but I am not sure if your manufacturer does.
    Gabe Thomas

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