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Thread: Cycles for Lightwave ? Tip and trick ?

  1. #1
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    Cycles for Lightwave ? Tip and trick ?

    Hi

    This idea (first thinking to cycles for modo as well) is quite old, and why not ?, that I wanna to build for Cycles for Lightwave on plugin but it will not for now, it can make some long process, before to make it I need to collect some information for development, are there any tip to do it to know and any example as from scratch for small raytracing to interact lightwave (of course some code here) ?


    Welcome to idea, feature, comment, tip and other, I still am new to Lightwave so thank you to understand.

    Can it develop in C++ to create a plugin for Lightwave ? What function to integrate a render engine in Layout? Is there possible to make or convert to node shaders for Cycles in Lightwave ? How to create in own ui in lightwave for option on Cycles ? If in the futur I want to sell Cycles for Lightwave, what price to quote it?


    Hope to make it in concrete and it brights to contribute.

  2. #2
    Super Member samurai_x's Avatar
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    I would ask Juanjo for tips. He developed octane renderer for lightwave and its integrated very well.
    Begging him to do Redshift renderer for lw if he has passion for lw.
    Cycles for lw I would say a price between 300 to 500 usd is fair depending on the supported features and active development. Does cycles renderer limit the license to one license per render node? Fyi lightwave renderer has 999 free nodes. This is why I use it still.

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    Ok for Juanjo I am open for his tips.
    I will study the price to make interesting it and accesible to everyone. For license I have not yet decision but it will supported by multi core, at beginning I will make beta as free and then when it will be stable it will be marketed.
    If other can give me some info before to creating a plugin as logic and system, which programming, etc...

  4. #4
    Electron wrangler jwiede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3dslider View Post
    Ok for Juanjo I am open for his tips.
    I will study the price to make interesting it and accesible to everyone. For license I have not yet decision but it will supported by multi core, at beginning I will make beta as free and then when it will be stable it will be marketed.
    If other can give me some info before to creating a plugin as logic and system, which programming, etc...
    Bit of advice: As a "first plugin project for LW" choosing to integrate an external render engine is probably too over-reaching a goal to be practical -- there's too much reverse-engineering and API spelunking involved for someone who's never worked with LWSDK to have much hope of success.

    I'd strongly recommend starting with a plugin which only requires supporting a few LWSDK APIs, and is generally less complex a project, to get yourself comfortable with the process of making LW plugins in the first place. Perhaps something like a file format import/export plugin, or a custom shading node, or so forth.
    John W.
    LW2015.3UB/2019.1.4 on MacPro(12C/24T/10.13.6),32GB RAM, NV 980ti

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    @jwiede : Thank you for your advice and I take this consideration, yeah it is somewhat a bit more complex to begin this project. I am not afraid of much work, as I said this take more time to make the process, I need that give me a good "direction" and bright some interesting information for those who know. At looking to LWSDK, apparently it is coded in C, I don't know if I can mix with C++ but I can develop in C without problem too.

  6. #6
    But for something like this, LightWave is getting a new render engine. I would strongly recommend waiting to see how that stacks up and what Cycles actually can offer it does not. Cycles and cycles shaders are still very limiting even compared to LightWave now. Then you have a new mesh system coming around the corner. Not sure how that would affect any work you do on development now. In general for a project like this, I'd say wait. Obviously I have no way to know. But my gut feeling is that the new LW render engine is going to be a game changer. I don't mean like it is going to be vastly improved over other render engines. But I think it will be a huge step forward for LightWave and that it will be a very attractive solution for people looking to add LightWave to a pipeline as a render solution. Much the way it was once doing very well at. And now has lagged a little behind. My 2C.

  7. #7
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    Yes, you are right but I think Cycles for Lightwave will be complementary with the new render engine of the upcoming Lightwave (more choice so more possibility)
    Cycles has several feature to make as possible beautiful rendering, see it : Cycles feature Even limiting you will have idea enough how the possibility is quite endless
    But don't worry it will for not now, I will take my time to do it and all I need is for sharing information before a plugin is applied.
    The most hard to think is how to integrate node shader and OSL in Lightwave (layout) ? If all must be to rewrite in C or I can ported in C++ for LWSDK?
    If there a good doc for tutorial on this I am taker.

  8. #8
    creacon
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    Do you have programming experience?
    A good place to start is the Lightwave SDK that comes in your install directory.
    It's in C but you can write your plugins in C++, doing some casting here and there.

    creacon

    Quote Originally Posted by 3dslider View Post
    Yes, you are right but I think Cycles for Lightwave will be complementary with the new render engine of the upcoming Lightwave (more choice so more possibility)
    Cycles has several feature to make as possible beautiful rendering, see it : Cycles feature Even limiting you will have idea enough how the possibility is quite endless
    But don't worry it will for not now, I will take my time to do it and all I need is for sharing information before a plugin is applied.
    The most hard to think is how to integrate node shader and OSL in Lightwave (layout) ? If all must be to rewrite in C or I can ported in C++ for LWSDK?
    If there a good doc for tutorial on this I am taker.

  9. #9
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    Yes I have some programming experience in C++, I am self-educated I learned it and used often. C I use less but good programming. Ok today I successfully create the server.lib with visual studio based on documentation to see how it works and testing the samples with plugin for box it works in modeller without problem too and that is cool. However it doesn't explain how to create in C++ to tutorial. How to do it ?

  10. #10
    I still think you ought to consider waiting for the next LW release and see what the rendering solution brings. I think it is going to be a game changer for LightWave rendering. So you have to consider your market for your product. Even if it is free. Or whatever your plans are. I mean people have to be interested to use it and test it. What is going to be the incentive if LightWave has a PBR based rendering solution integrated? I don't think there are going to be a lot of people interested in embracing 3P renders outside of the people already using things like Octane. Those guys will stick with Octane or whatever they are using and maybe causally explore LightWave again. Then there will be a wave of people coming back to LightWave for the rendering and also new people looking to add LightWave for rendering.

    In short, LightWave's new render engine is very likely going to be a huge selling point for LightWave again. There is going to be a lot of buzz around that and not a lot of interest in 3P rendering. That is my take.

    And also knowing Cycles as well as I do. It is not all that yet. Pretty cool. But I imagine the new render engine in LightWave will be heads above. Blender does not even really have a good Metalness PBR workflow yet. A lot of that stuff is still experimental. And then there is Renderman For Blender which is really more of a modern approach. Cycles is still a tad behind in that regard. Whereas LightWave will come out of the gate already on top of that technology.

    That is my opinion. Take it for what it is worth.

  11. #11
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    Ok Surrealist, I will wait for new Lightwave and in the meantime I will study 3P rendering in my free time. I think it must not under estimate the power Cycles, see why? Poser integrate Cycles, I hear Rhino has Cycles bridge too or better Cycles for Cinema 4D now in development. Sure I love Lightwave for everything in workflow and rendering, the problem is too long to wait it, maybe in 2017 it will be out who know...

    If not, yeah I found Lightwrap++ a C++ wrapper for the LightWave 3D SDK on Github, very cool but I don't know if it supports for Lightwave 2015 and up. I'll throw a glance how it works.

  12. #12
    To be honest I'm not that impressed with Cycles in terms of speed. Sure it's fast on exterior shots, but for interiors it takes forever to clean up the noise.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by 3dslider View Post
    Ok Surrealist, I will wait for new Lightwave and in the meantime I will study 3P rendering in my free time. I think it must not under estimate the power Cycles, see why? Poser integrate Cycles, I hear Rhino has Cycles bridge too or better Cycles for Cinema 4D now in development. Sure I love Lightwave for everything in workflow and rendering, the problem is too long to wait it, maybe in 2017 it will be out who know...

    If not, yeah I found Lightwrap++ a C++ wrapper for the LightWave 3D SDK on Github, very cool but I don't know if it supports for Lightwave 2015 and up. I'll throw a glance how it works.
    Yeah I think you have to realize that those solutions that are using or developing for Cycles are apps where Cycles can fill a void.

    And I think development for a render bridge is going to be a long drawn out process. A lot of time and effort even for someone with experience doing it. Probably years not months. And by then LightWave will be in a different place.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Danner View Post
    To be honest I'm not that impressed with Cycles in terms of speed. Sure it's fast on exterior shots, but for interiors it takes forever to clean up the noise.
    I think it could use a denoiser. I think there is an experimental build someone is working on for that. But beyond that. What you are describing could be true for any brute force solution even LightWave. Unless there is one you have experience with to prove me wrong. But I have tired a few in the past and they are all painfully slow for interiors. So I am not totally sure Cycles really stands out. However you can call on AA in LightWave which does help. And Cycles has no AA yet to my knowledge so maybe you have a point.

  15. #15
    creacon
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    If you want to know how I started in c++ with the Lightwave SDK:

    - rename the source file from .c to .cpp (Visual Studio will compile as c++)
    - Try to compile
    - Solve all the compiler errors

    This is the most crude approach there is, but it works and if you know C and C++ this should be the fastest way too.

    creacon



    Quote Originally Posted by 3dslider View Post
    Ok Surrealist, I will wait for new Lightwave and in the meantime I will study 3P rendering in my free time. I think it must not under estimate the power Cycles, see why? Poser integrate Cycles, I hear Rhino has Cycles bridge too or better Cycles for Cinema 4D now in development. Sure I love Lightwave for everything in workflow and rendering, the problem is too long to wait it, maybe in 2017 it will be out who know...

    If not, yeah I found Lightwrap++ a C++ wrapper for the LightWave 3D SDK on Github, very cool but I don't know if it supports for Lightwave 2015 and up. I'll throw a glance how it works.

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