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Thread: Yet another archviz render...

  1. #1
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Yet another archviz render...

    Hello guys and gals.

    As i'm still trying to catch up with a more "up to date" archviz portfolio (and, wow, incredible how high the overall level is now !) i thought i would present another work.
    Again this render is inspired by a photo i've seen on an architectural blog (they are so helpful for studying the way architect photos are shot, finding great moods or angles of view !) and everything is done in LightWave (still in the very early phase of learning Octane for LW, so it might be a little while before i have anything intersting to show with that render engine...), from modelisation to texturing, lighting and rendering, with the usual post-processing in PhotoShop.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bibliotheque.jpg 
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    Hope you'll like it, don't hesitate to tell me what you think !

    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  2. #2
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    Great job! Totally realistic, a few more AA samples wouldn't hurt , and I also see at the bottom of the table and on left window some jagged edges. To strong light or using LW's horrible buffers Again totally realistic!

  3. #3
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Thanks for the kind words !

    You're right about some weird jaggies, LightWave has sometimes some difficulties to deal with (very) high contrast situations.
    It's still a part of the software that is a "perpetual discover", as there isn't, as far as i know, an "ideal" setting that would really work 100% of the time.


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  4. #4
    normally i am different ingo's Avatar
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    Nice work as always Laurent. Where comes light from above the right cabinet, a window or a artificial light source ?

    And what happens to Thea, have you stopped using it ?
    ingo erik moltzen - virtual image maker --- www.im-graphics.com

  5. #5
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ingo View Post
    Nice work as always Laurent. Where comes light from above the right cabinet, a window or a artificial light source ?

    And what happens to Thea, have you stopped using it ?
    Thanks Ingo.

    Yes, the light over the right cabinet is coming from an artificial source. But your question is a sign that i made it probably too dimmed or at least to "white" for the source to be self evident, probably my post-production that went a bit too far, i'll rework that part in order to figure more easily it's some artificial light, thanks for pointing that out.

    As for Thea, i didn't stop using it at all, it's just that i recently needed quite a lot instances in my scenes and, as i don't have any exporter to play with for Thea (i'd really would kill for a LightWave exporter, if only i was able to code it !) i have to build those scenes in Thea Studio, which isn't the most practical when you're coming from LightWave.
    It's also the reason why i bought Octane for LW, to be able to have some sort of unbiased render engine "inside" LightWave.

    But in my opinion nothing comes close to Thea when you need ultimate realism, the way it renders and clears the noise is unique.
    And i'm also in "learning phase" with Thea so it's a bit of a long process, but i'm rendering with it now as i'm writing this !


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  6. #6
    the smuggler of pixels ANS's Avatar
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    Tartiflette, great render. Can you show your light setup?

  7. #7
    normally i am different ingo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tartiflette View Post
    Thanks Ingo.

    Yes, the light over the right cabinet is coming from an artificial source. But your question is a sign that i made it probably too dimmed or at least to "white" for the source to be self evident, probably my post-production that went a bit too far, i'll rework that part in order to figure more easily it's some artificial light, thanks for pointing that out.....
    Well actually it looked to as if there is another room behind it.

    Since you use Thea and/or Octane, why not Kray ?
    ingo erik moltzen - virtual image maker --- www.im-graphics.com

  8. #8
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ingo View Post
    Well actually it looked to as if there is another room behind it.

    Since you use Thea and/or Octane, why not Kray ?
    I own it as well !

    But i have to admit i'm so much used to LightWave's render engine (which has improved so much now while Kray 2.x hasn't seen any significant update to its core, i still have high hopes for Kray 3.x though...) that i end up with better and faster results with LightWave's internal render engine than with Kray.
    Janusz Biela (Kray Master above all ! ) would tell me that it's because i don't know Kray enough and i would agree, but that's the way it is.

    As for Octane/Thea they are (almost for Octane, not really on par with Thea on that regard) unbiased render engine and they have possibilities that LightWave or Kray don't have so it's quite different.

    The other thing is that on Mac OS X Kray is quite unreliable, it crashes a lot and after 5 or 6 render tests i can't save anything in Layout, forcing me to restart the app to continue working. All those things are a killer when you have to use it in production.

    I guess we'll see what Kray v3 will bring to the table.


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  9. #9
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ANS View Post
    Tartiflette, great render. Can you show your light setup?
    Sure, you'll find a screen capture attached to this post which shows basically how it's done, but it's nothing fancy, really.

    I forgot to mention in the screen capture that there is a Sun Light (from essential DPont's SunSky plugin, a godsend to any LightWave user, thanks Denis for making such great plugins and to Mike/LightWolf to enable Mac users to use them ! ) from behind, a Sky light as well, and that the area lights covering the windows are in fact DP's portal lights.

    I'll try to do a simplified version of the scene if anyone is interested, minus the textures and trees i can't share.


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bibliotheque_Light_Setup.jpg 
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  10. #10
    I think the only thing you need to do is raise the shading sampling to lessen the noise in the blurry reflections on the floor, we always have this wet varnish look in LW on our blurred reflections, sometimes it looks okay but usually it needs to look dry and smooth. Otherwise this is very convincing and real.

  11. #11
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djwaterman View Post
    I think the only thing you need to do is raise the shading sampling to lessen the noise in the blurry reflections on the floor, we always have this wet varnish look in LW on our blurred reflections, sometimes it looks okay but usually it needs to look dry and smooth. Otherwise this is very convincing and real.
    Yes, you're right, the render could do with some more samples.
    Anyway, i think i need to find another combination for my AA samples and reconstruction filter as there is still this noise to eliminate and the jaggies on bright areas to tone down.
    Will do some other tests when i get some time, thanks all for your great input !


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  12. #12
    normally i am different ingo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tartiflette View Post
    I own it as well !

    But i have to admit i'm so much used to LightWave's render engine (which has improved so much now while Kray 2.x hasn't seen any significant update to its core, i still have high hopes for Kray 3.x though...) that i end up with better and faster results with LightWave's internal render engine than with Kray.
    Janusz Biela (Kray Master above all ! ) would tell me that it's because i don't know Kray enough and i would agree, but that's the way it is.

    As for Octane/Thea they are (almost for Octane, not really on par with Thea on that regard) unbiased render engine and they have possibilities that LightWave or Kray don't have so it's quite different.

    The other thing is that on Mac OS X Kray is quite unreliable, it crashes a lot and after 5 or 6 render tests i can't save anything in Layout, forcing me to restart the app to continue working. All those things are a killer when you have to use it in production.

    I guess we'll see what Kray v3 will bring to the table.


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.
    Thanks for your summary, Laurent, very helpful. I just have my problems with Thea that the plugins are not that exiting, only the Max plugin seems to be okay. And when i look at your nice Flickr gallery i can see a lot of grain in the Thea interior renderers. Otherwise the flexibility of Thea is nice. But when i see what nice renderings you do with LWs native renderer, who needs more ?

    A bit nitpicking, but i would add some scratches or dents to brake up the shiny blurred reflection, looks to prefect for me.
    ingo erik moltzen - virtual image maker --- www.im-graphics.com

  13. #13
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ingo View Post
    Thanks for your summary, Laurent, very helpful. I just have my problems with Thea that the plugins are not that exiting, only the Max plugin seems to be okay. And when i look at your nice Flickr gallery i can see a lot of grain in the Thea interior renderers. Otherwise the flexibility of Thea is nice. But when i see what nice renderings you do with LWs native renderer, who needs more ?
    You're welcome, i'm always looking for better solutions rendering wise and i test and buy a lot of render engines... Usually to end up using LightWave, again, and again, and again !
    For example i tried a render of this scene with Kray last night, just to see it would take about 40+ hours to finish ! (i had to stop it, unfortunately)
    I know it's 99% user's fault but i know LightWave's render engine enough to overcome this kind of problem, which ends up with render times a lot more manageable.

    As for Thea renders on my gallery being a bit noisy, it's usually because i'm not patient enough !
    Also don't forget i'm really a newbie when it comes to using Thea and even more optimizing the settings.

    But the good thing about Thea (or about any "physical render engine...) is that you can let it "cook" longer when you get some time, you never loose what has already been done, that's one of the fantastic features you have in Thea, as well as the "Relight" function, which is really great.

    Quote Originally Posted by ingo View Post
    A bit nitpicking, but i would add some scratches or dents to brake up the shiny blurred reflection, looks to prefect for me.
    Yes, the blurry reflections need some more love, as well as the light coming from above the right cabinet.
    I'll redo those parts when i get some more time.
    I guess this render should go to WiP then, as it's finaly not quite finished yet ! (like a lot of my work...)


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  14. #14
    Mike, in Monsters Inc Tartiflette's Avatar
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    For comparison sake here is an Octane render of the same scene.

    Note that i'm very new to Octane (even more than Thea ! I have the plugin for about one month now and not much time to "play" with it...) so it could probably be better than it is now.
    This render took around 20 hours on my GTX770 to reach that level, still very noisy though.

    Hopefully i'll get better results in less time when i'm more cumfortable with it !

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bibliotheque_Octane.jpg 
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ID:	121929


    Cheers,
    Laurent aka Tartiflette.

  15. #15
    Eh, what?
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    Whoa, 20 hours sound like a lot. What kernel were you using? Also, did you check "fake shadows" on the specular? And finally, Octane lights can increase render times (and noise) quite dramatically - how many are there?

    ADP.

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