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Thread: CNET: Adobe kills Creative Suite, goes subscription-only

  1. #466
    No I have CS6, I'm not paying out for nothing I am quite willingly paying out for CC services over and above that which CS6 offers for as long as I choose to do so, I am merely pointing out the ingratitude of the modern generation who despite having more shinny toys than they know what to do with at a price point that is ridiculously by historic standards still can't seem to stop moaning. If you are in business your cost model is based on what it takes to produce what you do, so bill the client or is that an unreasonable assumption ?

  2. #467
    Founding member raymondtrace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry_g View Post
    ...I'm nearly sixty and can remember when you had to design the hard way – on paper with a squeaker pen and without a computer...
    It is good to know a fellow aged colleague that recalls when there was competition of suppliers for art tools.

  3. #468
    So that's what's left of all the hippie vibes?

    From free love and free art to "just bill your client" and willingly paying overbearing corporations their every due?

    Interesting.

    As for "the ingratitude of the modern generation" - where did I hear that one before? ;-)

    While I understand where you come from and what you are saying, it only works if you leave out all the other implications.

    Today Adobe installed an update on my machine. Where I thought I'd get some application update for my installed software, they installed without asking their creative cloud app, which as it's first action asks for accepting a new EULA...
    Interesting read.

    This isn't about 50$.
    It's about not swallowing every turd presented, even if strawberry flavoured.

    YMMV :-)

    Cheers,

    Tom

  4. #469
    Scene Destroyer DrStrik9's Avatar
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    Business is business. If you don't like strawberry-flavored turds, don't buy them. Problem solved.

    It seems there is more to the CC issue than business, as so many people (worldwide) are whining and voicing much negativity about it. But from a business perspective, if you want it, buy it; if you don't, then move on to a differently-flavored turd.

  5. #470
    Quote Originally Posted by gerry_g View Post
    No I have CS6, I'm not paying out for nothing I am quite willingly paying out for CC services over and above that which CS6 offers for as long as I choose to do so, I am merely pointing out the ingratitude of the modern generation who despite having more shinny toys than they know what to do with at a price point that is ridiculously by historic standards still can't seem to stop moaning. If you are in business your cost model is based on what it takes to produce what you do, so bill the client or is that an unreasonable assumption ?
    I see - just treat your client as poorly as Adobe treats you. But what if your client decides to go somewhere that doesn't try to pass every dollar onto them?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    Business is business. If you don't like strawberry-flavored turds, don't buy them. Problem solved.

    It seems there is more to the CC issue than business, as so many people (worldwide) are whining and voicing much negativity about it. But from a business perspective, if you want it, buy it; if you don't, then move on to a differently-flavored turd.
    And keep it to yourself, don't warn or inform anyone? Are you not allowed to discuss dubious business practices? What do you think business will do next if no one ever notices or discusses these things? Customer satisfaction/dissatisfaction is a part of business too, isn't it?

    How about : if you don't like to hear disapproval of a product... don't go to where it's being discussed.
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  6. #471
    Man of many cells. shrox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry_g View Post
    No I have CS6, I'm not paying out for nothing I am quite willingly paying out for CC services over and above that which CS6 offers for as long as I choose to do so, I am merely pointing out the ingratitude of the modern generation who despite having more shinny toys than they know what to do with at a price point that is ridiculously by historic standards still can't seem to stop moaning. If you are in business your cost model is based on what it takes to produce what you do, so bill the client or is that an unreasonable assumption ?
    Yep.

    Young punks don't know how easy it is now...
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  7. #472
    Often Banned Megalodon2.0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry_g View Post
    No I have CS6, I'm not paying out for nothing I am quite willingly paying out for CC services over and above that which CS6 offers for as long as I choose to do so, I am merely pointing out the ingratitude of the modern generation who despite having more shinny toys than they know what to do with at a price point that is ridiculously by historic standards still can't seem to stop moaning. If you are in business your cost model is based on what it takes to produce what you do, so bill the client or is that an unreasonable assumption ?
    How nice. Interesting... I'm a few short years away from 60 myself. And this move by Adobe is BAD. You apparently don't know why so many are angry about this subscription situation since you seem to think that price is a major factor. Try looking on other forums and LISTENING to what people are saying. We just went through a HUGE recession. We lost 90%+ of our business. I can just imagine if we were on subscription at that time and had to stop. And then a client came to us with a few SMALL tweaks to a couple of floor plans that may be traditionally invoiced at $75. What would we do? Charge them the cost of a ONE MONTH subscription AND our invoice? Sure we could, but then we would lose that client in the future. BAD business. All because we did not have perpetual licenses of the product we use since we were on subscription. People just do not THINK that these things could happen to them. Guess again - it does!

    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    Business is business. If you don't like strawberry-flavored turds, don't buy them. Problem solved.

    It seems there is more to the CC issue than business, as so many people (worldwide) are whining and voicing much negativity about it. But from a business perspective, if you want it, buy it; if you don't, then move on to a differently-flavored turd.
    Yeah, there is. It sets a HUGE precedent FOR subscription software. It's a BAD move for EVERYONE. As I've said countless times, do you want all/most of your software subscription-based only never to own it? How much do you think THAT will cost you? If Adobe succeeds here, others will say "hey, Adobe made it work, we should do the same." If they crash and burn - which I certainly hope they do - these software manufacturers will most certainly think twice.

    And isn't it amazing how many BUSINESS professionals on so many forums are voicing their opinions AGAINST subscription? I would say that they see the potential for serious problems FAR more than everyone who simply accepts this and bends over.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by toby View Post
    I see - just treat your client as poorly as Adobe treats you. But what if your client decides to go somewhere that doesn't try to pass every dollar onto them?

    And keep it to yourself, don't warn or inform anyone? Are you not allowed to discuss dubious business practices? What do you think business will do next if no one ever notices or discusses these things? Customer satisfaction/dissatisfaction is a part of business too, isn't it?

    How about : if you don't like to hear disapproval of a product... don't go to where it's being discussed.
    Spot on!

  8. #473
    Scene Destroyer DrStrik9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toby View Post
    And keep it to yourself, don't warn or inform anyone? Are you not allowed to discuss dubious business practices? What do you think business will do next if no one ever notices or discusses these things? Customer satisfaction/dissatisfaction is a part of business too, isn't it?

    How about : if you don't like to hear disapproval of a product... don't go to where it's being discussed.
    Please don't put words in my post that I didn't write, or think. I was simply pointing out the (obvious) bottom line, no matter how much people like it or don't like it. I have as much a right to voice my opinion and perspective as you do. Peace.

  9. #474
    Thanks for everybody's input - it actually helped me evaluate the situation more clearly.

    Cheers, over and out ;-)

    Tom

  10. #475
    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    Please don't put words in my post that I didn't write, or think. I was simply pointing out the (obvious) bottom line, no matter how much people like it or don't like it.
    I wasn't putting words in your mouth, it was formed as a question; is that what you think? What you said *was* obvious, none of us think we're being forced to buy the subscritpion - which means you're implying something. I pointed out other things that your expression implied that you may not have thought of.

    To be honest, I'm also thoroughly sick of the "if you don't like it, don't buy it" excuse for business to decieve and screw people over, and enjoy the opportunity to publicly debunk it.

    I have as much a right to voice my opinion and perspective as you do. Peace.
    Of course you do, but don't get defensive if your implications aren't well recieved.

  11. #476
    Scene Destroyer DrStrik9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toby View Post
    I wasn't putting words in your mouth, it was formed as a question; is that what you think? What you said *was* obvious, none of us think we're being forced to buy the subscritpion - which means you're implying something. I pointed out other things that your expression implied that you may not have thought of.

    To be honest, I'm also thoroughly sick of the "if you don't like it, don't buy it" excuse for business to decieve and screw people over, and enjoy the opportunity to publicly debunk it.

    Of course you do, but don't get defensive if your implications aren't well recieved.
    Well, what you suggest is not what I think, and it's not what I was implying. You assume much. I don't hold it against you; I also formerly read much into what other people said, but not so much anymore (in my old age). It seems more of us should take your advice: if you can't handle hearing other opinions, don't go where they are being expressed. Coming into an open discussion with an attitude of being "thoroughly sick" of certain things people might say may get you into unnecessary conflicts. My suggestion to you is that you try to take statements at face value, and try not to read so much "implication" into them.

    You say you enjoy publicly "debunking" people's statements. I suspect in time you may find more wisdom about such a confrontive style of discussion if you relax a little and try to be more open-minded. If you read implications into what someone else says, and then react negatively to those imagined implications, what do you have? You have unnecessary conflict, caused by yourself.

    I make these clarifications and observations, but I don't hold any of it against you, as you may be young. Peace out.

  12. #477
    Often Banned Megalodon2.0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    I make these clarifications and observations, but I don't hold any of it against you, as you may be young. Peace out.
    Age does not necessarily imply wisdom - not by a longshot.

  13. #478
    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    Well, what you suggest is not what I think, and it's not what I was implying. You assume much.
    Why didn't you clarify your position instead of getting offended, and ignoring/dispensing with all discussion on the topic? You can't imply something then accuse people of making false assumptions when they don't get it the way you wanted.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    It seems more of us should take your advice: if you can't handle hearing other opinions, don't go where they are being expressed. Coming into an open discussion with an attitude of being "thoroughly sick" of certain things people might say may get you into unnecessary conflicts. My suggestion to you is that you try to take statements at face value, and try not to read so much "implication" into them.
    If I took your statement at face value, I'd have asked you why you thought we felt we were being forced to buy the subscription. Any other meaning is being implied. "Problem solved" generally means no other action is needed; like discussion. Doing what you suggest has more implications than just what you said anyway, no matter what you wanted your message to be. Any interest in addressing those?

    I've already pointed out that "if you don't like the heat, stay out of the kitchen" works both ways here, so you can stop using it now - or should we go back and forth 8 more times first...

    Quote Originally Posted by DrStrik9 View Post
    You say you enjoy publicly "debunking" people's statements.
    No, I like to debunk innaccurate, deceptive, damaging concepts and/or catch-phrases. I like to clear things up for people. I guess I should stop being honest and forthcoming if you're going to twist my words.
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  14. #479
    incurable dumbass Medi8or's Avatar
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    As this is a somewhat long thread, I haven't read it all.
    Did anyone write why they think CC is a good idea, other than paying a small sum of money each month instead of a larger sum every other year?
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  15. #480
    Super Member COBRASoft's Avatar
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    ^^ For companies this is easy calculation for budgets. Per month payment is the same as paying the rent for the buildings/offices they occupy. This is a major reason for many of our own customers who rent our software/services instead of buying them.

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