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Thread: subpatch and catmull clark

  1. #1
    Registered User octopus2000's Avatar
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    subpatch and catmull clark

    when do you use subpatch and when do you use catmull clark? is there a rule of thumb when you're supposed to use either of the two? thanks

  2. #2
    Agent of Chaos TalleyJC's Avatar
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    CC handles n-gons
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  3. #3
    Well, ideally you would want to use catmull clark subdivision in a lot of cases. But they can be pretty slow in LightWave if there is a lot of polygons. They support ngons as well as edge weighting so offer a few advantages over LightWave subpatches. They round better but keep in mind this is because they use more divisions (although you can adjust the number of divisions in modelers general option panel). Also, there used to be some problems with UV mapping and mirroring CC's. I can't say if they still exist because I haven't used CC's in a while. Maybe someone else can address that.

    I would say if your going to be 18K or below in polygons, I would say use them. Anything above 20K is going to be painful to work with while enabled. I would also recommend turning down the CC division level to 2.

    This is one area in LightWave that needs some work.

  4. #4
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    It's great about CC that when you're cutting it, it doesn't create empty hole when there is 5 or more vertexes. But good modeling artist, will fix it sooner or later, to get ride of. In regular, you have to switch back to polygons, to be able to edit such n-gon. So I would suggest using CC until end of modeling, then switch to regular sub-patches. CC have/had problems with UVs.

    If you're thinking about character modeling, get EasySplit or TrueArt's Modeling Pack http://modelingpack.trueart.eu which has it included.
    It's option to automatically converting n-gon (Fix N-gons and Fix 3-5) while cutting regular sub-patches, to not create these empty holes..
    Last edited by Sensei; 08-17-2011 at 02:05 PM.

  5. #5
    The thing about CC is that it still doesn't work properly for some things like mirroring edge weights and using UV map smoothing. Those are two times where you have to use Subpatches.
    ~~Phil Nolan
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  6. #6
    Javis Jones: Night Crew geothefaust's Avatar
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    You know, MODO has a pretty excellent implementation of CC SubDs, and has pretty great modeling tools all around. No work arounds needed.


    The plan for LW9, that was never delivered, was to have a full implementation of CC SubDs. It's a shame now that 5 years on there are still the exact same bugs and almost no improvements to Modeller.

  7. #7
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    Actually kinda sad that CC isn't integrated right in LW. I once worked on a project a few years ago and used CC without knowing the issues with mirrioring and UV. It was so bad my UVs just sucked. Too bad in LW 9.6.1 (don't have LW 10+) CC still don't work right in LW which makes me stick with Sub-D.

    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by geothefaust View Post
    You know, MODO has a pretty excellent implementation of CC SubDs, and has pretty great modeling tools all around. No work arounds needed.


    The plan for LW9, that was never delivered, was to have a full implementation of CC SubDs. It's a shame now that 5 years on there are still the exact same bugs and almost no improvements to Modeller.
    So true. Heck even Blender has a better implementation of CC than LW where UV etc. work with no prob. I know Newtek doesn't like to hear about Blender, but come on don't hide behind pink glasses and face the truth. I'll stick with Lw anyway but yeah, truth hurts.

    I'm Texan so I say it the way it is :P

    Greetz
    Last edited by K-Dawg; 08-17-2011 at 03:55 PM.
    Kevin "K-Dawg" Reeves

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by geothefaust View Post
    You know, MODO has a pretty excellent implementation of CC SubDs, and has pretty great modeling tools all around. No work arounds needed.


    The plan for LW9, that was never delivered, was to have a full implementation of CC SubDs. It's a shame now that 5 years on there are still the exact same bugs and almost no improvements to Modeller.
    If you hate LW so much why do you keep coming back here?
    ~~Phil Nolan
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  9. #9
    Javis Jones: Night Crew geothefaust's Avatar
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    Oh Phil, who said I hate LW? I still use it in my workflow, occasionally. What I don't like is NT, and their empty promises. You could have surmised that much by now, aye? Quit being such a fanboy about software. It's getting ridiculous dude.

  10. #10
    All I know is, this is the NT forum and you're here promoting how great modo is.
    ~~Phil Nolan
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  11. #11
    Javis Jones: Night Crew geothefaust's Avatar
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    I'm certainly allowed to talk about how NOT messed up a tool is compared to another. Now if I was saying "USE MODO ITZ TEH [email protected]" I'd probably agree, but I'm not. Report me if you think it's so bad. But either way, step off my damned toes.

  12. #12
    Javis Jones: Night Crew geothefaust's Avatar
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    And besides, Phil, the whole point was that NT has had a LONG time to implemented CCs properly, more time than Lux. You would think that with all this time they would have had modeller improved, CCs implemented, kick *** modernized modeling tools and so on. But they haven't. Is that spelled out enough for you?

  13. #13
    Aren't you guys 3D coat buddies?

  14. #14
    Javis Jones: Night Crew geothefaust's Avatar
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    I work for Pilgway, and for now he's one of our moderators. But we're definitely not buddies.

  15. #15
    ~~Phil Nolan
    www.philnolan3d.com - Twitter - YouTube
    Win 10 Home x64, Core i7 3.4 GHz, GeForce GT 640, 16GB RAM
    Laptop: Win10 x64, Core I7 8th gen, 1.8 GHz, 16GB RAM

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