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virtualcomposer
06-05-2009, 12:06 AM
What 3D program are all the car commercials used in? Maya? Lightwave? I know most are renders. I was just wondering.

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 01:19 AM
What 3D program are all the car commercials used in? Maya? Lightwave? I know most are renders. I was just wondering.There is no standard programs used in commercials.
It just boils down to the quality of work. Generally speaking, the models you see go through studios that have ongoing contracts...so, if you were looking into doing that sort of work, you may want to produce a quality clip, and do some research as to what studio is contracted to which Auto maker.

I know SpeedShape has a major contract for GM commercials (studio in Michigan and in Venice CA...and they use 3ds Max w/VRay), but I'm sure as GM has fallen on hard times, so have they.

calilifestyle
06-05-2009, 01:36 AM
I remember few years back Right Hemisphere had a lot of work coming their way for this kind of thing. we could easily export cad and Catia models through one of their programs, texture it and do kind of magic with it. Not sure how it is now.

Silkrooster
06-05-2009, 01:41 AM
Generally I determine whether it was rendered or not by how dark the driver window is. :D

Astralworkz
06-05-2009, 05:27 AM
A bit offtopic-found this thing some time ago: it's Ford flex commercial done by speedshape, probably many of you seen it already. I know that they animate in maya, see the link to the video on studiodaily website:

click (http://aimediaserver4.com/studiodaily/videoplayer/?src=ai4/fordflex/fordflex.swf&width=720&height=526)
You can clearly see that they using Lw for pre-viz, so my question is: why using it for pre-vis phase? did they also rendered it in lightwave?
If not, what's the point of exporting the whole animation to differnet package just to do the pre-vis is it not possible to do so in maya?

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 05:48 AM
A bit offtopic-found this thing some time ago: it's Ford flex commercial done by speedshape, probably many of you seen it already. I know that they animate in maya, see the link to the video on studiodaily website:

click (http://aimediaserver4.com/studiodaily/videoplayer/?src=ai4/fordflex/fordflex.swf&width=720&height=526)
You can clearly see that they using Lw for pre-viz, so my question is: why using it for pre-vis phase? did they also rendered it in lightwave?
If not, what's the point of exporting the whole animation to differnet package just to do the pre-vis is it not possible to do so in maya?I stopped by there one day (they were looking for a Max artist at the time), and there were some seats of Maya, but it was largely a Max house. How can you tell LW was used for pre-viz?
It's likely that they just like the VRay renders, which is available for Maya as well.

Astralworkz
06-05-2009, 06:19 AM
Yeah, the V-ray, I was wondering at some point what was "easier" to setup and do(faster results, time efficiency etc.)?

To create animation in any app and use Vray to render it or create it entirely in Lw.
I'm comparing a few commercials done by mackevison[http://www.mackevision.de those guys are rocking with max/vray combo] for example and few commercial done for Saab and Honda(fit) done by Digital Domain, Both are excellent in quality and looks top notch.

I wish newtek would ask those nice guys from DD about few 'things':D

Just created my new custom avatar :D just to let you all know....

accom
06-05-2009, 06:56 AM
How can you tell LW was used for pre-viz?


Isn't it obvious? Check the videos again... super txt at the bottom left. :)

Astralworkz
06-05-2009, 07:11 AM
Or...they just put the text there, to make fun of us:)

AdamAvenali
06-05-2009, 07:59 AM
i spoke with a women back in my college years (she came to visit the school) who worked for GM. she was using maya at the time. i guess she was in charge of was making a universal shading library so all of the people who were doing the 3d would have the same shaders worldwide.

JeffrySG
06-05-2009, 08:16 AM
I know Digital Domain does a lot of car commercials. I know they have used LW in the past. There was an article on the Honda Fit in CGW and they did talk about Lightwave. I think there are some people here from DD. Maybe they can chime in too.

http://www.studiodaily.com/filmandvideo/currentissue/10093.html
http://motionographer.com/2009/03/12/digital-domain-campaigns-for-lexus/
http://www.vfxtalk.com/forum/digital-domain-brings-inventive-vfx-t19128.html?t=19128

http://www.digitaldomain.com/
go to advertising and then automotive - they have some behind the scenes clips too.

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 08:20 AM
Yeah, the V-ray, I was wondering at some point what was "easier" to setup and do(faster results, time efficiency etc.)?

To create animation in any app and use Vray to render it or create it entirely in Lw.
I'm comparing a few commercials done by mackevison[http://www.mackevision.de those guys are rocking with max/vray combo] for example and few commercial done for Saab and Honda(fit) done by Digital Domain, Both are excellent in quality and looks top notch.

I wish newtek would ask those nice guys from DD about few 'things':D

Just created my new custom avatar :D just to let you all know....I doubt it was done in LW period...you can have any sort of text (timecode, filename, etc) added in most any renderer.
I say this because, knowing firsthand that SpeedShape is a Max house, with some seats of Maya, it just doesn't make any sense that LW carried the bulk of the load in this particular case.

Otterman
06-05-2009, 08:24 AM
Wasnt the dancing robot/citreon C4 tv advert (UK) done in lightwave? I seem to remember seeing that somewhere.....dunno, maybe wrong i usually am!

biliousfrog
06-05-2009, 09:06 AM
Wasnt the dancing robot/citreon C4 tv advert (UK) done in lightwave? I seem to remember seeing that somewhere.....dunno, maybe wrong i usually am!

I thought that it was C4D but I'm starting to think Lightwave now...hmm, not sure?

Astralworkz
06-05-2009, 09:53 AM
Both ads- Original one(dancing car) and the last one, the "runner" were done by embassy vfx. I've got some article from past issue 3dworld (early 2008 I believe)talking about it, but when it comes to 3dworld mag- it was just few 'thoughts' about metalic shader and lightning, not really helpfull:]but it was cool anyway.
I can post a scan of that article, or is it going to be some sort copyright infringement?


I doubt it was done in LW period...you can have any sort of text (timecode, filename, etc) added in most any renderer.

Hoax?Yeah but it says *something.lws...So what part in that particular project Lw played?C'mon I'm sure it was used and played a big part...but what exactly..?:)

realgray
06-05-2009, 01:07 PM
Citroen C4 Ad Campaign

http://www.luxology.com/community/profiles/embassy/

(lightwave was used for rendering)

Click on the link below and look at the video in the bottom left corner to see a video of Embassy using Shake to comp.

http://www.apple.com/shake/customerstory.html

I would love to know what they used to animate. I would assume XSI.

Mike_RB
06-05-2009, 01:20 PM
Citroen C4 Ad Campaign

http://www.luxology.com/community/profiles/embassy/

(lightwave was used for rendering)

Click on the link below and look at the video in the bottom left corner to see a video of Embassy using Shake to comp.

http://www.apple.com/shake/customerstory.html

I would love to know what they used to animate. I would assume XSI.

For that original one it was modo + mocap + LW.

Runner was the same

Staying alive was modo + mocap + XSI + LW (using our Iron Man pipeline)

Picasso was just modo + XSI (rendered in mental ray)

-Mike

Otterman
06-05-2009, 01:38 PM
phew-I have bantered around a fair few times that lightwave was used on that ad! U gotta agree, it's arguably one of the best car ads ever!

virtualcomposer
06-05-2009, 01:56 PM
is Apple even making Shake anymore?

Mike_RB
06-05-2009, 01:59 PM
is Apple even making Shake anymore?

Shake has been 'end of lifed'. They aren't doing any more development on it.

virtualcomposer
06-05-2009, 02:59 PM
Shake has been 'end of lifed'. They aren't doing any more development on it.

Would it be worth buying at a cheap price rather then the new stuff?

realgray
06-05-2009, 03:30 PM
Thanks Mike for the clarification, it's a wonderful ad.
I heard the code (Shake) was purchased by some effects houses so they could continue to use/develop it in house. Most Shake users I know are slowly shifting to Nuke.
I agree about this ad being one of the best car commercials ever, I've always enjoyed it. The Modo/XSI is a really cool pipe in my opinion and as evidenced by the incredible work at Embassy. The effects house near me just used it to do a dell spot.
http://www.magneticdreams.com/blog/?p=175

Mike_RB
06-05-2009, 03:35 PM
Thanks Mike for the clarification, it's a wonderful ad.
I heard the code (Shake) was purchased by some effects houses so they could continue to use/develop it in house. Most Shake users I know are slowly shifting to Nuke.
I agree about this ad being one of the best car commercials ever, I've always enjoyed it. The Modo/XSI is a really cool pipe in my opinion and as evidenced by the incredible work at Embassy. The effects house near me just used it to do a dell spot.
http://www.magneticdreams.com/blog/?p=175

The film we're working on (District 9) is using a similar pipeline. modo+xsi+MR.

Cageman
06-05-2009, 04:09 PM
I doubt it was done in LW period...you can have any sort of text (timecode, filename, etc) added in most any renderer.

Well... why would you add ".lws" if it was done in Maya? BTW, .lws is something LightWave adds to the name without you having any control of it... so, tell me, why would anyone go to the lenghts of ADDING that to a previs render done in Maya, for example?

Mike_RB
06-05-2009, 04:13 PM
Well... why would you add ".lws" if it was done in Maya? BTW, .lws is something LightWave adds to the name without you having any control of it... so, tell me, why would anyone go to the lenghts of ADDING that to a previs render done in Maya, for example?

That city shot was obviously done in LW for the flex commercial.

Sarford
06-05-2009, 04:32 PM
Would it be worth buying at a cheap price rather then the new stuff?

Shake is still a very powerfull compositor. It lacks the more advanced nodes of more modern compositors, has no particle system and a limited 3d compositing capability. On the other hand, Shake has many atomic nodes with which you can build very complex trees. I still would recomend Shake as it itsn't very modern, but still very powerfull and also very cheap.

realgray
06-05-2009, 04:38 PM
Would it be worth buying at a cheap price rather then the new stuff?

It depends. Unless your are working on some really intense stuff, like importing intricate 3d models or advanced camera mapping, AE will get the job done.

realgray
06-05-2009, 04:39 PM
The film we're working on (District 9) is using a similar pipeline. modo+xsi+MR.

Can't wait to see it! :thumbsup:

toby
06-05-2009, 05:05 PM
A bit offtopic-found this thing some time ago: it's Ford flex commercial done by speedshape, probably many of you seen it already. I know that they animate in maya, see the link to the video on studiodaily website:

click (http://aimediaserver4.com/studiodaily/videoplayer/?src=ai4/fordflex/fordflex.swf&width=720&height=526)
You can clearly see that they using Lw for pre-viz, so my question is: why using it for pre-vis phase? did they also rendered it in lightwave?
John Allerdice, the dp that the narrator mentions (both of them are dd alumni), has been using lw for previz for years, probably since starship troopers roughnecks. Previz is very fast in LW, and it's not too hard transfer the animation when you're set up for it.

But it looks like they rendered without raytrace reflections in that second spot?!? Most obvious on the front rim just before the end. cbb (could be better)

toby
06-05-2009, 05:13 PM
It depends. Unless your are working on some really intense stuff, like importing intricate 3d models or advanced camera mapping, AE will get the job done.
I'd only recommend AE if motion graphics was a part of your workload, since the prices are comparable. Shake is more capable *at everything else, with better color math, and might even be cheaper?

Cageman
06-05-2009, 05:23 PM
That city shot was obviously done in LW for the flex commercial.

My point exactly. :)

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 05:47 PM
Well... why would you add ".lws" if it was done in Maya? BTW, .lws is something LightWave adds to the name without you having any control of it... so, tell me, why would anyone go to the lenghts of ADDING that to a previs render done in Maya, for example?Maybe Mike answers it for us
That city shot was obviously done in LW for the flex commercial.That must've taken quite a bit of work. He says they modeled some "Hero Buildings" (maybe that was done in LW), and the rest of the city was done procedurally. That sounds like a job for the commonly used "Greeble" plugin/script. Could be that they farmed out a chunk of the modeling work to a LW house? If I remember correctly the .lws extension was up only during a small portion of the clip (there were different ads/spots)...but having the information (timecode, frame count, filename, etc) displayed at rendertime isn't exclusive to LW

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 05:57 PM
It depends. Unless your are working on some really intense stuff, like importing intricate 3d models or advanced camera mapping, AE will get the job done.Yeah...for us small fish, AE is the most versatile, with a host of handy dandy plugins available for it.
If you're doing any sort of motion graphics, you'll want to stick with AE and some Trapcode plugins (shine, 3D Stroke, Particular, etc).
Then you have Boris FX plugins (that do some snazzy 3D text FX), and Digital Juice, etc. So, coming from a Combustion user, I have to admit that AE's plugins (although many AE plugins work with Combustion) is what sets it up on a pedestal, IMHO.
Those glowing strokes you see in that Flex commercial was VERY likely done with AE and Trapcode's 3D Stroke

realgray
06-05-2009, 06:39 PM
I'm really looking forward to Trapcode Particular V2

http://media.fxguide.com/fxguidetv/fxguidetv-ep055.mov

geo_n
06-05-2009, 08:40 PM
Car commercials can be done in lw, 3dsmax, maya, etc. Just depends on which artist is not so busy with other projects that time. We have a few car commercials we did in lw and some in max. But lately since there's no time, maya is used because the car manufacturer gives the data in maya or obj format.
I did honda renders in max vray but modelled some parts in lw that were too highpoly. I would love to do them in modo next time.
The last one we had was done by one maya user. Took him almost a month with planning, storyboarding, site shooting, etc.
The concept was from anime look to real transformation. Honda was pleased given the time frame.

http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=8zph5y&s=5

Nothing that can't be done in lw, etc, imho. But saved time since the data is easily handled in maya.

AbnRanger
06-05-2009, 10:48 PM
I'm really looking forward to Trapcode Particular V2

http://media.fxguide.com/fxguidetv/fxguidetv-ep055.mov

Hey, nice find...thought it was cool how they mentioned that Red Giant (who now owns rights to Trapcode) said they have recently been talking to Autodesk about porting Trapcode products to their line (Combustion, Toxic, Flame). He said it would be tough, but I never heard him say they couldn't or wouldn't.
That would kick a$$ets to have Combustion (currently has Particle Illusion SE built in) and Toxic with those tools. Can you say "Buyout?"...I thought you could :D