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ar08
04-15-2009, 04:11 PM
Im very new to lightwave having only started using it two months ago. I was told that in layout whilst rendering it only renders what the camera sees. Is this function automatic or do you have to activate the function elsewhere before rendering.
The problem is, im trying a test render as wireframe, yet to render 150 frames its taking 17 minutes, which i find to be quite long. The object in the scene is 196278 polygons but the object that the camera is seeing throughout the 150 frames is much much less and simple. Also im using lightwave 9.6

any help would be appreciated
Thanks alot
Andy

Sensei
04-15-2009, 04:20 PM
In your message, I don't see any problem. Camera of course renders only what is visible, because what else it would have to render? Photo camera in real world also takes photo of what is visible..

17 minutes for 150 frames is very fast rendering.. Proximately 7 sec per frame.. People often have scenes that render in 30-60 or more minutes per frame, depending on complexity and used materials (especially with reflection/refraction blurring and many recursions and GI is slowing down rendering).

Tobian
04-15-2009, 04:46 PM
I wish I could get renders that fast! :D

Have you tried the perspective camera, instead of the classic cam? Not sure if it'd be any faster, for wireframe, but it might.

Trouble with render settings is there's so many. We've no idea what settings you're using, or any kind of context for that.

NB: you can use 'preview' menu to generate an openGL wireframe preview animation, which you can then save out. That should render considerably faster than using the render module! Look at the 'preview' popup to the lower right of the screen in layout! :D

ar08
04-15-2009, 04:47 PM
yeah but the reason i was querying is because im rendering as a wireframe.
thanks for the quick reply

Hieron
04-15-2009, 05:09 PM
7 seconds a frame doesn't sound very odd.. all depends on your settings. If you have some serious AA in there (the lines may need them) it will increase things ofcourse..

So not much to say, unless you can put up an image here and some basic settings..

ar08
04-15-2009, 05:15 PM
cheers man, i will upload a render of my finished model which fully textured and rendered take 35 minutes/frame

ar08
04-15-2009, 05:35 PM
This is the render of the project discussed above, all feedback welcome.
cheers

Sensei
04-15-2009, 05:44 PM
If you're using LW v9.6 try Dome light type. Adjust angle from 90 degree to something smaller. If you're using older LW, try Area light instead. This way you will have smooth shadows. Currently you have them too sharp IMHO.

ar08
04-15-2009, 05:46 PM
what do u think of the modelling and textures ?
cheers for the feedback

Hieron
04-15-2009, 05:57 PM
You use LW for 2 months, did you work with other packages before that?

If not, then this is imho a pretty nice piece you did. A wireframe render would be nice to determine the modelling a bit better but the looks are there. No clue what the heck it is though :P Some automated paper delivery boy? :)

As Sensei suggested, toss in a Dome light with low degree angle instead of you current light. The sharp shadows are not so nice. Also the very bright white base distracts..

If you say wireframe render btw, do you mean the "render outlines" option in surface panel? That would render slower I think than rendering the edges (object properties) and making the textures transparant..

ar08
04-16-2009, 02:56 AM
never used any 3d packages before i started on lightwave, i went stright into my 3rd year at university after doing illustration and design for 2 years.
yeah the main robot pulls along the cart and when u put ur money in the slot the lid opens up using the hydraulics on the side and u take ur paper lol. I did have a black base in ther but i felt that it made it look very distarcting aswell, but didnt really wanna use a colour, whats ur opnions on the base colour ?

mehetabel
04-16-2009, 03:10 AM
That's actually good after using lightwave only for 2 months! I agree with the lightning and I also see some texture mistakes. But I think you can be happy with this, concidering how much experience you have with 3D software.

mehetabel
04-16-2009, 03:18 AM
In your message, I don't see any problem. Camera of course renders only what is visible, because what else it would have to render? Photo camera in real world also takes photo of what is visible..

17 minutes for 150 frames is very fast rendering.. Proximately 7 sec per frame.. People often have scenes that render in 30-60 or more minutes per frame, depending on complexity and used materials (especially with reflection/refraction blurring and many recursions and GI is slowing down rendering).

Mmh is that true? What about shadows that come from objects that are outside the camera? Doesn't the computer need to calculate the object in order to cast the right shadows? Or light that reflects from unseen objects? Objects being reflected in mirrors? Those things need to be calculated/rendered.

ar08
04-16-2009, 03:59 AM
hey thanks for the feedback , what kind of texture mistakes u see ?

sampei
04-16-2009, 04:38 AM
I'll borrow this thread for a question:
I'm rendering a scene at the moment and for some odd reason Layout is using an average of 50% of the cpu (from process explorer), it usually uses around 97-98 when its rendering..I might have changed some settings by accident :S
any guesses :help:

Sensei
04-16-2009, 05:13 AM
I'll borrow this thread for a question:
I'm rendering a scene at the moment and for some odd reason Layout is using an average of 50% of the cpu (from process explorer), it usually uses around 97-98 when its rendering..I might have changed some settings by accident :S
any guesses :help:

Check whether it's using classic camera or perspective. If classic, you need to set as many threads in Render Globals as possible, or switch to perspective camera. Non-classic cameras work the best with the same number of threads as cores * cpus (which is done by Automatic setting in LW v9.5-LW v9.6).

ar08
04-16-2009, 05:25 AM
also having prblems rendering my wireframe render without textures, is there a way i can make the textures transparant on a wireframe render ?

sampei
04-16-2009, 06:09 AM
Check whether it's using classic camera or perspective. If classic, you need to set as many threads in Render Globals as possible, or switch to perspective camera. Non-classic cameras work the best with the same number of threads as cores * cpus (which is done by Automatic setting in LW v9.5-LW v9.6).
thanks for the tips Sensei, I'm using the classic camera, with 2 threads at the moment. I'll try increasing the number, wierd tho because I always used classic camera with 2 threads and just today it seems to be unstable (CPU usage ocasionally hits 90% peaks but falls back to ~50& almost immediately). By the way I'm working with a Turion TL52 which is a 1.6 GHz dual core processor (cache 2X512 KB) which is quite slow tbh.

Tobian
04-16-2009, 06:46 AM
The problem with the classic camera is that it's not adaptive. It will divide a frame into 2. one core will render one half and one will render the other. If you have a half which had mostly dead space (a background or single large untextured poly), and another half which was full of detail, then one core would finish first, and have nothing to do while the other one chugged away. If you have had frames which were largely uniform in terms of work before then you may not have noticed this as an issue. Dividing the 'core' up into more 'virtual cores' than you have will mean the CPU will probably be used more evenly, but if it gets stuck on that one bit of the render which is slow, you will find it will still be a sticking block. Plus then the CPU's cores are having to do a lot of context switching, to pretend to be more than 1 core, which can slow things down a little.

With the perspective camera it will reallocate new sections of the render to a core dynamically. You can see this happening in adaptive sample renders. It's a much more elegant and modern method of doing it, short of doing bucket rendering :)

sampei
04-16-2009, 07:05 AM
The problem with the classic camera is that it's not adaptive. It will divide a frame into 2. one core will render one half and one will render the other. If you have a half which had mostly dead space (a background or single large untextured poly), and another half which was full of detail, then one core would finish first, and have nothing to do while the other one chugged away. If you have had frames which were largely uniform in terms of work before then you may not have noticed this as an issue. Dividing the 'core' up into more 'virtual cores' than you have will mean the CPU will probably be used more evenly, but if it gets stuck on that one bit of the render which is slow, you will find it will still be a sticking block. Plus then the CPU's cores are having to do a lot of context switching, to pretend to be more than 1 core, which can slow things down a little.

With the perspective camera it will reallocate new sections of the render to a core dynamically. You can see this happening in adaptive sample renders. It's a much more elegant and modern method of doing it, short of doing bucket rendering :)
that explains a lot :thumbsup: