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Kevbarnes
03-18-2009, 04:49 PM
1. MODELER -BiasVmaps don’t seem to be saved when generating fibre guides in modeler. A map appears momentarily in the list and this can be assigned to the surface but cannot be seen in Open GL.
I’ve checked out William video but it doesn’t work in 9.6 – unless I’m missing something.

2. LAYOUT Edit Guides is of little use in layout if you intend to animate the character – I have just spent half a day brushing hair into the desired contours – which looks fine at frame 0 and 1 but try animating the character and the whole lot just twists out of register with the mesh surface.- unless of course, I’m missing something here to?.

3 I have also made guide geometry in modeller for a surface with morphs – is there a way to make the guides deform along with the action of the morph – have tried metalink
Unless I remake the morphs an d include the guide aswell?


Thanks for any advice, regards

Kev

jerel
04-01-2009, 11:24 PM
This is a good question Kev, I've been wondering the same thing. I hopw someone has the answer.

Kevbarnes
04-03-2009, 12:23 PM
Hi Jerel

I managed to do it all using weight maps in the end. I used one with negative and positive weights for the gravity setting, Controling it with gradient - it works ok but I would like a better solution, I'm experimenting with DP Node Kit at the moment

WCameron
04-04-2009, 05:19 AM
The Biasmap thing was fixed in one of the betas, is it really broken again? Argh! Will test it out shortly....


- Will.

WCameron
04-05-2009, 09:25 AM
Its working for me in both 64 and 32 bit windows flavors of 9.6....

- Will.

Kevbarnes
04-06-2009, 12:21 PM
Its working for me in both 64 and 32 bit windows flavors of 9.6 - Will.

I'll have another try at generating a bias V map - thanks for checking this out

WCameron
04-08-2009, 01:17 PM
actually. it works. SOMETIMES. and the problem is i cant seem to replicate the exact steps to get it to work consistantly.
This is very frustrating, as it DID work as advertised about 2 Betas before 9.6 final.

As A test try this so we can rule out MY system playing silly games on me (as its wont to do recently.)

64 bit, using the HUB -
Load in a nice subd'ed head into modeler.
Go to FFX, hide all the geometry you want to hide, Grow fibers
on a surface (I tend to use the One Per Polygon option, but it does not seem to make a difference).
Spend some time droping guides onto the geometry and styling your hair.
go out of FFX. at this point you can check to see if you do have a BVMap by going to the Surface editor/Advanced tab on your hair surface. Add it under Vertex Color Map - yep it shows up. doesnt display in Open GL though....
Save out your object. Send it to Layout (I'm using the HUB this time, usually i run without it).
Apply FFX to your object, isolate it to a particular surface and BAM, no BVMap.

And from this point i cant seem to duplicate how exactly i got the damned thing working before....


ARGH! ARGH! ARGH!

Will try the same procedure on 32x when i get home......

- Will.

Kevbarnes
04-08-2009, 05:26 PM
And from this point i cant seem to duplicate how exactly i got the damned thing working before.....

This is exactlyy the procedure I have used and I get the same result on 32 bit. and so far I havnt been able to retain a vmap at all. also tried creating Map first but this dos'nt work either

WCameron
04-09-2009, 12:12 PM
Ok heres an update. these are the exact steps I just used to get it to work.
this is on 9.6, X64, running modeler and layout with the hub active. Oh also
this is on a windows machine (quad core 2.3 gig, Nvidia 8800 gfx card, 64 bits, 2 gig
of memory).

Open Modeler, create a ball. open surface editor, create a new surface (hair to be generic) set smoothing on. close surface editor.
Open setup/FiberFX. grow hair (1 per polygon). droped 6
guides down set to Sharp Wide (I'll clarify here. I'm not as up on FFX as I'd like to be, so osme of the ins and outs of the actually system are a bit of a mystery, but what i mean by this is - I drop a guide, Click on the Root of it, which is blue at this point, which places a circle of influence around the root, I click a few more times until the circles dissapear and the root is RED. I dont thikn This step matters too much but who knows!), more or less down the middle of one edge of the sphere (IE making a part in the hair as it were). Exited out of FFX.
At this point if you go to the C button (Selection Sets) you can see theres an SURFACENAME_normalmap_0. I left this selected (again, dunno if it matters but there you are)
Saved the object (iteration one).
DELETED (not Cut - but i dunno if that makes a difference either) both the 2 point polychain hair, and the 'guides'
Saved as iteration 2.
'SENT' this object to layout (at this point Layout was NOT opened. the Send operation opened layout).
In layout I opened the Surface Editor, went to the Advanced tab and the BVMap was there in the Vertex Colormap dropdown.
So I added it (and low and behold it showed up in both Layout and Modelers opengl now :-)
Went to Image Processing, added FiberFX, activated it, set the Surface and the VMap, rendered, lickity split, it all works.
Saved the SCENE in modeler.
Shut down modeler, layout and the hub.
Reopened layout and the hub.
Reloaded the saved scene. low and behold it reloads in
with the BVMap.

I dont have a lot of time at the moment to jigger with the variations of that but atleast its a workflow that seems to work.

Lemme know if that works for you.

- Will.

Kevbarnes
04-12-2009, 06:05 AM
Lemme know if that works for you.

Hi WCameron

Just followed your notes everything ok down to iteration 2.
ie modelled Hair using Guides – OK’d in FFX, this showed a selected NAME_Normalmap_0 in ‘C’. I then saved the object, and sent to Layout but this VMap is not showing up in the advanced surface vColour Map selection.

It is still visible in modeller at this point attributed to the surface in ‘Modeler’ Surface Editor. If I de-select the vMap in the Modeler Vertex Window as listed under Texture it just disappears, if I then Revert or reload object the Texture vMap is not shown

Basically the map name is being generated but no data or colour is being generated to the vMap and therefore not saved – its like when you create a morph and not move any points, its an empty vMap.

I tried this with GL MultitextureShaders and GLSLShaders just in case? but got the same thing.

Dont know if this is 32bit prob or just my machine - I'll test it again at work on tues

WCameron
04-13-2009, 11:36 AM
Hmm. seems to be a 32 bit thing as it fails for me too. weird.
However it seems to be ok if you do it like this:
Load in your model, style it using guides etc. exit out of
FiberFactory styler, then push the C button in the lower right and
select your Vmap in the drop down.
Go to the MAP tab, under Edit Maps select COPY Vertex Map give the new
vmap a name and click ok.
delete your splines and guides, and save your object.
Now if you load the object back into modeler the 2 vmaps seem to be
preserved. ditto if you load it into Layout or send it over via the hub.

Seems like it needs an extra push somewhere to actually save the vmaps.
I wish there was a free solution to allow saving and loading in of Vertex Color
maps.

- Will.

WCameron
04-13-2009, 02:44 PM
Ah forget it, dont bother sometimes THAT doesnt even work.

- Will.
I'm done. I guess Softimage it is then.

Kevbarnes
04-14-2009, 11:53 AM
FiberFactory styler, then push the C button in the lower right and select your Vmap in the drop down.
Go to the MAP tab, under Edit Maps select COPY Vertex Map give the new
vmap a name and click ok.

Yup, Tried that one to - I trust it will get fixed in update

Thanks for spending the time to work through it - have you tried animating a mesh with FFX yet.

Check this thread http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96632

WCameron
04-17-2009, 10:00 AM
I thnk i figured it out. i got it working properly last night,
but being half asleep (and quite frankly tiered of messing with it)
I'm lost again this morning. heh.

But by the end of the day i should have it sussed.
(fingers crossed).

- Will.

WCameron
04-17-2009, 08:09 PM
Ok,the character in my short is a subdivided mesh, with about 6 surfaces. this is the method i got Biasmaps to work consistantly.
theres one caviat (sp?). I dont know WHY this happens,
but sometimes, in order for it to work, you actually have to shut modeler and the hub down, go do something for 5 minutes, then come back start it all up again and give it another go.
I think this is an issue with this machine - which has a host of other issues :-)

anyways the keys to getting it to work seem to be -
Only have 1 object on the First layer, and all other layers empty.
Have your default subpatch division level to 1 (push o in modeler) and Polygons set to Quadrangles.
Dont have your geometry subpatched when you take it into Fiber Factor.
Imediately on exiting fiberfactory SAVE your object (with a different name! heh).
from here if you go to the surface and advanced tab the new vbmap should show up in the ogl window. If it doesnt
... um ... well ...

So heres an exact rundown of what i did.

Loaded in my character head. Selected all the polygons
of the surface i wanted to Hair. CUT them and pasted them
into a new object at Layer 1 (or layer 0 -you know the first one!). Saved that object with a new name.
Turned off Subpatches. Set default subpatch level to 1
(I dont think this is required but..... jeeze is that an echo....)
Took that into Fiberfactory, set up some hair like normal
(1 strand per polrgon, dropped a bunch of guides to style it,etc). OK'ed out of FF.
Saved the object.
Loaded the normalmap surface onto the surface and wala it showed up. Works over in layout too.

God I hope that works for ya! heh.

- Will.

Kevbarnes
04-19-2009, 03:42 AM
anyways the keys to getting it to work seem to be -
Only have 1 object on the First layer, and all other layers empty.
Have your default subpatch division level to 1 (push o in modeler) and Polygons set to Quadrangles.
Dont have your geometry subpatched when you take it into Fiber Factor.
Imediately on exiting fiberfactory SAVE your object (with a different name! heh) Will.

Hi Will

Yes I got it to work - tried again and it failed?. I think your sussed it with the the subpatch setting in modeler. I shall try combination settings to understand why it is not consistant.?

Kev

WCameron
04-19-2009, 08:04 AM
Yeah its really weird. theres some kind of floating factor wherein you have to shut down modeler/layout/the hub and reopen it again.
I'm wondering if maybe setting the Config files to Read Only might bea help.

but atleast we kinda have a workflow! now to get it working consistantly. heh.


- Will.

pjp
04-24-2009, 04:16 AM
I have been following this post as I am attempting to create a realistic Puffin at the moment, a couple of things I have noticed to get the job moving are;

1) Make sure your Layout Subdiv level remains the same as when you create any guides in Modeller.

2) When creating your Bias VMap do it all at once. I had done the map for the head and attempted to copy this and combine it with further FFX on the body. Needless to say I couldnt get multiple vmaps to save. Also a good UV map applied before you start modelling FibreFX seems to help it save correctly/at all. Also, bias VMaps was the only way I could find of keeping the styling AND furr attached properly.

3) Screamernet - Not sure why this is but if I attempt to render FFX using sceamernet I HAVE to restart my SN Nodes before doing so. Otherwise I get a complete crash...Not only that but my scene file is altered to the point where I cant re-open it in LW.

E.g. Pre SN Crash - Sc01_FFX = 740k
Post SN Crash - Sc01_FFX = 3.2Mb (and utterly corrupt.)

This is all combined with an animated mesh, normal mappings etc etc. Will post something asap.

FFX definietly seems a little flakey right now so being methodical and as careful as possible is a given...good luck!

pjp
04-24-2009, 07:53 AM
another thing... I dont seem to be able to "Edit Guides" in layout to tweak the fibre, whilst im using a vMap.. crashes out and corrupts the scene...

WCameron
04-24-2009, 11:20 AM
Good info! Thanks for that.

styling guides in layout with a vbmapped object works
ok for me in 64 and 32 bit 9.6.

Although i did just nuke all my configs and rebuild them. So a week ago it might have been the same for me.


- Will.

pjp
05-07-2009, 09:54 AM
heres my first FFX project..
http://www.catalystpics.co.uk/projects/puffin/Comp_Test_00132.png

Kevbarnes
05-08-2009, 11:06 AM
Really good looking charactor - good job.

Are all the feathers on the body FFx or have you combined them with a base texture. the profile of the body looks smooth so I'm assuming this is mainly textured.

what are you intending to use this for - are you animating it or is it for stills?

inkpen3d
05-10-2009, 01:55 PM
I am currently working on a project for a client where I need to represent electric current flowing along field lines. FiberFX does the job nicely, well except for when I try to network render (using Amleto). Here's the FogBuz report (22785) that I submitted...

"Using the Node Editor in the layout FiberFX, I have placed an animated texture onto fibers (alternating bands of colour that run up the fibers as the animation progresses). The scene renders out okay on a single PC, but when network rendered, the bands of colour no longer run up the fibers in an orderly fashion, but vary in size, direction/velocity of motion."

Fortunately, the animation is only 500 frames at the moment, so I can render on a single machine.

Anyone had other odd behaviour with FFX when network rendering?

Regards,
Peter

pjp
05-11-2009, 03:05 AM
Hi all, thnx for comments..

Re: KevB: Yep, there are 3 high res texture map created from zbrush, Feet, Body and Head, each with Norm maps and disp maps. We found we simply preferred the less "wrinkly-real" flavour of puffin, a little more child friendly i guess.. It is intended for film animation but we are only at the early stages..http://www.catalystpics.co.uk/projects/puffin/promopuffin.mov

Re: Inkpen: There is a cfg file created when using SN called "surfaceparm.cfg". Make sure this is available and not being corrupted. Also creating a fresh cfg file from lightwave, (including clearing all plugins and re-adding them! Set the exact number of nodes in the LW SN panel too.) and then restart your SN nodes. Also I did find that upping the AA level had undesirable results too...hehe, fun and games eh...

hope some of this helps your prob!

Kevbarnes
05-11-2009, 12:02 PM
It is intended for film animation but we are only at the early stages..http://www.catalystpics.co.uk/projects/puffin/promopuffin.mov

This Looks really good I love the character voice. You have the actions down to a tee. Some nice lip-syncing there as well, hard to emphasize phonemes with a beak!

One thing, the eyes remained a bit static as you came in for a close-ups, I expected to see a blink.

Really good.