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OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 08:56 AM
Firstly I have been using LW solid now for a year now, and the moment I'm loving the user friendly interface , the software , pluggins and additional material and help from users like yourself .
But here's the catch .......................

I'm finishing my honors year "4rth year in 3D Animation & Digital Art " based in Glasgow I have an array of certificates and qualifications , from project management to Advance CGI . as for now i have completed my first 6 months of the course passing with A's and only another 6 weeks left , so inturn i should get a first class "the best you can get " hopefully . other than that i can not pursue my education any higher unless I doctor in the subject , which is my attentions , but even at that its only 1 more year to go . and then people will have to call me Doctor Scott " how cool is that "

But this is my concerns ....

The UK film and Game industry really heavily on MAX ,Maya or XSI you can get the whole Autodesk theme here .

Again I use LW and enjoy it by default , but the fact is that i need to re-educate myself in another software package , which in respect all good 3D artist should have a wide array of skills .

So why do the UK market use Autodesk products ? and not Newtek , i feel slightly conned by my University teaching LW by default , although atm they are considering in moving to Maya for future students .

I suppose this post has no point or relevance to how the world spins but i just wanted to let Newtek know that there slowly losing people in UK market and I'm not the only person in my class that feels this way .]

Stef

p.s the baby name things not forgotten ,just on hold , complications .............


Cheers

3DGFXStudios
03-03-2009, 09:10 AM
Knowing other packages is always a good thing. I'm also a maya user but most of the time I use lightwave. Especially for modeling. What I mean is just use the package that is most suitable for the job. There are also a lot of company's that have a lightwave license lying around just because it's handy (and cheap) I think Newtek is also winning new users with their new lightwave CORE.........

Titus
03-03-2009, 09:13 AM
I'm also a Maya, LW and Blender user. I can't see a problem.

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 09:28 AM
ye Titus you live in another country , when i graduate i will freelance while i go for my PHD , and i do belive using any kind of 3D application is an advantage , hence why im hardcore in zbrush atm . but it comes down to that fact that the UK market uses Autodesk which means i have a decision , spend my cash on Core or buy Maya for future employment opps .

Otterman
03-03-2009, 09:40 AM
The way i see it, ul be entering into a market that has predominant maya trained artists.....with lightwave under you belt also ul have an advantage!

I wouldnt rule out lightwave.....for a freelancer, it very flexible and gets the job done. All this at a fraction of the cost of Maya!

mattclary
03-03-2009, 09:42 AM
it comes down to that fact that the UK market uses Autodesk

Correction: The PLANET uses Autodesk.

buh bye! Good luck in all your endeavors, and drop us a postcard some time!:thumbsup:

kopperdrake
03-03-2009, 10:01 AM
I definitely wouldn't drop LW to focus on another - keep both going. I've freelanced for years with no problems with LightWave - sometimes it's for LW houses glad to see another LW user, often it's for end clients who don't give a rat's what software you use. If course if you're looking at games then learn something else, but if you learn Maya be prepared to also learn Max at some stage - all depends on the company - they might even use LW! And you'll likely also be learning an inhouse system too - I had to use LW, Max and an inhouse system in my relatively short 3 years in games.

What I'm trying to say is if you see freelance as being a part of your future then keep LW, in my experience and talking to others it's one of the best packages that gives you almost everything in one package, is easy to bosh something decent out in and is relatively affordable to keep updating as a freelancer.

Good luck in the path you take :)

Titus
03-03-2009, 10:02 AM
ye Titus you live in another country , when i graduate i will freelance while i go for my PHD , and i do belive using any kind of 3D application is an advantage , hence why im hardcore in zbrush atm . but it comes down to that fact that the UK market uses Autodesk which means i have a decision , spend my cash on Core or buy Maya for future employment opps .

As stated before me, the whole world use autodesk. I run my own, petit studio, and use the software I want. Most clients usually ask me if I have Maya and when I say we are a LW shop some of them don't like it, or say: "oh! you have Amigas".

I'm 36 now and don't have the energy to learn every app out there, but I can't find a problem learning two or three. Actually I'm starting AnimationMentor this month and this means I'm gonna use Maya a lot and for USD$400 the educational license it's a bargain.

Titus
03-03-2009, 10:10 AM
I'm remembering that not only clients sometimes go away, once in a while some prospect employee don't want to work with me because they know Maya and don't want to learn LW.

dwburman
03-03-2009, 10:10 AM
Yeah, I intend to spend a good bit of March getting up to speed on Maya for two reasons. 1. a long term client purchased it for me to use and 2. there are a lot more job listings for people who know Maya and Max. Hopefully, learning Maya will go easier for you than it has for me. I have 10+ years of LW habits and you only have 1. :D

Here's something I've been thinking about recently, and it's nothing new. Are we hired to make pretty (or cool) pictures or are we hired to push buttons? What will the software we're using look like in 10 years? 20 years? What if your favorite apps gets phased out or is no longer a viable option in the marketplace? Things like a sense of shape, composition, color theory, composition, timeliness (what is fashionable at the moment), animation timing, anticipation, sense of weight, etc. are all parts of the process that will not change. Tools will change and we need to know how to use them, but ultimately we'll be hired based on our 'eye' and not our fingers.

Of course, that's overgeneralizing quite a bit. There are a lot of technical jobs that require more problem solving skills than an artistic touch and there will be projects that won't give you enough time to finish them properly. The thing is that perhaps animators would be better off taking dance lessons than learning the ins and outs of their favorite app... but of course you need to know the basics of how to use it.

And if you're a generalist you need to know it all. :D

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 10:34 AM
I suppose im at a slight advantage being new to LW the transition for LW to MAX or maya shouldn't be that Hard mwahahahahah , i look at the GUI in Maya and think "why ? " it might aswel be in durka durka .

Surrealist.
03-03-2009, 11:37 AM
Good luck on it. I think as an artist, you have to stay fluent to survive. If I had the money, I would buy Maya. Firstly because it seems that there is a huge market out there for it as an artist. And secondarily because I think it is used for a reason. It has the tools to get the job done at a professional production level, now.

With the current version of LW, I don't think NT could get any more share of the market. I think it would slip. They are doing the right thing now but it will take some time.

I also agree with the others, you'll still find work with LightWave.

Tough decision on what to invest in now but I would lean toward what has a market share for artists currently. If that should shift, you are at least working, making good money and can go with it.

One word of advice, if I could be to bold as to give it, would be as an artist, never shy away from learning something new, always stay flexible and never get stuck in a rut of one software, or a certain group of software nor get into the habit of discounting things just because they are different.

If you can do that you'll always stay working.

Caveboy
03-03-2009, 11:59 AM
I think that Maya\Max\XSi will be replaced by a single Autodesk product that they have been working since they acquired Max a couple years ago. They own those apps anyway - why would they waste resources in a deflated market? Learn what you can and try and be flexible when possible.
I wouldn't toss out the baby (Lightwave) with the bath water.

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 12:10 PM
Im not making Lw reduntant , theres things LW can do that Maya cant and vice-versa , the whole reason i use Lw is because the University lecture in it . but again there talking about moving to Maya .

The main reason i like LW to Maya is the seperate Layout and Mod .

cresshead
03-03-2009, 12:17 PM
I think that Maya\Max\XSi will be replaced by a single Autodesk product that they have been working since they acquired Max a couple years ago. They own those apps anyway - why would they waste resources in a deflated market? Learn what you can and try and be flexible when possible.
I wouldn't toss out the baby (Lightwave) with the bath water.

autodesk CREATED 3dsmax back in 1995...they've always owned it..

autodesk aquired maya in 2005
autodesk aquired softimage last year

cresshead
03-03-2009, 12:19 PM
Im not making Lw reduntant , theres things LW can do that Maya cant and vice-versa , the whole reason i use Lw is because the University lecture in it . but again there talking about moving to Maya .

The main reason i like LW to Maya is the seperate Layout and Mod .

if i were to pick a second appto lightwave and wanted to hit the ground running rathe than hit a wall with my head...i'd pick max [and did btw]

3dsmax is by FAR an easier app to pick up than maya.:cat:

biliousfrog
03-03-2009, 12:19 PM
There's a lot of studios in the UK using Lightwave for TV, film, commercials etc. I wouldn't just drop it. Sure Maya and XSI get used a lot for animation but you'd probably be surprised at the amount of places rendering in Lightwave because it's fast, looks great and is extremely cheap...compare a farm of 100 nodes using mental ray!

It all depends on what you plan to do, if it's games then Max is probably a safe bet, for effects Maya or Houdini...look at the places you want to work and ask around, you'd probably be surprised.

biliousfrog
03-03-2009, 12:25 PM
autodesk CREATED 3dsmax back in 1995...they've always owned it..

autodesk aquired maya in 2005
autodesk aquired softimage last year

I started on Kinetix 3d studio max, I've only just learnt that it was part of Autodesk. I always assumed that it was a different company bought by Discreet and then by Autodesk but it was them all along.....something new every day.

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 12:39 PM
This is why Blender gets more appealling everyday , I have 2 grand about $2600 saved up , my reward for XNA game 9th in UK and 15th in US XBOX community ,so i will use this as ROI for software , i want to be legit . which is unusual for a Scottish person lol . but at the moment im struggling with work and life . but arent we all ?

Paul_Boland
03-03-2009, 01:10 PM
Congratulations on completing your 3D course. I wish there was something like that here in Waterford, Ireland. I'd love to do a 3D graphics course. If I had the money, I'd love to go to DAVE School in Orlando Florida.

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 01:26 PM
Theres only 3 main places in Scotland where u can do Animation , Dundee probably the best , Glasgow and Edinburgh . if i wanted to go somewhere it would Vanc Film School VFS .

beverins
03-03-2009, 01:34 PM
Firstly I have been using LW solid now for a year now, and the moment I'm loving the user friendly interface , the software , pluggins and additional material and help from users like yourself .
But here's the catch .......................

I'd recommend not "switching" so much as ADDING. I know that Maya is fairly expensive and selling LW might help to defray the cost... but most of the same places that say "we use maya" also fail to divulge unless directly questioned about a certain interface seen on their monitor that they use Lightwave for rendering...

PIPELINES are all where it's at, I don't care what your school teaches you that Maya is all there is, ever was, and always will be.

beverins
03-03-2009, 01:38 PM
And to be perfectly honest, I'd choose Softimage or 3DSMax over Maya. Maya is great if you like scripting. It is, essentially, a programming language with a GUI on top of it. If you aren't into scripting and text, I really would not recommend Maya.... most of its infinite power lies in scripting.

Chris S. (Fez)
03-03-2009, 02:05 PM
A phrase I have used often over the years: Do you want it done in Maya or do you want it done by the end of the day?

kopperdrake
03-03-2009, 02:14 PM
A reason I wouldn't to Maya ^^ I know Maya TDs who live inside Mel, and it shows by the bruises on their foreheads, but it's the only off-the-shelf package that you can twist to a more bespoke solution. LightWave on the other hand is perfect for a dinky studio like us where one size fits all, and if it doesn't quite fit then you can use a shoehorn.

As for a freelancer, I'd probably recommend adding Max to the LW equation - not so heavy to create stuff in for short sharp projects, still gets used in games a lot (Maya is catching up as games get heavier on the old pipelines so I hear), and is used through a lot of potential freelancing gig industries.

I do hate Max though...if I were to change it would have been to XSI, but there's no need :)

OnlineRender
03-03-2009, 03:14 PM
Ive decided to get MAX , ill wait to the end of summer before i purchase ,tbh theres alot of things i need to learn with LW first ,but i belive I am getting stronger every time i sit at the PC . my goal is to gain employment with Rockstar North , weither it be a game tester or moddeler and i know for a fact that you need motion builder under belt , so there another piece i need to learn , damn software so expensive , need to sell one of my kids on fleebay at this rate

Surrealist.
03-03-2009, 04:44 PM
Ive decided to get MAX , ill wait to the end of summer before i purchase ,tbh theres alot of things i need to learn with LW first ,but i belive I am getting stronger every time i sit at the PC . my goal is to gain employment with Rockstar North , weither it be a game tester or moddeler and i know for a fact that you need motion builder under belt , so there another piece i need to learn , damn software so expensive , need to sell one of my kids on fleebay at this rate


I am a member of a couple of job posting boards and from that information I can definitely say that Maya is at the top of the list for Jobs. Maybe before you make a final decision you could also get on some job posting boards and get a feel for what is out there. Just have a look for yourself and see what you think.

Good luck in any case. :)

zapper1998
03-03-2009, 07:40 PM
I do all I can in LW then export it to 3DMax...

mattclary
03-03-2009, 09:16 PM
autodesk CREATED 3dsmax back in 1995...they've always owned it..


lol! THANK you! Or hell, go back farther to "3D Studio"...

probiner
03-03-2009, 11:07 PM
In my college its Lightwave for artists and 3DMax for Industrial Design. Altough guys from animation eventually fall to Maya. Some never user Lw again, only for renders.

geo_n
03-03-2009, 11:09 PM
This is why Blender gets more appealling everyday , I have 2 grand about $2600 saved up , my reward for XNA game 9th in UK and 15th in US XBOX community ,so i will use this as ROI for software , i want to be legit . which is unusual for a Scottish person lol . but at the moment im struggling with work and life . but arent we all ?

Blender is good but how many studios are using it?

Two roads. Freelance or employee.

Lightwave for freelance. Affordable and powerful. Gets the job done. Good renderer and top modeller.

Maya/max/xsi for employee. If you want to be as good as you can and work for studios like weta, pixar then you have to know atleast the tools they use.

For me its hard to rely on freelance only.Japan has the best artists in the world. Hard to compete. Lw for side job. Max for work. :D

cresshead
03-03-2009, 11:27 PM
regards max demo...go get the curent 30 day demo NOW for 3dsmax and 3dsmax design...as the new versions are due in 2 weeks time....so you'd get 120 days total demo time with the 4 versions and that would see you thru to the summer for then buying 3dsmax with 4 months learning under your belt already.

DiedonD
03-04-2009, 12:22 AM
Dount thraw Laightwavn awey jast fer som laussy Maya or Maxs!

If yer be an yar awn, as a freelancer lad, ya'll need to knauw most of 3D apps out there! Not jast faucus on one!

Aside of the mattr, one app daz one thing baetter than the other!
__________________________________________________ __________

Hows my Scottish accent typing? :)

And good luck on having your PhD on arts, Doctor Scott!

cresshead
03-04-2009, 01:15 AM
Dount thraw Laightwavn awey jast fer som laussy Maya or Maxs!

If yer be an yar awn, as a freelancer lad, ya'll need to knauw most of 3D apps out there! Not jast faucus on one!

Aside of the mattr, one app daz one thing baetter than the other!
__________________________________________________ __________

Hows my Scottish accent typing? :)

And good luck on having your PhD on arts, Doctor Scott!

simply awful!:lol:

DiedonD
03-04-2009, 01:18 AM
simply awful!:lol:

Nah, your just saying that cause Ive called your beloved Max as loussy!

When in fact I shouldve called it 'Biggest growing cancer on earth' :D

I reject your evaluation of my Scottish accent typing, on grounds of subjectivity, conflict of interest judgement and beeing too biased!

Anyone else!

:D

kopperdrake
03-04-2009, 01:37 AM
To be honest I thought you were trollied :D

My second guess was it was a Yorkshire attempt, so close ;)

DiedonD
03-04-2009, 02:04 AM
To be honest I thought you were trollied :D

My second guess was it was a Yorkshire attempt, so close ;)

Northern England!

Dont say!

Its these letters really! Im far better when speaking in Scottish Accent!

Oh alright... Ill accept defeat :thumbsdow

It seems theres tons of more work for one to truly master the art of Scottish accent! And I wont stop until I get there! Thats a promise :D

Iain
03-04-2009, 02:13 AM
FWIW, I think you're quite right.
Most of the viz companies around here have asked if I'd be interested in working for them but when I say I'm a LW user, they just kind of disappear.:)

On the other hand, if you're good enough, the few LW houses out there will find you and approach you as you tend to stand out a little.

Your LW knowledge will always be useful as most studios use multiple apps and LW is still a popular choice for rendering.


btw, Newtek are well aware of the market and their place in it, hence the radical upgrade of 9.x and now Core!

akademus
03-04-2009, 02:14 AM
Maya, XSI AND Lightwave here. As much as I'm LW fanboy, I simply have to do some stuff in XSI and CA in Maya. Work and course requirements.

Only down side so far is that I constantly hit wrong shortcuts :D

mattclary
03-04-2009, 06:24 AM
Ive decided to get MAX , ill wait to the end of summer before i purchase ,tbh theres alot of things i need to learn with LW first ,but i belive I am getting stronger every time i sit at the PC . my goal is to gain employment with Rockstar North , weither it be a game tester or moddeler and i know for a fact that you need motion builder under belt , so there another piece i need to learn , damn software so expensive , need to sell one of my kids on fleebay at this rate

Hey, go read this:

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showpost.php?p=844494&postcount=12

mattclary
03-04-2009, 06:29 AM
To be honest I thought you were trollied :D

My second guess was it was a Yorkshire attempt, so close ;)

Sounded southern to me, but, guess that makes sense, when you think about it.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_American_English)

DiedonD
03-04-2009, 06:59 AM
Nah Southern US would be more like:

'Nauw haow the h-iell do yeou knauw that am from South!' and my favorite

'Boa (Boy :) ) , deou yeou knauw hauw deid your mamma die when giving birth to ya? Yauvv Shaaayme!!' - Where Art Thou

Scottish is more like:

'Dis is moayne!" - Commandos

"Tarrible, mate, tarrrible" A scottish driver we had here working for the Beeb immediately after the war

"Throws fouyre balls from his eiyes, and laightnin balls from his ar-rse!" - Braveheart

OnlineRender
03-04-2009, 11:10 AM
Im dyslexic and even I can't understand that Scottish typin , ye ken wit a mean (",) LoL.
I think i will persue Max "first",either way im giving Autodesk my cash , as for free 120 day demo , smart thinking batman .

I'm setting up an animation company in the summer based in Glasgow , my backgrounds more VFX and Editting , I have done some camera work for BBC and STV , also i get to take hot American students for the Edinburgh frienge , part of FOX network intership , but thats another matter .

Im not the best animator in world , but i have only been physically using LW for a year , and i can create some good imagery , Obv not as good as the people here (",) .

I have good working knowledge of how the world spin's , and i thank Glasgow for showing me these dark things .

I don't want to be one of these people who takes on a project I cant handdle , i will look at the project scope and if i cant handle it will outsource or pass it on, which means people like you , obv i will employe people that are homegrown , but if i need something special i will post on forums and use my social networking skills , which may I say my sexy Scottish accent helps (",) .

I have done well for myself and my family are proud which means more than any certificate i have gained . i live in what is callled a deprived area , basically people around me are skint .
You dont get breaks in this industry you have to work hard and take the rough with the smooth , and for the last 4 years its been rough , so i should get a turn sometime ???

for artist like me , hold on in there , your day will come .

Right im away to sell a kidney