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cresshead
02-05-2009, 03:05 PM
http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/blogs_ken/blog_detail/mystery_images_and_video_posted/P10/

- Anti-aliasing
- Exposure control (tonemapping)
- Ambient occlusion effects
- Depth-of-field
- Bump-mapping
- Soft shadows

??..in the viewport...realtime..?

cool, good to see autodesk hasn't gone to sleep now they have the 3 major apps out of 4...
looks like they've used some viewport drawing tech from mudbox 2009 into 3dsmax 2010 i think.

newtek are you seeing this?

come back swinging and a kicking with lightwave core!:newtek:

http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=69401&d=1233871391

jaxtone
02-05-2009, 04:16 PM
This sounds fantastic!

r10k
02-05-2009, 07:08 PM
You could do that with XSI right now, by integrating an existing realtime engine into the viewports.

It's not XSI, though :)

kfinla
02-05-2009, 07:17 PM
It looks like MAX got all the real-time tech Mudbox 2009 has.

mosconariz
02-05-2009, 08:30 PM
:Tricaster

cresshead
02-05-2009, 09:26 PM
You could do that with XSI right now, by integrating an existing realtime engine into the viewports.

It's not XSI, though :)

well yeah you can get realtime engines and pixel shaders etc in max too if you can afford or ARE a game studio! and can program their tech!...

this looks like as someone has already pointed out like mudbox 2009 tech brought into 3dsmax...no doubt will arrive for maya and autodesk xsi too.

see..autodesk NEED lightwave and modo and cinema4d plus houdini to stay on their toes and keep r&d going and not just sit there...

competition pushes EVERYONE forward

mosconariz
02-05-2009, 10:06 PM
competition pushes EVERYONE forward

No, competition pushes forward only the ones that are competitive. The others, which felt asleep, are not that lucky... I know you know that but I just wanted to point it out. :ohmy:

cresshead
02-06-2009, 06:12 AM
more teasers...!

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=sausalitoman&view=videos

biliousfrog
02-06-2009, 06:49 AM
We used to have that with FPrime :(

cresshead
02-06-2009, 07:43 AM
yeah it's Brilliant that Autodesk and luxology BOTH feel the need to fire off some secrets of their own when the newtek core countdown started to gather such 'pace' around the net...they really do feel newtek is a major player in getting NEW users and having other users migrate from under the autodesk/luxology wing...just maybe eh!

cresshead
02-06-2009, 07:45 AM
We used to have that with FPrime :(

but fprime nerver ever worked with EVERYTHING and actually fprime's best bet now is to get on lwcore and finally make it do everything.

cresshead
02-06-2009, 08:46 AM
screenshot of 3dsmax design 2010

http://www.vizdepot.com/images/temp/LightAnalysis.jpg

tyrot
02-06-2009, 11:14 AM
dear cress

i know you will say ..."vaporware" but i saw miracles with beta Pim...mmm years ago. So technically :) LW had that feature even with its old core...ENKI!!!! WHERE ARE YOU???...:)

Best

AbnRanger
02-06-2009, 02:25 PM
well yeah you can get realtime engines and pixel shaders etc in max too if you can afford or ARE a game studio! and can program their tech!...

this looks like as someone has already pointed out like mudbox 2009 tech brought into 3dsmax...no doubt will arrive for maya and autodesk xsi too.

see..autodesk NEED lightwave and modo and cinema4d plus houdini to stay on their toes and keep r&d going and not just sit there...

competition pushes EVERYONE forward
This certainly is a step forward, but when you couple LW CORE's Houdini-esque capabilities with a deeply integrated FPrime and/or TrueArt's Preview renderer that allows realtime VOLUMETRIC render previewing, that's going to knock off the shininess of this Mudbox tech...which is an approximation (you still have to render with GI and all).

The reason Max's 3rd party community is so vast is not simply due to the larger userbase...it's because it's SDK was wide open to 3rd parties. The same kit Max in-house developers were using was the same 3rd parties had access to. So, when a plugin was made, it was essentially building directly into Max, only limited to Max's limitations. Now that CORE is using the same wide-open SDK model, there will be a greater number of LW developers and more robust plugins.
You're going to see FPrime get shed those previous limitations. It's going to be as if it was developed in-house at Newtek. This is what has me excited. Plugins like Dynamite should be much more stable.

Earl
02-06-2009, 06:36 PM
yeah it's Brilliant that Autodesk and luxology BOTH feel the need to fire off some secrets of their own when the newtek core countdown started to gather such 'pace' around the net...they really do feel newtek is a major player in getting NEW users and having other users migrate from under the autodesk/luxology wing...just maybe eh!
Indeed, it was funny seeing Brad try to pretend that they planned on releasing information this week and that it was a complete coincidence. While I'm sure they were working on stuff, the CORE countdown was like a kick in the pants and they moved quick to put SOMETHING up in order to grab back some of the attention.

NewTek probably poses more of a threat to competitors than many users realize.

cresshead
02-06-2009, 07:07 PM
dear cress

i know you will say ..."vaporware" but i saw miracles with beta Pim...mmm years ago. So technically :) LW had that feature even with its old core...ENKI!!!! WHERE ARE YOU???...:)

Best

err FRak!

look at this!

http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/blogs_ken/blog_detail/announcement_3ds_max_design_2010/

cresshead
02-07-2009, 03:04 AM
more info>>

Graphite Modeling Tools
3ds Max Design 2010 takes its renowned polygon modeling tools to a whole new level. With at least 100 new tools for freeform design and advanced polygonal modeling, the Graphite modeling tools facilitate creativity and artistic freedom. Additionally, the Graphite tools are displayed in one central location, making it easier to find the tool you need for the job. Moreover, users can customize the tool display or hide the command panel and model in Expert Mode.

In addition to the many modeling and mapping tools available in previous versions of the software, the Graphite toolkit includes a number of completely new tools for such operations as:

o Sculpting with assorted brushes

o Quick re‐topologizing

o Granular polygon editing

o Locking transforms to any surface

o Freeform creation of vertices

o Modifying and creating smart selections

o Quick drawing of surfaces and shapes

o Quick transformations

Material Explorer

The productivity‐enhancing Material Explorer revolutionizes the way artists interact with objects and materials. Users can now quickly browse all materials in the scene, and view material properties and relationships. The Material Explorer also enables them to replace materials making it much easier to manage even highly complex scenes.

xView Mesh Analyzer

Validate your 3D models prior to export or rendering using the new xView mesh analyzer technology. Get an interactive view of where problems may lie to help you make crucial decisions. This key new tool makes testing of models and maps significantly faster and more efficient. Users can test or query for flipped faces, overlapping faces and unwelded vertices. They can also add their own specific tests and queries.

Viewport Canvas

New in 3ds Max Design 2010 is the ability for artists to paint on a 3D model directly in the Viewport. This means artists will be able to quickly create new maps or extend existing maps using brushes, blend modes, fill, clone and erase. The Viewport also provides quick updates for changes to textures made in Adobe® Photoshop® software.

ProBooleans Enhancements

A new Quadify modifier has been added to the 3ds Max Design ProBooleans toolset that enables modelers to clean up triangles in model for better subdivision and smoothing. A new Merge Boolean operation has also been added which lets them attach an object (or multiple objects) to another while maintaining the transforms, topology and modifier stacks of each object.

UVW Unwrap Enhancements

Manipulating UV maps in the Viewport is now as easy as modeling in the Viewport thanks to a significantly expanded 3ds Max Design UVW Unwrap toolset. New features include such UV Selection tools as Growing/Shrinking Rings and Loops, and quick editing tools for aligning, spacing, and stitching UVs.
***************

cresshead
02-07-2009, 03:15 AM
full press kit for max2010design

http://images.autodesk.com/adsk/files/3ds_max_design_2010_launch_press_materials.zip

Frank_Geppert
02-07-2009, 03:47 AM
Hm, this sounds interesting, it looks like there are perfect tools for game developers and other 3d artists. But still the price is too high for most small studios and hobby artists.

Even although I earn money with creating 3d models and 2 textures I dont find this a reasonable price. I had to work several months only for Autodesk.

But unfortunately the warez users will be happy again. Almost every noob uses Max. You can read that in all these game dev forums. First question is always how to convert max models created with the latest Max version.

Nemoid
02-07-2009, 03:55 AM
it seems to me that Autodesk is pushing alot Max and keeping behind Maya and XSI from a development POV now. what do you guys think? :D

AbnRanger
02-07-2009, 05:15 AM
it seems to me that Autodesk is pushing alot Max and keeping behind Maya and XSI from a development POV now. what do you guys think? :DNo, I don't think so. Each program still has it's own separate development department and product manager. Maya 2009 had more substantial upgrade features than Max 2009.

However, AD caught a lot of flak for relatively paltry features in the last 2 releases, so I'm sure they feel a lot of pressure to change that perception. Plus, Max has been outselling Maya and XSI combined, so that is AD's cashcow. If find it strange that Maya is seen as the dominant program in 3D when sales-wise it is far from it. Max just serves a very diverse range of markets.
There should be some real improvements in Max, starting with this release, because they were busy re-writing it the past few years, and now that it was completed with 2008, they have been able to turn their focus on features and functionality....not to mention they DOUBLED their development staff numbers well over a year ago.

Lightwave needed this new program architecture badly, and I personally think they swung for the fence on this one.

cresshead
02-07-2009, 05:46 AM
reading the full list, 3dsmax 2010 also appears to have new sculpting brushes and also painting with a link connection to photoshop as well....

lightwave core>>i'm hungry for more information...like really hungry!!!!

AbnRanger
02-07-2009, 06:16 AM
reading the full list, 3dsmax 2010 also appears to have new sculpting brushes and also painting with a link connection to photoshop as well....

lightwave core>>i'm hungry for more information...like really hungry!!!!I wonder if they licensed Joe Alter's LBrush:
http://www.lbrush.com/test/features.htm

or just stole the idea

cresshead
02-07-2009, 06:33 AM
I wonder if they licensed Joe Alter's LBrush:
http://www.lbrush.com/test/features.htm

or just stole the idea

well autodesk already own mudbox..so could have brushes from there..as max 2010 already looks to have had the viewport enhancments that mudbox2009 has...like ambient occlusion and tonemapping...

also max has had push/pull/smooth/revert brushes for many realeases already..maybe they just expanded them...

or they bought joe alter's l-brush!

whatever i'm looking forward to my subs on max to get 2010 in april

looks like a much better release than the damp squid of max 2009...which i used at heart internet but didn't install my copy at home...i stayed with max 2008..i'll probably throw max 2009 on my samsung net book just to have something on the move!

pluMmet
02-07-2009, 09:33 AM
Holy Cow! New features listed (http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/blogs_ken/blog_detail/announcement_3ds_max_design_2010/):
"o Bring your designs to life with realistic water, fire, smoke, and other particle effects with PFlowAdvanced, a comprehensive particle design system. PFlowAdvanced also includes the new PFlowElements library with at least 100 samples created by an industry-leading effects artist."

Philbert
02-07-2009, 09:57 AM
Not sure what exactly these Graphite tools are, I assume they're something like Mudbox. For sculpting I think I'll stick to volumetrics.

AbnRanger
02-07-2009, 10:09 AM
Holy Cow! New features listed (http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/blogs_ken/blog_detail/announcement_3ds_max_design_2010/):
"o Bring your designs to life with realistic water, fire, smoke, and other particle effects with PFlowAdvanced, a comprehensive particle design system. PFlowAdvanced also includes the new PFlowElements library with at least 100 samples created by an industry-leading effects artist."

That is essentially the same Particle Flow that has been in Max since v6, except it incorporates an additional "Toolbox 1"
http://www.turbosquid.com/FullPreview/index.cfm/ID/235453
http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/tutorials/tutorial_index/painting_particles_in_a_scene/

AbnRanger
02-07-2009, 10:23 AM
Not sure what exactly these Graphite tools are, I assume they're something like Mudbox. For sculpting I think I'll stick to volumetrics.

I'm still hoping that Andrew can create a LW CORE skinned version of 3DC or at least attempt to create a live link to LW's surfacing nodes in one of his upcoming releases. Now that CORE is written in C++, the realtime feedback through FPrime or TrueArt's Previewer should a possible.

cresshead
02-09-2009, 11:36 AM
drat..looks like 3dsmax has polyboost built in now...

http://area.autodesk.com/index.php/blogs_shane/blog_detail/100_new_modeling_features/

http://area.autodesk.com/blogs/qball/090208_1222/ribbon_maximized.jpg

vids>>
http://area.autodesk.com//blogs/qball/090208_1625/GraphiteModeling_01.flv
http://area.autodesk.com//blogs/qball/090208_1625/GraphiteModeling_02.flv
http://area.autodesk.com//blogs/qball/090208_1625/GraphiteModeling_03.flv
http://area.autodesk.com//blogs/qball/090208_1625/GraphiteModeling_04.flv

Philbert
02-09-2009, 01:31 PM
I'll just repost what I posted in the comments over there:


I’m not really very impressed. Retopo and painting seem to be lacking compared to 3D Coat, LightWave is still better at modeling (and rendering). Who knows how much better CORE will be. I find it funny how AD seems to be trying their best to make the viewport as small as possible to make more room for hieroglyphic buttons. On top of that it seems it would be cheaper to pick up copies of 3DC and LW.

I have used Polyboost in max before and still liked Modeler better.

cresshead
02-09-2009, 02:49 PM
of course those that have not acttually used 3dsmax for any length of time may not be aware of expert mode [ZERO u.i....ALL viewport] also may not realise that you can tear off bits such as JUST tools your woking with and drop them where you want also...and dock them where ever you want [sounds familiar??]

in the end whatever float ya boat..i use lightwave, max and zbrush..all are great apps in my time that i've spent with them.

also some people [me] really like icons and REALLY hate text buttons...once i've read a book i don;t want to read it over and over and over and over....well you get it!...icons are FASTER to find 'images you remember' are faster to find than words

mind you shortcuts are even better...oh and the 1 billionth time...you CAN have text based u.i. in max...i just wish people would remember that...but it's TEXT...hard to remember isn't it!!!

later!

cresshead
02-09-2009, 02:55 PM
Yes... it's vaporware of the highest order. :thumbsdow

actually is more like B.S-ware:devil:

AbnRanger
02-09-2009, 06:01 PM
I'll just repost what I posted in the comments over there:



I have used Polyboost in max before and still liked Modeler better.
Your preferences have nothing to do with the breadth of tools available in Polyboost. Max's own native tools are better in my opinion than modeler's...again, we're talking preference. There are some tools one has that the other does not, or steps it takes to complete the same task differs from tool to tool. Nevertheless, there's no way one can say that modeler's tools are as extensive as Max+Polyboost or now Max 2010. They aren't...that's why you have 3rd party tools from Sensei and Pictrix.

But when you add to the fact that Max's UI is getting some attention, along with Polyboost integrated, C.A.T. ($1k plugin), Particle Flow additions/enhancements, and Mudbox-esque realtime viewport GPU rendering, LW CORE couldn't have come at a better time.

wacom
02-09-2009, 07:38 PM
I'm having a hard time watching those videos because of the CMOS scanning errors. Wobbly dobbly doo.

Looks like some RT shaders to me- who knows. In the mr vs view port one...well mr wins hands down. Not sure if that's more about the user or not.

Nice to preview...still gonna have to render though to see what's really going on I guess...and how does it work with shader trees and the like?

EDIT:"The third generation of Review technology represents a major leap forward in viewport display, helping take the guesswork out of final renders. It offers support for ambient occlusion, High Dynamic Range Image (HDRI)-based lighting, soft shadows, hardware anti-aliasing, interactive exposure control, and the revolutionary mental mill® shader technology."

Fairly certain you can do this in XSI, though it's not all pre built for you (aka beyond a few shaders you have to make your own or acquire them off the net.) Kind of surprised this wasn't in MAX already. I doubt it's going to take all the guess work out of mr and vray rendering though...

GraphXs
02-09-2009, 09:17 PM
I think its great that Max is getting polyboost. I use Max everyday at work, even though I do model in LW most of the time. I prefer the freeform modeling of not having gizmos when I creat stuff in LW (try streching in Max without having to move a gizmo/or selection, and extra step.:thumbsdow) I also enjoy modelers layers. As for Max: edit poly does have some nice tools: chamfer is great, and in LW: rounder is a pain in da. The more tools the better, I can't wait to see what Core has to counter [email protected]

I jump back and forth alot from Max to LW. I got a great work flow, and Core sounds like it will give me a even better one!:lwicon:

Oh, here is one thing I would love [email protected] to fix: Z up, is a pain in the butt!

Philbert
02-09-2009, 10:09 PM
Oh, here is one thing I would love [email protected] to fix: Z up, is a pain in the butt!

I'll have to agree with that. The last time I dealt with graphs on paper was in 8th grade or something, but I do recall that Y was up. The other thing I never quite understood was why a UV map has 3 dimensions.