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View Full Version : "Large scene" bug / "itemactive 0" bug / LW9.5 & 9.6



pob
01-28-2009, 04:03 PM
Hi

Got a big master scene. 20 million polys, 2211 objects. It was originally made in 9.31 (er 64bit yes). Yes, it has lots of hdinstance too. It was for a 12k x 8k still.

Summary : In LW9.5/9.6 things keep turning off, being made inactive, regardless.


- In lw9.31, out of 2211 objects 256 are inactive.

- In 9.5 and 9.6, out of 2211 objects the same scene has 1237 inactive. Any load-items-from-scene you do from this point all have inactive objects too, regardless of their real actual state in the loader.

Strange.

- In 9.6, if you enable them, save it, reload it, they're still inactive.

- If you edit the LWS, remove all "itemactive 0" lines, save it in 9.6, reload it 9.6, save it again, they're inactive again.

- If you go back to 9.31, make a selection set of the inactive objects, then enable all objects, save it, open it in 9.5 or 9.6, its okay. Save it in 9.6 and reopen it in 9.6 then 1237 objects are inactive again.

- If you take the 9.31 scene from above, re-import it into a blank 9.31 scene, save it in 9.31, open it LW9.5/9.6, they're all active. (Good!).

- If you take the scene above (from 9.31), open it in 9.6, deactivate the selection set of 256 objects, save it in 9.6, reload it in 9.6, everything works! A 9.6 scene, saved in 9.6, with 256 deactived objects.

- Open that 'working scene', save it *again* in 9.6, open it in 9.6, its broken again! Once more there's 1237 deactived objects. No use at all.


At a bit of a loss for words. Has anyone else had any issues with 9.6, apart from maybe this thread : http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91463

Yes, we'd never render the animation with 20million+ polys, but its good to have a reliable master scene so you can activate/deactive/break up, prep, make matte objects, etc...However, not if I can't enable >954 objects. thanks for any views...

Sensei
01-29-2009, 12:30 AM
LW v9.3 has in Layout Options > Defaults, Maximum Objects/Lights/Cameras in scene. I don't see them in LW v9.5 anymore. Might be a sign that LW started using dynamically made objects, or they were removed by accident.. They're saved to LW9.CFG as lines
MaxObjects 2000
MaxLights 1000
MaxCameras 100
Maybe finding them in LW v9.5+ CFG, and if they're not there adding these lines would help..

pob
01-29-2009, 12:36 AM
yes, I noticed the same thing yesterday. I tried adding "maxobjects 20000" in the CFG file, but the problem remains.

Sensei
01-29-2009, 12:45 AM
I would make sure that case is exact.. Just in case if commands are compared case sensitive way..

Sensei
01-29-2009, 12:48 AM
I just checked it in Command Input, command name comparing is done case sensitive way. If you try f.e. "playforward" you will see unknown command message, but it's working when you use "PlayForward"..

pob
01-29-2009, 04:13 AM
I copied and pasted it from a 9.31 config file where the maximum-object count was set to 20,000. It didn't help.

I did another test.

Blank scene in 9.6/64bit, create a null, clone it 2999 times giving 3000 objects in total.

Save the scene.

Open the scene.

Only 1024 nulls are active.

That sounds like a bug to me.

edit: i'll email it in, fog it too.
edit #2 : seems when you email it in, it gets fog'd automatically..so, ahem, its fog'd twice. sorry newtek.

larkis
06-20-2009, 10:22 AM
I'm having the same problem, it's there on windows and the mac. I tried the windows 64 bit LA as well. IT gets rid of some other issues I have been having memory wise with my scene (as expected) but this de activation of objects happens when i bring in items from another scene.

3dworks
06-21-2009, 03:39 AM
sound like the issues i had... i've reported the bug to fogbugz (22889) a while ago and i got a response that it was already fixed internally, so it should be there for the next layout patch.

markus

Scott Gammans
06-23-2009, 06:17 PM
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHH. Yep, I can definitely confirm that this is a bug, and a really frakking annoying one. Check out this thread:

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99295

I was running into a strange problem where my cloned asteroid objects were visible in the viewport but just wouldn't render. Sure enough, I checked the Scene Editor just now and there are hundreds of objects that aren't checked in the "A" column.

Oh well, at least I now know it's not my imagination. Hey Newtek, what gives??! :(

Sensei
06-23-2009, 06:22 PM
Try LW v10.0 build 2001, whether it has it fixed..

Scott Gammans
06-23-2009, 06:28 PM
Hi Sensei... I didn't know a beta of version 10 was available. That's not LW Core, is it? I haven't forked over my money to Newtek for Core yet... kinda waiting to see whether all these issues with 9.x get fixed :D

Scott Gammans
06-25-2009, 01:24 AM
Reinstalled LightWave 8.5 32 and 64-bit... this bug does NOT exist in this ancient (but still capable!) version of LightWave. With LightWave 8.5 64-bit, I'm able to load up my scene file with 5,000 cloned objects (after upping the MaxObjects setting to 5000!) and Layout hardly even breathes hard. All the items in my scene file remain active, and the camera is able to render everything.

Scott Gammans
06-25-2009, 12:08 PM
HA! I can load a scene with ten thousand clones of my ten basic objects in LightWave 8.5/64-bit (that works out to 20 million polys) and LW hardly breaks a sweat.

Hey Newtek, howcum your four-year-old renderer handles large scenes better than the latest version?! :D :( :mad:

Svenart
08-02-2009, 11:29 PM
hello,

I have the same problems with much objects here and have written a small script to turn all objects active...:thumbsup:

Scott Gammans
10-27-2009, 04:09 PM
FYI, the 9.6.1 open beta FINALLY fixes this problem!! :thumbsup:

Argentus
11-04-2009, 04:00 PM
Hello All!

I have run into this problem as well, when I went from 9.3.1(Win 64-bit) to 9.6(Win 64-bit), about 4 months ago. I have finally had time to focus on troubleshooting the issue. I am running LW on Windows 7 RC and was concerned it was a Win7 issue, but it doesn’t appear to be.

I often need to create large scenes (90 million+ polys and 7000+ objects) for product walk-throughs. The object files are imported .obj files from Pro-E which are not polygonal models, but use triangles so I end up with huge poly counts...

The problem occurs when the object count exceeds 1024 objects. As people have said, the objects are set to be 'Active' but when you save and close LightWave and re-open the scene any objects that were added after the 1024th object will be set to 'Inactive' when opened. The scene code does not have the 'ItemActive 0' variable for those objects to tell Layout to make it 'Inactive'.

The problem seems to be caused by a default setting when the 'ItemActive' variable is not set and the scene goes over 1024 objects. If you insert 'ItemActive 1' in the .lws file for those objects not loading, everything will load fine. The easiest way to set this variable is to 'select all' in the scene editor and uncheck everything then save it. Open the file in notepad or whatever, and do a replace 'ItemActive 0' with 'ItemActive 1'. This will be the final step, because if you save the scene it will remove the 'ItemActive 1' variable and the problem will re-appear. The major down side is if you wanted something hidden for one reason or another, you will now have to find the item and reset it to 'Inactive', which is a pain when you have a large amount of objects. Just remember NOT TO SAVE!

Does anyone know of a way to have Layout insert 'ItemActive 1' in to scene code when something is set 'Active' instead of letting Layout use the default Active setting?

I have used LWHC 10 build 2005 and the problem doesn't exist. And everything is fine in 9.3.1. Something has changed in the way the object activation is handled when the ‘ItemActive’ variable is not present, i.e. the object is active. I would use LWHC 10, but I don't have access to HC at work, only at home. So that option is out for me.

I am going to submit this to lwbugs in hopes for a fix, since I seem to have narrowed down the problem.

-Argentus
LightWave user since v4... Has it really been that long!?

jaxtone
11-11-2009, 04:02 AM
... and when I mentioned this a while ago... some ppl accused me as a threat to their favourite tool.

HippocraZyneZZ!