PDA

View Full Version : Clear Coat material



nemac4
01-08-2009, 10:37 AM
I would like to have a separate clear coat material or clear coat option in all of the materials. Something like Maxwell render's clear coat would be great. Options for thickness and dispersion would be great too.

Matt
01-08-2009, 12:45 PM
There is a way of setting this up in the Node editor I believe, will dig out one and post in a bit.

colkai
01-09-2009, 02:06 AM
Ohh, shiny (literally ;) ).

Matt
01-09-2009, 03:53 AM
I would like to have a separate clear coat material or clear coat option in all of the materials. Something like Maxwell render's clear coat would be great. Options for thickness and dispersion would be great too.

One other thing, you'll never be able to match Maxwell's clear coat because an effective clear coat material depends on the lighting, reflection environment, other material properties etc. etc.

Thomas M.
01-09-2009, 06:05 AM
This is basic node stuff.

nemac4
01-09-2009, 06:46 AM
What I'm wanting is basically the same as clear coat in the carpaint node but added to all material types. If it is broken out, it would offer more control. The thickness and dispersion option would be needed for the best results.
Maxwell requires a bsdf shader to be applied first before a clear coat can be added so a LW version may need an opacity control for the base material to work as a stand alone clear coat. The LW dielectric node does a pretty good job of emulating the maxwell bsdf shader already. With the clear coat material we could make some very cool surfaces.

I'll try to post some renders to explain further.

Thomas M.
01-09-2009, 07:01 AM
I don't see the point. This is a very basic node setup. Gradients can be used to alter transparency, etc., subtract the reflection amount from the diffuse. The clear coat in general is pretty useless unless you are going for lacquered materials (carpaintnode). Imagine somebody is asking to implement the flake node into all materials. Doesn't make sense as you just need to connect 2 nodes to achieve this effect.

Cheers
Thomas

Matt
01-09-2009, 08:25 AM
Okay, first off, I'm an NO node expert, so this is not a perfect setup for clear coat, but shows HOW you can layer nodes for shading (the Specular channel in this example).

I've added two different specular shaders, one tight (for the clear coat laquer) the other more spread out to simulate the surface underneath.

I've also coloured them differently so you can better see their influence.

Red is the base surface specularity, Green (yellow on render due to mixing) is the 'clear coat' layer specularity.

Also attached is the surface file.

colkai
01-09-2009, 09:21 AM
Can I just say Matt, the 'trick' of putting false nodes in for explanatory purposes is a real Gem of help. :)
I'd wager a lot more folks would delve in if some of the node presets had this little help item.

Maybe there should be a 'comment' node just for this purpose? Very handy when you have to go back to something too!

Matt
01-09-2009, 09:47 AM
Maybe there should be a 'comment' node just for this purpose? Very handy when you have to go back to something too!

I asked about this actually, but apparently it's not easy to do for some reason. UI issues or something.

Using an unconnected node works for the time being.

colkai
01-09-2009, 12:38 PM
Well, it's a stroke of genius to use them in such a fashion and certainly something to bear in mind myself when I start dabbling. :)

Matt
01-09-2009, 01:16 PM
Well, it's a stroke of genius to use them in such a fashion and certainly something to bear in mind myself when I start dabbling. :)

I wish more people would put some 'comments' in their node flows this way when they give them away, would help understand stuff.

colkai
01-10-2009, 07:40 AM
Darn tooting - get folks to 'Matt-ify' their node setups! ;)

UnCommonGrafx
01-10-2009, 08:42 AM
Check out this flow.

At the bottom of the Node editor is a comment line; this is available to each node. The flow attached is based on Matt's example but has comments in the above mentioned area.
http://uncommongrafx.com/examples/CommentsInNodes.JPG

And the node:
http://uncommongrafx.com/examples/CommentsInNodes.srf

Mind you, when I saw your example, Matt, I thought - still do - that it was brilliant. So, this isn't a replacement as much as enhancement to your null use of a node. Lots of info can go on that line at the bottom.

Tobian
01-10-2009, 09:54 AM
Well I had a go at building a propper BRDF gloss coat, with sprinkles. It's a tricky beast to manage, with lots of reflection, spec and thechnically diffuse, but I thought you wouldn't be able to tell so I only did 1 :)

The node setup of 2 mixed materials would look a lot more simple but it would render more slowly as materials are generally slower than regular surfacing nodes and standard surfaces.

basically it adds 2 reflection nodes together, but because you have 2 reflection amounts, controlled by 2 seperate Fresnel nodes (I actually used the same value for both as it happens, but you could increase it if you wanted to have a metalic object on the underside.

I also multiplied the inverse of the two Fresnel values to create a diffuse value, so that it was properly energy conserving, though in this case I didn't add the spirinkle value so it was only additive to the reflection amount.

Feel free to 'mattify' it - as it got very mixed up and entangled and it would take quite a lot to separate :)

nemac4
01-11-2009, 11:06 AM
I was wanting something more like the attached render.
I'd like to be able to use realistic material nodes to create this effect.
I've exaggerated the thickness to make it more visible.

With the reflection/refraction blur of our current carpaint node
and thickness with interference it seems like it would a nice feature to me.

Think of materials like a screen protector on a pda with the little bubbles under it, or plastic wrap over jello, or jelly beans with a thick sugar glaze or the thick lacquer of a guitar, where you can see through the edges, materials that are wet or dipped in liquid soap.

Tobian
01-11-2009, 05:55 PM
Hmm I see what you mean, however I am not sure you could do that without geometry. I don't disagree it would be nice, but I am not sure it's possible! Can't hurt to ask! :D

nemac4
01-11-2009, 06:31 PM
Hmm I see what you mean, however I am not sure you could do that without geometry. I don't disagree it would be nice, but I am not sure it's possible! Can't hurt to ask! :D

I used a surface thickness gradient for the render, so it doesn't use extra geometry, though it isn't using materials.
Like you said... can't hurt to ask. :)

Tobian
01-11-2009, 08:56 PM
Interesting, I'd be interested in seeing that node setup! :)

nemac4
01-11-2009, 10:30 PM
Interesting, I'd be interested in seeing that node setup! :)
Here is the "Matt-ified" version.
I had it set up in layers but I added a node version for clarity.

Matt
01-12-2009, 03:06 AM
Here is the "Matt-ified" version.
I had it set up in layers but I added a node version for clarity.

Nice preset, I trust you have uploaded to Presetcentral?

nemac4
01-12-2009, 10:51 AM
Nice preset, I trust you have uploaded to Presetcentral?
I'll try to make it into something useful and post it. :)

benhaines
01-13-2009, 06:30 AM
Hi nemac4,

Just sent you a PM about uploading the preset to PresetCentral. Forgot to add my email in case you want to get in touch... [email protected]

Regards, Ben