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IMI
10-18-2008, 08:25 PM
Does anyone know of a Modeler plugin (preferably 64 bit) to create a disk with quads instead of one ridiculous, non-subpatch-friendly ngon?
I'm afraid Catmull-Clark just doesn't cut it when it comes to subpatching a disk - might as well create one with 128 sides than use CC on a disk.
I know how to manually convert a disk into one which can be used, when I need to, but a quad disk creation tool would be better.

Or maybe just an lscript? I'd make my own if I knew how...

Thanks. :)

dwburman
10-18-2008, 10:37 PM
Using the 'make pole' tool makes turning the ngon into triangles really simple. I theorized that using the free lscript "merge trigons X" would complete the task. Unfortunately, it didn't work properly, leaving some triangles.

It seems like it'd be a fairly simple Lscript to make if someone knows how. I haven't done any scripting in modeler.

SplineGod
10-19-2008, 12:22 AM
splines are a good way. Pick points off an existing disk to create 4 splines around the circumference. When you patch it youll have quads.

IMI
10-19-2008, 12:47 AM
splines are a good way. Pick points off an existing disk to create 4 splines around the circumference. When you patch it youll have quads.

I hadn't thought of that. Usually I remove the ngon, make a point in the middle and then build quad polys manually. I'll give it a shot - thanks. :)

dwburman - I've tried that but I just don't like triangles while modeling. Later on, before rendering or exporting I might make some tris out of non-planar polys, but they just cause me problems while modeling.

daforum
10-19-2008, 05:24 AM
I hadn't thought of that. Usually I remove the ngon, make a point in the middle and then build quad polys manually. I'll give it a shot - thanks. :)

I know adding a point to the center of a polygon is easy, but to make it even easier you could use PICTRIX's "Center_AddP". It lets you add a point to a polygon where-ever the polygon is positioned (not just x0, y0, z0)

For disks work with an 8 sided poly and if you have centered your poly and added a center point, use the knife tool vertically then horizontally across the center dividing the poly into four.

Script can be found here: http://www.pictrix.jp/lw/index_2.html

MooseDog
10-19-2008, 10:03 PM
splines are a good way. Pick points off an existing disk to create 4 splines around the circumference. When you patch it youll have quads.

larry's invaluable like this. i once saw you demo this technique, i forget where, and have used it i don't know how many times since then. because of your sharing i cringe now whenever i see a disc with tris or ngons :D

dwburman
10-20-2008, 12:01 AM
After using make pole, I don't leave it with tris.

Here's a mini-tutorial for changing those triangles to quads.

dwburman
10-20-2008, 12:07 AM
dang 5 minute rule...

The steps aren't perfectly illustrated but the steps are the same.

1) make disc
2) select the end caps (+ >4 vertex polys in poly statistics panel... 'w')
3) make pole
4) ctrl-h to switch to poly mode. The poly made in the last step are already selected.
5) click on the borders of two tris to deselect every other pair of tris
6) merge
7) select 3 vertex polys (in poly statistics panel... 'w')
8) merge
9) bask in the quads. :)

IMI
10-20-2008, 05:51 AM
Thank you again, dwburman - really, I do appreciate it.

That's a fairly quick process there and I guess if I can't have a quad disk maker, that's the next best thing. :)

SplineGod
10-20-2008, 07:40 AM
Thanks moosedog. I just like to avoid having poles because they tend to cause problems with subds. Using splines creates a nice endcap that is composed of all quads. Depending upon how you configure the splines you can alter the flow of the polys in the end caps.

IMI
10-20-2008, 08:09 AM
I've tried both ways, along with several variations I've been doing for a while now, and I tend to agree with Larry here. Although, splines definitely aren't my thing - I never really have gotten a real handle on them.
The make poles method isn't bad, certainly better than subbaptching with Catmull-Clark, and Extender Plus gives it a nice flat edge, as well as dragging the edges does.
So many ways in Modeler to accomplish the same thing - one can go crazy at times just deciding on how to approach a given problem.

JeffrySG
10-20-2008, 08:13 AM
While we're on the subject, here's another nice way to cap off a disc, rather than having a huge pole. I saw this solution on nurbsandpolys.com, btw. Obviously a little more work to set up but might be nice in some models.

64838

art
10-20-2008, 08:13 AM
We should have a disc tool that offers all options: ngon, pole with tris, pole with quads, and quads done using SplineGod's method. Oh, and option for "fixed pole" build right into it in case of tris.

IMI
10-20-2008, 08:22 AM
We should have a disc tool that offers all options: ngon, pole with tris, pole with quads, and quads done using SplineGod's method. Oh, and option for "fixed pole" build right into it in case of tris.

Hear hear to that! :agree:

My big concern is trying to get nice round edges, with maybe a bit of bevel on them. Think of something like a hard plastic wheel for something like a dumpster - which is what I was modeling when I (once again) came across that problem. Textures and smoothing can hide some of that "patchy" look, but not all the time.

IMI
10-20-2008, 08:31 AM
Here... not too terribly bad, using the make poles method, plus LW subpatch, Extender Plus, and edge beveling. Obviously the back side was left as-is after quadifying it (quadifying? ;))

MooseDog
10-20-2008, 08:36 AM
... I just like to avoid having poles because they tend to cause problems with subds. Using splines creates a nice endcap that is composed of all quads. ...

see screenie. nice clean geometry, no pole-pinching. if you're not using subd's for whatever purposes your pursuing, then it might be overkill.



...Depending upon how you configure the splines you can alter the flow of the polys in the end caps.

this i'd like to see :help:.


... and I guess if I can't have a quad disk maker,

since this is modeler, couldn't you turn on that lscript/macro creater thing and just record your steps, saving it out as imi_revelatory_disc_maker.ls? :santa:

IMI
10-20-2008, 08:42 AM
Or this, not too bad for something not seen up close.

IMI
10-20-2008, 08:43 AM
since this is modeler, couldn't you turn on that lscript/macro creater thing and just record your steps, saving it out as imi_revelatory_disc_maker.ls? :santa:

Yeah, I guess. At least I thought so, but I can't remember how! I was figuring after I finished the model I'm working on I'd look into it.

art
10-20-2008, 08:48 AM
I never used macro recording either. I wonder if it would take the variable number of points on the disk into account.

ben martin
10-20-2008, 08:59 AM
CREATE -> PRIMITIVES -> WEDGE? (Use numeric pad to refine your mesh)

If I understood it correctly, is this what you are looking for?

IMI
10-20-2008, 09:07 AM
CREATE -> PRIMITIVES -> WEDGE? (Use numeric pad to refine your mesh)

If I understood it correctly, is this what you are looking for?

Wow, I never thought of that. That makes a great wheel right off the bat. Thanks! :thumbsup:

dwburman
10-20-2008, 09:41 AM
If I knew you wanted a hole in the middle I would've suggested using the Fix Pole tool.

1) make pole
2) switch to poly select mode
3) detail>Polygons>fix pole - this adds a ring of quads around the outside with the tris in the middle
4) deselect the quads, select the tris
5) merge polygons
6) use the bridge tool


actually, scratch that

To make that shape I'd just select the caps, bevel a few times then use the bridge tool.

Larry's method probably gives the best result for the end cap problem.

I always thought the wedge tool was for making wedges, like a wedge of cheese... silly me.

JeffrySG
10-20-2008, 10:07 AM
since this is modeler, couldn't you turn on that lscript/macro creater thing and just record your steps, saving it out as imi_revelatory_disc_maker.ls? :santa:


Where is the button for the macro creater in modeler? Is it something that you have to program or you just record a few steps and save the macro? I've been looking but can't seem to find it.

JeffrySG
10-20-2008, 10:08 AM
actually, scratch that
To make that shape I'd just select the caps, bevel a few times then use the bridge tool.

That's what I usually do. Either bevel or multi-shift. Then bridge.

IMI
10-20-2008, 11:14 AM
Where is the button for the macro creater in modeler? Is it something that you have to program or you just record a few steps and save the macro? I've been looking but can't seem to find it.

That's what my problem was. It wasn't immediately evident anywhere when I looked for it, so I decided to check into it later.

IMI
10-20-2008, 11:17 AM
If I knew you wanted a hole in the middle I would've suggested using the Fix Pole tool.


Well, I was modeling a wheel when I was reminded (once again) of my desire for a simple quick quad disk making tool. For wheels, yeah, but lots of other things too. It's actually been bugging me for a few years now that we don't have such a tool, so I finally got around to asking about it.