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CMT
06-19-2008, 02:58 PM
I'll try to find some time to work on something as well. I won't be able to put much detail in this project due to time constraints so I'll forgo most of the texture mapping and go with cel shading.

This is the ninja model from the content CD and not my own. I have to figure out what type of animation I want to do then start modeling something. But in the meantime, I made a few cell shading tests. This is straight Lightwave, no BESM or Supercel shader. I've been playing around with the diffuse sharpeness values and I like the result. I may end up hand painting a few backgrounds in Photoshop to speed things up a bit since time is scare right now.

Here's to hoping actually finish this... :)

CMT
06-19-2008, 03:45 PM
Here's a quick test of the shader with a changing light angle.

hrgiger
06-19-2008, 04:15 PM
Not be a fan of anime, I won't pretend to know what I'm talking about but the shading looks great. Could be very dramatic.

Andrewstopheles
06-19-2008, 09:29 PM
love it ill be following this thread

MooseDog
06-19-2008, 10:01 PM
keep going. defintely a bad-***** start!

SplineGod
06-20-2008, 12:14 AM
Part of it depends on whether or not you want the result to be true to the final output achieved using hand drawn cels or simply a flat shaded 'cartoon' look you get from a cel shader.

A model needs to be designed to take advantate of cel shading as well as inklines. LW edges work in a very particular way and this needs to be taken into account when trying to get good ink lines.
I constantly see models that have the celshader thrown on and it doesnt look quite right. I also think that studying how cel shading is done using a traditional approach will help.

richdj
06-20-2008, 05:00 AM
Love the look so far....

Rich

Eugeny
06-20-2008, 06:44 AM
I'm agree with Larry , not any model will look right in cell shade, so it's better to start modeling and play with cell shader , some times u need to crease some areas in order to get good looking edge inks or color zones and some tomes it's need to be flattened.

CMT
06-20-2008, 09:21 AM
I see what you're saying Larry and I'll definitely keep that in mind. I see a lot of cel shaded models that all look the same as well. They assign the zones, place the lights and hit "render" and leave it at that. Some models look good, some don't. But the shading is usually pretty basic.

I think though that I'm not just trying to mimic the hand drawn cel look, but rather just trying to get something that looks cool, stylistic and polished. :) So whatever I find that Lightwave can do to add to making it look better, I'll do it.

If I find that it means it doesn't look quite like traditional cel animation, that's fine. I'm not looking for this to be a flat cartoon. I'm hoping that I can bring a bit of depth to the look.

Thanks for the tips!

CMT
06-20-2008, 10:16 AM
This is one of the first tests I did which doesn't have the extra highlight in the shader. Looking at it again, I think it may look better and more graphic. But, I thought I'd get some opinions....

cresshead
06-20-2008, 10:36 AM
yeh reduced number of shaded 'areas' will give a more natural look to it..the image above looks the best so far.

to control where they get put you can use poly smoothing..where your model may look abit weird in the viewport but will render looking 'cel shaded'.

pumeco
06-20-2008, 12:10 PM
Looks great CMT, especially that last image :thumbsup:

jasonwestmas
06-20-2008, 12:31 PM
The shapes could be more simple I think,but if you model right that shader will be great!! I hope you share the settings. :D

Kevbarnes
06-21-2008, 05:59 AM
This is one of the first tests I did which doesn't have the extra highlight in the shader. Looking at it again, I think it may look better and more graphic. But, I thought I'd get some opinions....

Hi CMT - Where are you getting the outlines from ? are they Edge rendered in LW or are from your diffuse settings.

Surrealist.
06-21-2008, 07:38 AM
Looking pretty good.

I like the direction you are going with it.

CMT
06-21-2008, 02:46 PM
Thanks guys. But all these test renders are irrelevant unless I come up with a decent idea. Still working on that though...


Hi CMT - Where are you getting the outlines from ? are they Edge rendered in LW or are from your diffuse settings.

They are a combination of using the Edges section in the Object Properties panel and gradients with incidence angle in the color channel. This was done in the normal surface editor, but I'm going to see if I can get a little more control with the nodes editor.

richdj
06-21-2008, 03:55 PM
They are a combination of using the Edges section in the Object Properties panel and gradients with incidence angle in the color channel. This was done in the normal surface editor, but I'm going to see if I can get a little more control with the nodes editor.

Christopher, I'm sure you don't need telling.. But William did a Cell Shade Node tute in his 24 hours of tutes. Link in my sig..

Rich

CMT
06-25-2008, 01:00 PM
Thanks Rich, I remember seeing that a while back and I did use a couple of the pointers he gave from that.

I think I have a rough idea of what I want to do now for an animation. Something involving a warlock. I need to flesh out his design (is he mean, old, or cute), then I'll start modeling.

In the meantime, I made this rough particles test at work during lunch today. This is the first test of a cel smoke effect I'm going for. But I'm trying to figure out why the particles jitter right before they disappear. Anyone got any ideas?

Here's the link to the animation.
Smoke Animation. (http://www.loadedbrush.com/Challenges/Newtek08/ParticleTest.mov)

Hopper
06-25-2008, 04:25 PM
This is one of the first tests I did which doesn't have the extra highlight in the shader. Looking at it again, I think it may look better and more graphic. But, I thought I'd get some opinions....
That's an incredible render. Very unique look with the shadows and soft lighting. :thumbsup: A few setup hints of what you've done so far (settings that is) would be well appreciated.

CMT
06-25-2008, 09:37 PM
Thanks, Hopper. I'll be posting my shader settings when I get it to a point where I think it's as good as I can get it.

When I got home I worked on the jitter problem (or jitter bug.. hehe... ahem...). It seems that when the particles are motionless for several frames after they already moved, they re-orient themselves. To what, I don't know.

Anyway, the solution was to add another wind effector to move them slightly so they never stop moving. So here's what it looks like now. I think it's good enough for this project. I'll incorporate this or something like it into some sort of spell casting of the warlock.

softdistortion
06-26-2008, 09:09 AM
WOW!
I've done a fair bit of cellshade, but never came round to a good, none retouched smoke /water solution.

With a few tweaks your setting looks like it would work for water splashes really well too.

Nice Work Chris

Hopper
06-30-2008, 10:05 PM
Oh, now THAT has a cool factor of 10!

I think realistic smoke and explosions would be an excellent thing to learn, but cell shading might be more my speed if it's more forgiving as far as the technical aspects of detailed (realistic) texturing are concerned. This is a guess of course.

CMT
07-01-2008, 12:41 PM
I worked a bit on the warlock's staff over lunch. I did a little modeling on the warlock himself last night, but it's very rough. I'll try to post the progress on him tonight.

Hopper, the cell smoke is a bit easier to deal with definitely. And it renders super fast. I think that animation above took about a minute and a half to render at that resolution. No AA or anything.

rakker16mm
07-01-2008, 02:07 PM
I worked a bit on the warlock's staff over lunch. I did a little modeling on the warlock himself last night, but it's very rough. I'll try to post the progress on him tonight.

Hopper, the cell smoke is a bit easier to deal with definitely. And it renders super fast. I think that animation above took about a minute and a half to render at that resolution. No AA or anything.

Looking forward to seeing the Warlock. The smoke reminds me a bit of Katsuhiro Ôtomo's AKIRA and also Steamboy. It's really great. I hope you will share some of your settings.

CMT
07-01-2008, 11:06 PM
Yeah I actually bought the movie Steamboy and watched it several times for reference. Great movie! Been a long time since I've seen Akira though.

Here's the rough model of the warlock. I just yanked a head from an old model of mine for placement. I'll work on getting his facial structure more interesting. Didn't get to the lower half or arms yet.

I'll be doing a short cape for him, but I think for the lower half I'll stick with some sort of puffy trousers to limit the amount of dynamics I'll need to do.

Not sure about that helm yet either.....

CMT
07-02-2008, 11:51 PM
Model update. Trying some colors as well.

I liked the the way the ninja boots looked cel shaded, so I modeled something similar and added some ties which might look good with some dynamics when animated. I'll add some baggy wizard pants for him. :)

archijam
07-03-2008, 12:08 AM
Looking nice CMT! Fantastic work so far ..

Kuzey
07-04-2008, 04:25 AM
Oh, now THAT has a cool factor of 10!


+1

That is really cool....can't wait to see how this competition turns out :thumbsup:

Kuzey

hrgiger
07-04-2008, 10:11 AM
Warlock is looking very cool. Are you animating him?

CMT
07-04-2008, 01:12 PM
Thanks all! Happy 4th to all those who celebrate it!

hrgiger, yeah, that's the plan... LOL! I've never tried character animation on this level before, so this will be quite a learning experience for me.

Here's some color variations. I'm trying to get a feel for the character and think about what the environment should be like. I still need to work on the shape of his face to give it more "character".

And at some point I'll need to paint some bump maps to make it a little less clean. I think he's a bit too sterile at the moment.

CMT
07-05-2008, 10:33 PM
Just about finished with the overall form. I liked the arm and leg wraps from the ninjas so I borrowed that idea and made my own wraps for this guy. Still working on coloring. I may add some ribbons to his wrist as well to add more visual movement to the scene when he waves his arms around. Still not totally keen on the helm.

For some reason he seems too small in stature. Anyone else see that? I may lengthen his legs a bit and see if that helps. I'm doing away with the staff. I want both his hands free for casting some type of spell.

Hopper
07-05-2008, 11:30 PM
His torso looks to be a little on the short side, but I really didn't notice it until you mentioned it. Looking great - keep it up!

novawave
07-06-2008, 12:10 AM
cool chara....
amazing technique i think its an anime at first!!!:thumbsup: the smoke anim really great...reminds me of Hoshi no Koe (but Mr CMT smoke looks more stylish :bowdown:)
wonder.....Mr.CMT what kind of :2guns: weapon you'll give him???:D

jasonwestmas
07-06-2008, 07:23 AM
I think you need another set of color shapes for specular and highlight. Looks great!

hrgiger
07-06-2008, 08:02 AM
I'm just going to be amazed that you can animate him with all those accessories. It looks like a headache to me.
As far as the proportions, I think they look ok. The torso might be a little short but I don't think I would have noticed it had you not mentioned it. Honestly what struck me was looking at the back shot you showed, It almost looks like someone who put their clothes on backwards. I was thinking maybe there's not enough exaggeration between the shoulders and midsection (other then the clothing) as well as not enough curvature of the spine and legs. Like he's almost straight up and down? Anyone else think that? Especially considering it is going for an anime style. Dont' get me wrong, it looks very good, I'm just thinking it could make a more powerful silhouette with more exaggeration. I don't mean more muscular because I know this is a warlock and not a brick but even skinny characters are usually built with some exaggeration of form.
If you don't get what I'm saying, look at my poor illustration below. Excuse the childlike execution, I don't have a wacom or anything, it's mouse drawing...

bobakabob
07-06-2008, 03:06 PM
Nice work CMT... great concept and costume design. Definitely needs to be taller in stature though... exaggerating the length of limbs is a classic convention in comic book art.

Iain
07-09-2008, 05:26 AM
Cool. I love the colours and shading.

Reminds me of Battle of the Planets (showing my age there!)

archijam
07-09-2008, 07:47 AM
Cool. I love the colours and shading.

Reminds me of Battle of the Planets (showing my age there!)

Indeed! (http://www.madman.com.au/wallpapers/battle_of_the_planets_237_1024.jpg)

CMT
07-09-2008, 08:43 AM
Battle of the Planets, eh? LOL! He does kind of look a bit futuristic, doesn't he?

I was a huge Star Blazers fan myself which came out a couple years after that. That was my first experience viewing animé.

Anyway, here's a magical Sigil/Ward or whatever he will be conjuring up at some point. Took lunch at work yesterday to whip this up.

sammael
07-09-2008, 09:15 AM
Nice wip CMT it is all coming along nicely so far. The Sigil/Ward thing is cool, is there a way to make it a bit less sharp? just thinking it would be cool if it was kinda warping/shimmering perhaps on an animated plane witih maybe some random transparency moving across it or something, like an animated procedural on the alpha. Less solid you know?

I like the shader you have come up with this and the more purple colour scheme is the pick of the bunch imo.

dwburman
07-09-2008, 01:07 PM
it's looking pretty cool. I wonder if the breadth of the clothing that is making him seem shorter than he really is.

CMT
07-16-2008, 01:52 PM
I worked a bit more on the Sigil at lunch again today (which is just about the only time I can find for this these days). Just tried to make it a bit more interesting.

I'm not sure if I'll have much time to continue on this as a few projects suddenly popped up which I need to take care of. Nevertheless, I'll keep going on it as I find time, but I doubt I'll make the contest deadline. I might just leave the cloak off to save some time, though I was really looking forward to doing some clothfx with it.