PDA

View Full Version : Shhhhh...LW9.5 pics..for your eyes only



Pages : 1 2 [3] 4 5 6

tommymamn
02-22-2008, 03:55 PM
Anyone do any tests on grass yet???

arsad
02-22-2008, 03:59 PM
thx to all testers and image/animation posters. Keep them coming....
It's really nice to see a bright future for LW.

gareee
02-22-2008, 04:01 PM
thx to all testers and image/animation posters. Keep them coming....
It's really nice to see a bright future for LW.

Agreed!

Andyjaggy
02-22-2008, 04:02 PM
So who is going to organize the LW 9.5 video this time :D

RonGC
02-22-2008, 04:02 PM
YEs some UV info would be nice, this area is one that LW needs to improve big time.

Ron

Andyjaggy
02-22-2008, 04:03 PM
Ya know I would be completely happy if it was just the PLG tools integrated. If not then I hope the new tools are at least as good.

Dirk
02-22-2008, 04:05 PM
Ya know I would be completely happy if it was just the PLG tools integrated. If not then I hope the new tools are at least as good.

Agreed. The PLG tools are great.

Darth Mole
02-22-2008, 04:05 PM
At the risk of sounding greedy, could NT let William Vaughn do some early videos - not necessarily tutorials, but just 'Here's the new tools, look at 'em go! Type of stuff?

Pleeeease?

Andyjaggy
02-22-2008, 04:06 PM
pleeeeeeeeeeeease.

We know Proton can crank them out in about .00465 seconds.

RonGC
02-22-2008, 04:07 PM
At the risk of sounding greedy, could NT let William Vaughn do some early videos - not necessarily tutorials, but just 'Here's the new tools, look at 'em go! Type of stuff?

Pleeeease?

:agree: , let the video monster loose:D

Ron

Steamthrower
02-22-2008, 04:12 PM
pleeeeeeeeeeeease.

We know Proton can crank them out in about .00465 seconds.

Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's...........the Cat in the Hat.

bluerider
02-22-2008, 04:14 PM
Oop I accidently dropped this UV Unwrap tool example in this forum, how silly of me. Its not a bird or a plane........ not a cat, but a horse.

The command function for the UV unwrap is easy, select it as a tool in modeler after you've selected your edge then "BAM".

Go horsey go go

Andyjaggy
02-22-2008, 04:17 PM
Looks tasty.

your pic if very provocative. the way you cut off all the modeler interface so that we can't see any unknown tools. Makes me feel like there is all sorts of new stuff, even if there isn't.

bluerider
02-22-2008, 04:18 PM
:hey:

Exception
02-22-2008, 04:20 PM
So who is going to organize the LW 9.5 video this time :D

You are! :)

mav3rick
02-22-2008, 04:23 PM
If it's Sasquatch, then I'd assume that it'd work with Fprime, being developed by the same folks and all. I'm hoping it's not Sasquatch however, because I don't particularly like Saslite.
its not sasq eod :P

RonGC
02-22-2008, 04:24 PM
Oop I accidently dropped this UV Unwrap tool example in this forum, how silly of me. Its not a bird or a plane........ not a cat, but a horse.

The command function for the UV unwrap is easy, select it as a tool in modeler after you've selected your edge then "BAM".

Go horsey go go

This looks easy, is the uv map as easy to adjust. Or is this a one trick pony:)

Ron

mav3rick
02-22-2008, 04:27 PM
awsome pix today guys impressive now that's what me *** like ... i can say

tygryss
02-22-2008, 04:28 PM
if the hair system is based on FF4, maybe it can instance polygons ? if someone try make an example, maybe build a forest... :D it would be nice ....
this idea is based on this ff4 picture:
http://www.binaryartsinc.com/images/feather02_ray.jpg

sorry for may bad english

Chuck
02-22-2008, 04:32 PM
WHOAAA..proton is also a Beta Tester... now that is a suprise!!! :)

Not really; his day job is DAVE School, and he also still works for NewTek as a LightWave evangelist and on the Content team. :)

bluerider
02-22-2008, 04:34 PM
This looks easy, is the uv map as easy to adjust. Or is this a one trick pony:)

Ron

I did a horse not a pony....Ok, well the cool thing is the edge selection is easy. As soon as the edges are done, them the "UV unwrap" tool is one click and its done.

Now as regards adjustment....there a "UV relax tool". I select my area of polys that are bunched around the eyes for example, it spaces them out in a very congenial manner.

The neat thing of course is how easy it is for me to paint textures to the pelt.

WilliamVaughan
02-22-2008, 04:41 PM
I did a horse not a pony....Ok, well the cool thing is the edge selection is easy. As soon as the edges are done, them the "UV unwrap" tool is one click and its done.

Now as regards adjustment....there a "UV relax tool". I select my area of polys that are bunched around the eyes for example, it spaces them out in a very congenial manner.

The neat thing of course is how easy it is for me to paint textures to the pelt.


Looking forward to seeing the results...I saw the concept art you created and if it is anything like that it's going to be amazing!

IMI
02-22-2008, 04:44 PM
The neat thing of course is how easy it is for me to paint textures to the pelt.


Umm... is said painting by chance being done in LightWave? :D

jasonwestmas
02-22-2008, 04:47 PM
:lwicon:


MmM, fuuzzzy caterpillar. Specular would make it look less flat.

Matt
02-22-2008, 04:49 PM
Oop I accidently dropped this UV Unwrap tool example in this forum, how silly of me. Its not a bird or a plane........ not a cat, but a horse.

The command function for the UV unwrap is easy, select it as a tool in modeler after you've selected your edge then "BAM".

Go horsey go go

Now this is good news! I hardly ever UV map because it was a total pain (although the PLG UV tools are awesome!) I'm hoping this will make it much easier!

:)

RonGC
02-22-2008, 04:54 PM
I did a horse not a pony....Ok, well the cool thing is the edge selection is easy. As soon as the edges are done, them the "UV unwrap" tool is one click and its done.

Now as regards adjustment....there a "UV relax tool". I select my area of polys that are bunched around the eyes for example, it spaces them out in a very congenial manner.

The neat thing of course is how easy it is for me to paint textures to the pelt.

Thanks for the info, this looks great to me, any painting tools included?
Not that im greedy:D

Ron

caesar
02-22-2008, 04:58 PM
:lwicon:


Thats SOOOOOOOOO GOOD !!!


Please, add a Wind and give us a little vid !!!!!!:bowdown:

hrgiger
02-22-2008, 04:59 PM
Umm... is said painting by chance being done in LightWave? :D

I'm guessing not. Maybe he's referring to the Photoshop plug-in?

Sarford
02-22-2008, 05:08 PM
Wow, this threat is great! Every time I come back here there is a little present waiting.

Great work betatesters! Great idea to show us some snippets NewTek.

Exception
02-22-2008, 05:16 PM
Look, can't we have a simple animation with Fibers? Seriously, an animation says so much more!

A beer for a fur animation!

Hidden Halibut
02-22-2008, 05:17 PM
A beer for a fur animation!

Beer for me!! :yingyang:

And how do you propose getting that to me? ;)

JeffrySG
02-22-2008, 05:18 PM
Oop I accidently dropped this UV Unwrap tool example in this forum, how silly of me. Its not a bird or a plane........ not a cat, but a horse.

The command function for the UV unwrap is easy, select it as a tool in modeler after you've selected your edge then "BAM".

Go horsey go go
That looks Tasty, indeed! :D

flashover
02-22-2008, 05:20 PM
Greatly improved quality at a given level of settings versus the old system.

Great! I hope that new lights are fast. :D

cresshead
02-22-2008, 05:22 PM
you just KNOW the lightwave 9.5 logo will be covered in fur!

dballesg
02-22-2008, 05:22 PM
Beer for me!! :yingyang:

And how do you propose getting that to me? ;)

Give a beer to a hidden halibut?

That's a difficult one :D

flashover
02-22-2008, 05:25 PM
Oop I accidently dropped this UV Unwrap tool example in this forum, how silly of me. Its not a bird or a plane........ not a cat, but a horse.

The command function for the UV unwrap is easy, select it as a tool in modeler after you've selected your edge then "BAM".

Go horsey go go

Too coooooool :D

Ulven
02-22-2008, 05:25 PM
Very nice stuff. Especially impressed by the GI smoothness and times. I'm looking very much so forward to the open beta. Anyone have more info on those there joint thingies than what was in the press release? Are we finally starting to see the promised focus on character animation tools?

hrgiger
02-22-2008, 05:28 PM
Does the fur have it's own dynamic engine? It doesn't seem to be reacting very much....

dballesg
02-22-2008, 05:39 PM
Very nice stuff. Especially impressed by the GI smoothness and times. I'm looking very much so forward to the open beta. Anyone have more info on those there joint thingies than what was in the press release? Are we finally starting to see the promised focus on character animation tools?

Now you say it. All the new changes on the SDK are affecting LScript as well? I mean there will be access from LScript to the new IK and Light goodies?

David

Philbert
02-22-2008, 05:59 PM
Great attachments. Thanks to the posters and to NewTek!

SecretSquirrel
02-22-2008, 06:31 PM
4 bounces, 64 rays, DOF, Dielectric, Conductor, Photometric Light, 2 Pass AA, 0.04 Adaptive Sampling.

GI Calculation Time: 30.7 seconds
Render Time: 9m 41s

(Quad Core Machine)

I suspect this could be rendered much quicker, but I cranked AA up a little, and the Dielectric shader takes its time with that much blurring!

Note: The banding is because of the file format, it's not there on the render.

DeepThroat
02-22-2008, 06:36 PM
:lwicon:

hrgiger
02-22-2008, 06:38 PM
There we go DeepThroat, that's more like it.

Cool SSquirrel.

SecretSquirrel
02-22-2008, 06:38 PM
:lwicon:

Very nice indeed there DeepThroat, even I, with my super crime fighting skills need to ask how you did that!!!

;)

Weepul
02-22-2008, 06:50 PM
Here's another request for all you masked 9.5 avengers: how about an area light with inverse-squared falloff standing on edge perpendicular to (and just resting upon) a flat ground plane? No antialiasing, please.

MAUROCOR
02-22-2008, 06:54 PM
Congrats, dev team!
Everything looks great for me till now!
Any chance to have something about New Bone Type - Joints and Multi-threaded Mesh Deformation Evaluation?
Please!
:thumbsup:

Sarford
02-22-2008, 06:58 PM
Cool one Deep Throad

hrgiger
02-22-2008, 06:59 PM
Congrats, dev team!
Everything looks great for me till now!
Any chance to have something about New Bone Type - Joints and Multi-threaded Mesh Deformation Evaluation?
Please!
:thumbsup:

The new bone type yes, but it might be a little harder to show the deformation evaluation. Plus screen recording software can slow down the interface somewhat so it wouldn't really be accurate. I think we'll just have to wait to experiment with that on our own. But would love to hear or see something on the bone joints.

Raccoon Bandit
02-22-2008, 07:00 PM
Hi guys! Sorry I'm late getting into the preview game but have some images setup to bake right now and this weekend. So will be posting real soon.


Does the fur have it's own dynamic engine? It doesn't seem to be reacting very much..
Yes and no. It has some degree of Dynamic gravity but not its own full dynamics engine, at least so far but theres always tomorrow!


how about an area light with inverse-squared falloff standing on edge perpendicular to (and just resting upon) a flat ground plane? No antialiasing, please.
Doable especially if you crank up quality. The real question is what are you really looking for a comparison of just area lighting or what?

DeepThroat
02-22-2008, 07:01 PM
Cool one Deep Throad

Throat...it's THROAT!!!!:devil:

Weepul
02-22-2008, 07:05 PM
Doable especially if you crank up quality. The real question is what are you really looking for a comparison of just area lighting or what?
Yeah, just to see what's improved and in what ways. Close and edge-on geometry near inverse-squared area lights has always been a shortcoming especially since radiosity and luminous polys excels in those situations (but then falls behind with small or distant lights/polys). So, how about that with 16 rays (like area light quality 4)? Maybe a 9.3.1 vs. 9.5 comparison shot?

hrgiger
02-22-2008, 07:09 PM
Yes and no. It has some degree of Dynamic gravity but not its own full dynamics engine, at least so far but theres always tomorrow!




Just letting you know, tomorrow works for me.

Ulven
02-22-2008, 07:15 PM
The new bone type yes, but it might be a little harder to show the deformation evaluation. Plus screen recording software can slow down the interface somewhat so it wouldn't really be accurate. I think we'll just have to wait to experiment with that on our own. But would love to hear or see something on the bone joints.

If one has a decent recording software and a decent computer these days it shouldn't be too hard to record some near realtime deformation. Purdy please show me 3-4 rigged characters on screen, in viewport so I can gague the deformation speed. Doesn't matter if it lags a little, I just want to see if it lags a lottle.

Digital Hermit
02-22-2008, 07:38 PM
Great news about the update! I am watching this thread more than I am watching the TV series "House" right now!

Has any Beta Tester tried using the New COLLADA, FBX and OBJ I/O, and if so, what did you I/O? i.e. Maya, XSI, ZBrush, etc...

(I/O i.e...E, I, E, I, oh?) :screwy:

Steamthrower
02-22-2008, 08:15 PM
I am watching this thread more than I am watching the TV series "House" right now!

"Lost" blows "House" right out of the water. I shall delve deeper into Jack's adventures while you waste your time watching a hospital sitcom. Therefore I will be able to open beta test before you, because as everyone knows, "Lost" is the official Newtek TV show. So there, E-I-E-I-O.

Raccoon Bandit
02-22-2008, 08:18 PM
Yeah, just to see what's improved and in what ways. Close and edge-on geometry near inverse-squared area lights has always been a shortcoming especially since radiosity and luminous polys excels in those situations (but then falls behind with small or distant lights/polys). So, how about that with 16 rays (like area light quality 4)? Maybe a 9.3.1 vs. 9.5 comparison shot?

I can do that after I finish a quick comparison of LW9.5 lights which is what I'm working on right now among other things. The first and best is done the second is almost done but I don;t think I'll start the rest up till tomorrow. I wanted to show them all together but I'll probably show the IES light later this evening since its already done.

Stooch
02-22-2008, 08:19 PM
"Lost" blows "House" right out of the water. I shall delve deeper into Jack's adventures while you waste your time watching a hospital sitcom. Therefore I will be able to open beta test before you, because as everyone knows, "Lost" is the official Newtek TV show. So there, E-I-E-I-O.

lost has horrible special effects and a story so convoluted i think that even the writers are lost.

my fave is BSG still.

Raccoon Bandit
02-22-2008, 08:21 PM
Has any Beta Tester tried using the New COLLADA, FBX and OBJ I/O, and if so, what did you I/O? i.e. Maya,

I'm sad to say the only thing I personally have tried is a couple obj inputs from Maya. Sad since it was just geometry I tested with and as far as that goes it worked fine, but then obj's have almost always opened nicely in LW. I know others have been testing this one heavily and I don't doubt will here from them soon.

Raccoon Bandit
02-22-2008, 08:26 PM
Just letting you know, tomorrow works for me.
Me too!:thumbsup: The good news is that it does play nicely with LW's current dynamics toolset! I have done some minor things but I have seen some pretty cool things too using LW's dynamics and hair/fiber/instances.

Weepul
02-22-2008, 08:36 PM
but then obj's have almost always opened nicely in LW.
These don't seem to (http://www.3drender.com/challenges/local_train/local_train_OBJ.rar). The train cars in the back have flipped polygon normals, as do random bits and bobs on the engine, when i try in 9.3.1. I don't suppose a 9.5 person could import those and then post the .lwo? :eek:

Larry_g1s
02-22-2008, 10:32 PM
:lwicon:It's not working for me.:help:

Digital Hermit
02-22-2008, 10:44 PM
It's not working for me.:help:

Do a right-click "save target as" and type .mov at the end of the file name.

Larry_g1s
02-22-2008, 11:52 PM
Do a right-click "save target as" and type .mov at the end of the file name.I tried that, when it show the file it says "attachment" (using FireFox). I tried it then in IE, and though it downloaded the file, it downloaded it with a .htm extension. I then had to go and change it to a .mov extension to get it to work.
Very cool by the way.

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-23-2008, 12:35 AM
Any more information about the IK/FK blending options/tools?
:)

Cageman
02-23-2008, 01:27 AM
Greatly improved quality at a given level of settings versus the old system.

Ohh.. that's some nice improvements! Well done!

Cageman
02-23-2008, 01:32 AM
Quick and easy hair style in 9.5

Ok, so now we know that FibreFX can do curling. :)

What about the shading? Is is possible to shade hair/fur the same way you shade objects (layers and/or nodal)?

Phil
02-23-2008, 01:46 AM
Ok, so now we know that FibreFX can do curling. :)

What about the shading? Is is possible to shade hair/fur the same way you shade objects (layers and/or nodal)?

I couldn't comment. All I can leave you with is a ;)

Just that. And no more. My source would break my legs.

Mitja
02-23-2008, 01:52 AM
Phil, Phil! You promised you would ask about FPrime! If it's a secret just tell, no problem!

Darth Mole
02-23-2008, 01:55 AM
"Hey, Steve Worley? This is Newtek. We're dropping Sas lite and implementing our own free hair system, rendering your $500 plug-in redundant. Oh, and could you make our new system work with FPrime?"

Yeah, bet that went down well...

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 01:57 AM
So it seems as hair&fur solves a lot of my worries when it comes to grass and carpets, Ies lights are cool as they are already...interpolated blur on reflection/refraction, much improved rendering speed/quality, more control over the GI...

all of those mentioned above will be used a lot by me, specially the interpolated blurring...my two most recent jobs had insane amounts of reflection blurring and this update is most wellcome.

most of my demands have been matched, i quess...ill have to figure out new things to demand...something like the "make kitty button", which shouldnt be far off when we already get a hair&fur system into LW.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 01:59 AM
Beer for me!! :yingyang:

And how do you propose getting that to me? ;)

Nice test! :)

However, in the beginning of the animation some of the hair on top of the ball has some strange motion; almost popping. Is it an effector moving there or what is going on?

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 02:00 AM
"Hey, Steve Worley? This is Newtek. We're dropping Sas lite and implementing our own free hair system, rendering your $500 plug-in redundant. Oh, and could you make our new system work with FPrime?"

Yeah, bet that went down well...

nonsence...Sas is obsolete and nearly useless for most situations as it doesnt show up in FPrime or get lit by radiousity, its a pixel filter....Worley wouldnt be able to sell Sasquatch anyway as long as FF4 is on the market.
But FPrime is something unique, still...i bet Worley has given up Sas long time ago and mainly works on FPrime.

Mitja
02-23-2008, 02:02 AM
If worley dropped SAS development a few years ago (like somebody said), maybe it went like you said, not exactly, but this is the idea. It's marketing. I don't know how much success had SAS, but certainly FPrime is a top sale! Maybe he's beting everything on FPrime! G2 is almost useless by now (with the new LW features), Polk-Taft donno what they do, SAS who knows...

Mitja
02-23-2008, 02:03 AM
If worley dropped SAS development a few years ago (like somebody said), maybe it went like you said, not exactly, but this is the idea. It's marketing. I don't know how much success had SAS, but certainly FPrime is a top sale! Maybe he's beting everything on FPrime! G2 is almost useless by now (with the new LW features), Polk-Taft donno what they do, SAS who knows...

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 02:03 AM
"Hey, Steve Worley? This is Newtek. We're dropping Sas lite and implementing our own free hair system, rendering your $500 plug-in redundant. Oh, and could you make our new system work with FPrime?"

Yeah, bet that went down well...

nonsence...Sas is obsolete and nearly useless for most situations as it doesnt show up in FPrime or get lit by radiousity, its a pixel filter....Worley wouldnt be able to sell Sasquatch anyway as long as FF4 is on the market.
But FPrime is something unique, still...i bet Worley has given up Sas long time ago and mainly works on FPrime.

RedBull
02-23-2008, 02:19 AM
nonsence...Sas is obsolete and nearly useless for most situations as it doesnt show up in FPrime or get lit by radiousity, its a pixel filter....Worley wouldnt be able to sell Sasquatch anyway as long as FF4 is on the market.

Complete crap, Sasquatch is one of the best hair rendering solutions period, it's constantly better looking than Shave, And It's actually FF4 that didn't work with GI, Sasquatch has supported GI for an age.... It's unlikely that LW's built in Hair renderer will match it at least not at first, and I'd be willing to put money on Sas being faster than everything else. (Sas is also multithreaded)...

Phil
02-23-2008, 02:20 AM
Phil, Phil! You promised you would ask about FPrime! If it's a secret just tell, no problem!

Not heard back yet.

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 02:25 AM
Does anyone know Fiber fx works with the new motion blur?

Cageman
02-23-2008, 02:28 AM
:lwicon:

Nice test with Fibre+Dynamics! Is it rendered with Mblur or is the fibres looking strange? (looks like mblur though). Confirm or deny!? ;)

Cageman
02-23-2008, 02:31 AM
lost has horrible special effects and a story so convoluted i think that even the writers are lost.

my fave is BSG still.

Ya... but those polarbears were CG done in LW, if I'm not misstaken. Looked good enough for TV-vfx.

Thomas M.
02-23-2008, 02:32 AM
Worley will hardly be pi**sed off. After not developing SAS for many years and not bringing it further, he knew that some other tool would replace SAS sooner or later. If there would have been any interest from his site to enhance SAS, he did have the chance for many, many years to do so .....

Thomas M.
02-23-2008, 02:34 AM
P.S.: Chuck, will there be a working UNDO in Layout???

dballesg
02-23-2008, 02:35 AM
OK,

I know the Hair FX it is exciting and in fact i am going to do use on it on a few characters. looks good specially the last video by DeepThroat (DeepPurple???...)

But you know to move those characters we need IK. And there is a few new things on that area announced, and I even didn't saw anything yet!!!! :(

Someone suggested to do a screenshot record, that would be very nicee...

I am sure guys you got your Camtasia 3 on that offer a few weeks back! :)

If not, I am sure that Proton can do one on a few minutes. Nothing complicated, something simple that shows the new bits on character animation area.

Pleaseeeeeeeeee! :)

David

skanky
02-23-2008, 02:40 AM
Worley will hardly be pi**sed off. After not developing SAS for many years and not bringing it further, he knew that some other tool would replace SAS sooner or later.
Yep. I believe SAS was developed as in house software years ago (maybe 10?) for a certain hollywood studio. It wasn't until a period of a number of years had passed that Worley was allowed to release Sas to the public. I hardly think he'd be annoyed as the tech is a decade old, and he's already been paid for it twice (development, then public release). It's time for something newer, and hopefully better... My guess is that he'd be surprised it's been paying for as long as it has...

Anyway, I'm well happy with the previews so far of 9.5, cheers to all involved.

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 02:42 AM
Me too!:thumbsup: The good news is that it does play nicely with LW's current dynamics toolset! I have done some minor things but I have seen some pretty cool things too using LW's dynamics and hair/fiber/instances.


how about share those things

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 02:45 AM
Complete crap, Sasquatch is one of the best hair rendering solutions period.

But it has limitations..it wont obey radiousity, wont refract if behind refractive surfaces...it is a pixel filter, while the quality might be outstanding, its useless for many situations..situations that the new hair&fur system seems to have no problems with.

sorry for the double posting btw, had problems with updating the page...

dmack
02-23-2008, 03:01 AM
I tried that, when it show the file it says "attachment" (using FireFox). I tried it then in IE, and though it downloaded the file, it downloaded it with a .htm extension. I then had to go and change it to a .mov extension to get it to work.
Very cool by the way.

I think you're clicking on the reply to the original post - go back a few posts and do the RMB save as on the original file.

Got to say, this is all looking seriously good! Jay's hint that it's good for more than hair is intriguing! Does that mean instancing? That said, I am very happy with aptly named Happy Digitals HD_Instance. So, what does this all mean for PRMBlur and volumetrics? Is the new hair thing a volumetric effect?

Any speed increase in the SSS nodes? They look cool but are just too slow for HD rendering!

This is all VERY promising for Lightwave. I hope the implementation and integration of all these new features is solid.

Another thing that migfht be good for 9.5 is a general tidy up - looking at the list of plugins and how they are grouped is poor - makes finding and assigning keyboard shortcuts difficult. It's coming up to Spring here in the UK, maybe it's time for a LW spring clean!

Philbert
02-23-2008, 03:06 AM
I tried that, when it show the file it says "attachment" (using FireFox). I tried it then in IE, and though it downloaded the file, it downloaded it with a .htm extension. I then had to go and change it to a .mov extension to get it to work.
Very cool by the way.
Here's another easier option. What I did was right-click and "copy link location" then open Quicktime up and File > Open URL. Paste the address in and it plays almost instantly.

prospector
02-23-2008, 03:07 AM
52,000 views...what have I created:eek:
I thought it would be a couple of posts and it would go away.....

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 03:10 AM
I hope that volumetrics work with the new MB now! That would be awesome. I doubt it though, it would have been on the feature list. Motion blur with hd instance is needed! and hvs too! and fiber fx too!

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 03:23 AM
52,000 views...what have I created:eek:
I thought it would be a couple of posts and it would go away.....

suuure you did ;)

its like global warming or religion would suddenly be more important and vital for mankind that LW 9.5?...not likely

Darth Mole
02-23-2008, 03:25 AM
As a fully-paid-up member of the Sasquatch owners' club, I'm not thrilled about its development dying. This new system looks okay, but I would have liked to see a Sasquatch 2.0 for my investment.

DogBoy
02-23-2008, 03:28 AM
Well, maybe this will light a fire under Worleys butt!

Cageman
02-23-2008, 03:28 AM
As a fully-paid-up member of the Sasquatch owners' club, I'm not thrilled about its development dying. This new system looks okay, but I would have liked to see a Sasquatch 2.0 for my investment.

Well, who says it's not in the works? If Worley can come up with a solution that integrates into the renderer (going away from being a post-process) I don't see a reason not to release it. Maybe that is what Worley is waiting for, the hooks and stuff to do just that?

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 03:34 AM
true...and with LW getting an integrated hair&fur system that seems to be awesome, Sasquatch 2 (if ever released) will have to be much better than a simple improvement..it will have to rock the socks of sasquatch 1 AND fiberX if it has a chance to get any sales.

Worley is a genious and he, if anyone, will be able to do such a thing..so in that sence fiberX just might give you a better sas2 than you would have gotten otherwise.

Exception
02-23-2008, 04:16 AM
Whatever it is, it'll be nice to have a native hair system that's at least a bit better than saslite... that's not hard to beat, and its still included... since its a free update, an nobody was expecting this, we should regard it as a bonus rather than a 'much expected feature'. It'll mature in the long run, the basics are here, as the previews clearly show.

RedBull
02-23-2008, 04:17 AM
But it has limitations..it wont obey radiousity,

Says who?

jesusguijarro
02-23-2008, 04:30 AM
true...and with LW getting an integrated hair&fur system that seems to be awesome, Sasquatch 2 (if ever released) will have to be much better than a simple improvement..it will have to rock the socks of sasquatch 1 AND fiberX if it has a chance to get any sales.

Worley is a genious and he, if anyone, will be able to do such a thing..so in that sence fiberX just might give you a better sas2 than you would have gotten otherwise.

The good thing here is that now we have three hair solutions for LW, I hope True Hair will see some improvements with LW 9.5. Competition is always good to the user

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 04:36 AM
Says who?

it does?...saslite doesnt, does it?

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 04:42 AM
we should regard it as a bonus rather than a 'much expected feature'.

ill call it a "very needed and welcome bonus"...the lighting system, while being a much expected feature is less intresting at the momemt, even if it be more usefull, becouse nobody really expected FF4, or hair&fur to be included in LW.

id like to know more about how to control the furry feature, but with the exception of the lucky few, secret squirrel and alike..we all have to wait untill the beta gets into public beta.

besides..the lighting system seems to be a very straight forward thing to apply..select ies and render i quess.

caesar
02-23-2008, 05:00 AM
I think the last mov from DeepThroat is very cool...and very Sasquath likewise...Well, saslite was really weak, but I always liked the the fast setup and good looking images from SAS. It has some serious limitations, but the image quality is undeniable.

Panikos
02-23-2008, 05:15 AM
I have a feeling that Sasquatch 2.0 will knock your socks off :)

-EsHrA-
02-23-2008, 05:24 AM
how is buying ff4 and intergrating it native?

mlon

caesar
02-23-2008, 05:26 AM
I have a feeling that Sasquatch 2.0 will knock your socks off :)


I believe the more tools in toolset, the better!

Anyway, Worley was always a super Dude for the LW community, I think its real unfair to bash SAS only cause NT is offering a new solution...

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 05:26 AM
The same way buying nodal and intergrating it was native!:hey:

DiedonD
02-23-2008, 05:33 AM
Whatever it is, it'll be nice to have a native hair system that's at least a bit better than saslite... that's not hard to beat, and its still included... since its a free update, an nobody was expecting this, we should regard it as a bonus rather than a 'much expected feature'. It'll mature in the long run, the basics are here, as the previews clearly show.

At one time you spoke certainly about good things coming up in this 9.5 . But because you were way too certain I named you an insider. Remember, the "interogation" :) .

Now Im kinda dissapointed that your not with them. Why couldnt I have kept my mouth shut. Hope my finding of your Insider works, wasnt to blame for you beeing kicked from the Insider squad an all :D . You wouldve "Secretly" telling everyone like this now whats new at 9.5 . And perhaps more frequently even :thumbsup:

Iain
02-23-2008, 05:38 AM
Now Im kinda dissapointed that your not with them.

One man can have many names :hey:

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 05:43 AM
any of you insiders care to elaborate on this "New GI Controls to Customize the Render"

Cageman
02-23-2008, 05:43 AM
The same way buying nodal and intergrating it was native!:hey:

You guys are hillarios!

Who cares if an idea was concived outside NT!? If it is brought into the office and coded to be integrated with the main application, and the programmer him/herself joined the devteam to work on that particular part of the software, what is that!?

You guys are splitting hairs here... come on!

:)

caesar
02-23-2008, 05:46 AM
:i_agree:

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 05:47 AM
nodal is great... I dont care how they got it, but it was a third party plug.

I like the sounds of the interpolated ref. I hope the recursions are not global still.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 05:56 AM
nodal is great... I dont care how they got it, but it was a third party plug.

Yeah... actually, there were two nodebased shaders avaliable for LW! One that orginates from a japanese programmer. I believe it was released for free. The one that became Nodal was a restricted release to some beta-testers before it (and its programmer, Antti) ended up at NT.

That's what I've been told...

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 05:59 AM
I remember downloading the free one before LW 9 came out so I could get the hang of it.

Steamthrower
02-23-2008, 06:36 AM
Buying an external technology and integrating it is no worse than buying Microsoft Office so you don't have to write an entire new spreadsheet program for the folks in your office...

Lightwolf
02-23-2008, 06:53 AM
Yeah... actually, there were two nodebased shaders avaliable for LW!
Three, the guys that develop Amleto had one as well (the japanese one was Sabre if I remember correctly) ...

Cheers,
Mike

theo
02-23-2008, 06:55 AM
It'll mature in the long run, the basics are here, as the previews clearly show.

Maybe... or, it could languish and mature so slowly that a third party option will still have to be considered.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 06:57 AM
Maybe... or, it could languish and mature so slowly that a third party option will still have to be considered.

If they have a dedicated programmer working on it?

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 06:58 AM
This was the one I was talking about
at bottom (http://home.att.ne.jp/omega/tabo/3dlabo/p_lwp.html)

serge
02-23-2008, 07:00 AM
Anyway, Worley was always a super Dude for the LW community, I think its real unfair to bash SAS only cause NT is offering a new solution...
??

Long time ago Worley could already have made a reflection/refraction solution like Fiber Factory. I think it's shameful towards the people that payed $500 for this plugin.

If he really is working on Sasquatch 2, he'd better make it a free upgrade.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 07:01 AM
Three, the guys that develop Amleto had one as well (the japanese one was Sabre if I remember correctly) ...

Cheers,
Mike

Yes! You are correct. Forgot about Amleto, and Sabre is the name! :)

Cageman
02-23-2008, 07:03 AM
This was the one I was talking about
at bottom (http://home.att.ne.jp/omega/tabo/3dlabo/p_lwp.html)

Ohh.. then it is... four!? :)

DiedonD
02-23-2008, 07:08 AM
One man can have many names :hey:

Yes but lets see what Exception has to say and what he doesnt say, and how he says it. And analyse all that. And especially how he will HIDE that fact

(Purposely not quoting which fact am I talking about here. Fact that he is or isnt an Insider)

Cageman
02-23-2008, 07:12 AM
Yes! You are correct. Forgot about Amleto, and Sabre is the name! :)

And yes... I was little too hasty about Amleto; Amelie (http://www.nodalideas.com/amelie/index.html) is the name. :) (but still true what Lightwolf said) Same developers as Amleto. *doh*

:)

jasonwestmas
02-23-2008, 07:15 AM
??

Long time ago Worley could already have made a reflection/refraction solution like Fiber Factory. I think it's shameful towards the people that payed $500 for this plugin.

If he really is working on Sasquatch 2, he'd better make it a free upgrade.

I agree, I would appreciate it if worley supported me for supporting him by keeping his other plugs other than Fprime up to date feature wise. I guess he's been on vacation, which is cool but. . .yeah nothing impressive in the sas upgrade dept.

kopperdrake
02-23-2008, 07:55 AM
One man can have many names :hey:

And there's always an exception to the rule...

tyrot
02-23-2008, 07:57 AM
You guys are hillarios!

Who cares if an idea was concived outside NT!? If it is brought into the office and coded to be integrated with the main application, and the programmer him/herself joined the devteam to work on that particular part of the software, what is that!?

You guys are splitting hairs here... come on!

:)

dear CAGEY

you are totally right mate. They are even insane. You will see they will be even trying very hard for finding some gaps in this amazingly free update..

Just do not waste your time on this..

I really do wonder how they really comment on Autodesk's "buying spree"...

NT is getting good tools and integrating with LW core even hiring the developer and giving these tools free with points updates...They are almost working like a 3D Help Organization... or LWHO -lightwave Help Organization...

Autodesk simply buying a company... and ... we really have no idea what they are doing with the company :) Or buying a plugin - asking for crazy money for every stupid update.

That s why Others just update, NewTek killls :)

BEST


- these posts will not help you
- chuck? but come on this is what i think. I am not writing these for joining Beta testing..
- doesn't matter..you are out..
- ok.

sadkkf
02-23-2008, 08:07 AM
No one owns exclusive rights for developing fiber systems and last I checked we're still in a free market system (though I'd have to check the fine print in the Patriot Act to be sure).

To me, providing an out-of-the-box fiber solution rules -- no matter how it got there. :jam:

There is such a thing as reinventing the wheel. Being a developer myself, if I'm able to adapt some existing code to suit a new or slightly different purpose, then, hey, I will.

If someone doesn't like the product I've developed, they're still free to use another. :)

IMI
02-23-2008, 08:11 AM
52,000 views...what have I created:eek:
I thought it would be a couple of posts and it would go away.....

56,000+ now, that is. ;)

Is this the most-viewed thread ever? if not, it probably will be eventually.... maybe surpassed by the inevitable "LW 9.5 Has Been Released" thread. :D

I can't even keep up with it anymore, have no idea what all has been said in the last 24 hours.

theo
02-23-2008, 08:22 AM
If they have a dedicated programmer working on it?

If NT has a dedicated programmer for that feature then consider my comment excellently null.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 08:24 AM
If NT has a dedicated programmer for that feature then consider my comment excellently null.

Yes.. this would go hand in hand IF FibreFX = Fiber Factory 4 (don't know what that programmer would do except coding FibreFX?). :)

Phil
02-23-2008, 08:30 AM
Someone asked for messy hair. It's another ball, sadly, but it's what I received. Still no comment on FPrime, but my expectation is that it won't work because FPrime doesn't handle volumetrics or pixel filters.

lardbros
02-23-2008, 08:35 AM
Someone asked for messy hair. It's another ball, sadly, but it's what I received. Still no comment on FPrime, but my expectation is that it won't work because FPrime doesn't handle volumetrics or pixel filters.

I think it was me who asked for messy hair. I guess it's not what i meant by messy. Doesn't matter, just i keep seeing clearly repeating patterns, i want completely random hair by default, none of this perfectly grown stuff. Nothing is perfect, even lovely glossy hair, it doesn't grow in perfect little clumps.

Just hope this is possible with FiberFX... not complaining, just want to know if it's possible?

Mitja
02-23-2008, 08:35 AM
Someone asked for messy hair. It's another ball, sadly, but it's what I received. Still no comment on FPrime, but my expectation is that it won't work because FPrime doesn't handle volumetrics or pixel filters.
It's like my grandpa's hair... :D
At this point I must ash something: what are hyper voxels , I mean, aren't volumetrics? They work with FPrime!

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 08:35 AM
fprime does render volumetric hvs.
Are you using the LW "intergrated" version or the FF 4 version, or are they exactly the same?

Phil
02-23-2008, 08:38 AM
It's like my grandpa's hair... :D
At this point I must ash something: what are hyper voxels , I mean, aren't volumetrics? They work with FPrime!

They are, but FPrime doesn't support any volumetrics in preview mode, and only HVs in render mode. Dynamite, HDInstance, etc. don't work at all with FPrime (at least for me). FFx, whether it's a pixel filter or a volumetric system, will have the same problems, I guess.

Mitja
02-23-2008, 08:44 AM
They are, but FPrime doesn't support any volumetrics in preview mode, and only HVs in render mode.
I know, and it's not a bad thing, at least it works.

Dynamite, HDInstance, etc. don't work at all with FPrime (at least for me). FFx, whether it's a pixel filter or a volumetric system, will have the same problems, I guess.
And here's the point: why HV yes, and other "volumetrics" no?

MAUROCOR
02-23-2008, 08:47 AM
More previews, please??? :thumbsup:

sadkkf
02-23-2008, 08:54 AM
so...does fiberFX work on a per-object basis only or can we can use it on select surfaces? Is it controlled by weight maps?

Phil
02-23-2008, 08:59 AM
Waiting for more to arrive :)

JGary
02-23-2008, 09:08 AM
I wonder if this new hair fx, when applied to a object, will react dynamically to its movement if it is mdd based? Lightwave has a long way to go before I will use it for character animation again, and I expect I would still animate in Maya and export the animation, via a mdd file, back to Lightwave for rendering...unless the new fbx I/O works so awesomely well that I could transfer joint movement/weighting between the two apps.

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 09:31 AM
Someone asked for messy hair. It's another ball, sadly, but it's what I received. Still no comment on FPrime, but my expectation is that it won't work because FPrime doesn't handle volumetrics or pixel filters.

that ball seem to be the close to grass so far...id like to see thicker fibers if possible. or if possible fibers that are broad and flat, like grass......

if only i would have 9.5 beta in my hands....

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-23-2008, 09:32 AM
I wonder if this new hair fx, when applied to a object, will react dynamically to its movement if it is mdd based? Lightwave has a long way to go before I will use it for character animation again, and I expect I would still animate in Maya and export the animation, via a mdd file, back to Lightwave for rendering...unless the new fbx I/O works so awesomely well that I could transfer joint movement/weighting between the two apps.

Totally, :agree:

Phil
02-23-2008, 09:54 AM
Newly received. Hair up-close. I'm hoping to get some animation sooner or later. And some backlit/GI work.

Just look at that curve quality. Stunning. Simply stunning.

Phil
02-23-2008, 10:08 AM
And backlit....

Balls are no more apparently. I'm not sure what is coming next. Interesting.

KillMe
02-23-2008, 10:17 AM
cant you vary the width of the hairs? they all look exactly teh same width and without them tapering i find you always end up with a balding look

would also like to see it used to great some grass effect

pixelranger
02-23-2008, 10:40 AM
Quote *Pete*: "its like global warming or religion would suddenly be more important and vital for mankind that LW 9.5?...not likely"

global warming and religion is fatal, not vital, for mankind. And jugding by the new features in 9.5 and considering how many hours I will be glued in front of it I have a suspicion it will be fatal, not vital, at least for me, as well. :)
But seriously, the new stuff looks great. It's important to have some knowledge about the etchnical side of it, so you can see its potential and not only judge the features by the esthetic value of the images provided by the testers. Not that they don't look great, its just that there are sooo many possibilities.

I'm really eager to see what they have come up with concerning joints, having exclusively rigged and animated in Maya for the last two and a half years.

And the new UV tools look great. Allthough we have a maya based pipeline at work I regularly get objs from the other guys who ask me if I can unwrap them in lw using the plg plugin. :)

wavemaster
02-23-2008, 10:48 AM
PLG unwrap is great... I wish MR.PLG made his plug work with regular edge selection.

Raccoon Bandit
02-23-2008, 10:58 AM
Heres a quick look at why we like the new Photometric (IES) lights. While not a solution for every problem they really have their uses. The attached image(s) are all using the exact same settings except for light types and their specific settings although the intensity remained the same for them all. Please don't bite my head off on the AA it is only set at 3 with AS on also so I could render quickly (all renders are well under an hour!) with Monte Carlos GI.

In addition to the two hanging lamps theres an HDRI used to help with the dielectric vase, marbles and logo, plus an area light (set to a quality of 3) mainly to show the interaction of the hanging lights with shadows. The GI as I said was Monte Carlos, Interpolated at default settings except for Bounces are set to 2 and Rays to 150.

pixelranger
02-23-2008, 11:00 AM
me: "It's important to have some knowledge about the ETCHNICAL side of it, so you can see its potential and not only judge the features by the esthetic value of the images provided by the testers. Not that they don't look great, its just that there are sooo many possibilities."

I meant technical, not etchnical, off course :)

RonGC
02-23-2008, 11:04 AM
Does the new UV mapping have a way to directly export the UV map at user specified dimensions?

Ron

theo
02-23-2008, 11:21 AM
Heres a quick look at why we like the new Photometric (IES) lights. While not a solution for every problem they really have their uses. The attached image(s) are all using the exact same settings except for light types and their specific settings although the intensity remained the same for them all. Please don't bite my head off on the AA it is only set at 3 with AS on also so I could render quickly (all renders are well under an hour!) with Monte Carlos GI.

In addition to the two hanging lamps theres an HDRI used to help with the dielectric vase, marbles and logo, plus an area light (set to a quality of 3) mainly to show the interaction of the hanging lights with shadows. The GI as I said was Monte Carlos, Interpolated at default settings except for Bounces are set to 2 and Rays to 150.

Wow!

Phil
02-23-2008, 11:24 AM
cant you vary the width of the hairs? they all look exactly teh same width and without them tapering i find you always end up with a balding look

would also like to see it used to great some grass effect

FF4 could, so FiberFX likely can as well - using gradients, textures, etc. From what I can tell, the idea here is to assess quality. Each image is designed to test a certain aspect. I don't have one yet with variable width. I'll ask to see if there's one available somewhere.

RonGC
02-23-2008, 11:33 AM
I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you mean export the UV viewport as an image with user defined dimensions?

Yes export as an image at user defined dimensions. Other UV mappers allow you to do this.

Ron

Cageman
02-23-2008, 11:38 AM
Yes export as an image at user defined dimensions. Other UV mappers allow you to do this.

Ron

Untill that functionality becomes native in LW, I suggest you get this (http://www.flay.com/GetDetail.cfm?ID=1172) ASAP! ;)

EDIT: Works with LW8 and LW9.x so far...

Exception
02-23-2008, 11:40 AM
Hey there's weird bearded guys wearing shirts with a swirly logo sleeping on my porch!

*shoo* *shoo*

Direwolf_NL
02-23-2008, 11:46 AM
Untill that functionality becomes native in LW, I suggest you get this (http://www.flay.com/GetDetail.cfm?ID=1172) ASAP! ;)

EDIT: Works with LW8 and LW9.x so far...

Or use export to eps.

RonGC
02-23-2008, 11:47 AM
Untill that functionality becomes native in LW, I suggest you get this (http://www.flay.com/GetDetail.cfm?ID=1172) ASAP! ;)

EDIT: Works with LW8 and LW9.x so far...
Thats what im asking, oh so subtly, is it native now and if it isnt can we make it so. I already have uvimaginator, and uvmapper and uveditpro etc. i would just like to be able to export the uvmap image directly from LW in an image format and dimension of my choice.

Ron

RonGC
02-23-2008, 11:54 AM
Maybe im asking too much from Lightwave. Just seems to me that if we are developing new UV tools image export would be a good addition.

Ron

DogBoy
02-23-2008, 12:01 PM
I don't think you are asking too much, I just think it would be fairly far down on my list of things to do (then again I like the EPS saver, as it fits into my workflow nicely). Ask hard enough though, and you might just get it.

RonGC
02-23-2008, 12:06 PM
I don't think you are asking too much, I just think it would be fairly far down on my list of things to do (then again I like the EPS saver, as it fits into my workflow nicely). Ask hard enough though, and you might just get it.

Im just a fan of the most complete solution in one box. This was something LW used to be able to brag about. I like native options.

Ron

pixelranger
02-23-2008, 12:16 PM
Doesn't the aforementioned UVimaginator (I didn't check the link, but I guess that was what he linked to) do excactly what you ask? I use it all the time.

Or... get a an external plugin called meya, mayo, maya or something like that, import your obj, open the UVTexture editor and make a uv snapshot, then carry on with the rest of your business in lw.

Mitja
02-23-2008, 12:26 PM
Not disagreeing with the fact that an image export would be a nice, small addition, but as DogBoy says, it's probably a low priority compared to other stuff.
I don't see this need: there's the UVimaginator, click the link, downlad it, install and enjoy! Why make this tool if already exists and works (good)? And it's free. With all setting you need.

Auger
02-23-2008, 12:33 PM
As far as I know, UVImaginator only sees linear Subpatch interpolation. It would be nice to have it do the other interpolation modes for more accurate maps.

SonicPerfect
02-23-2008, 12:41 PM
The new light and fur systems looks awesome!!
Please post more!!
Lightwave Rocks!! ;D

*Pete*
02-23-2008, 12:46 PM
Hey there's weird bearded guys wearing shirts with a swirly logo sleeping on my porch!

*shoo* *shoo*

homeless LW users most likely...throw them a bone (or information) and they just might leave you alone.

...you dont have any other option, really...since they already know where you live, they wont leave easily and in the worst case might stay there for weeks....use an IES light on them, or give them some weed..eh, grass..fiberx grass that is ;)

RonGC
02-23-2008, 12:50 PM
I fully realize that there are add-on plugins etc that do the job, but as NT is developing new tools a little extra functionality at development time would be appreciated.

The problem with add-on plugins by third party is that often they get abandoned or don't work on different platforms or just plain don't get updated to work with new versions of LW.

Many very nice plugins fell into the above categories. This is why i like to see the full functionality of the tools being developed by NT, not part way.

Oh well, just my opinion and i do appreciate everything that i have seen so far from NT on the 9.5 version.

Ron

Mitja
02-23-2008, 12:58 PM
This thread is becoming really boring...what dyou think?! ;)

pixelranger
02-23-2008, 12:59 PM
good point auger. However, applying a glass filter in Photoshop will give you those curves you crave (check attachment). :D

I have also had it crash a couple of times, so I guess it would be nice to have it totally integrated... But that is a low priority. At least for me.

IMI
02-23-2008, 01:02 PM
This thread is becoming really boring...what dyou think?! ;)

Not boring. More like information overload. ;)

tyrot
02-23-2008, 01:04 PM
dear mitja

yes definetly it is getting boring...because "SELECTED" testers stopped posting new images...

Best

Mitja
02-23-2008, 01:06 PM
Uninformation overload. This shoud be the right adjective.

dwburman
02-23-2008, 01:07 PM
If LW used to be the all in one package, but isn't now, what features have been removed?

Is it just our expectations have exceeded development?

Some day, I expect LW to be able to brew me a nice espresso to help productivity... I don't drink the stuff. I just want the feature to be there. :)

andywright
02-23-2008, 01:07 PM
As a fully-paid-up member of the Sasquatch owners' club, I'm not thrilled about its development dying. This new system looks okay, but I would have liked to see a Sasquatch 2.0 for my investment.

Yes but the plugin model is changing. Some things that were cutting edge and were done as plugins are now included as basic features (e.g Carrara has a good fur and hair system that works with physics etc natively, and is about to get a cloth system at next patch it seems for free). It has a good native renderer, plant system (that works with physics) and a landscape generator of a similar quality as Vue 6 infinite. And all this for cheaper than LW9. :hey:

The market has changed, and 3D software needs to be more capable out of the box else it will fall by the wayside as newer, cheaper ones move in. I am using Carrara, C4D, LW9 and Vue 6, and all have their strengths and weaknesses. And all stand to lose market position if they stand still or rely on expensive plug-ins for basic day to day needs of the artists, especially as was raised in this thread, they often have glitches or do not work on all systems.

Just my pennyworth :)

wacom
02-23-2008, 01:35 PM
nonsence...Sas is obsolete and nearly useless for most situations as it doesnt show up in FPrime or get lit by radiousity, its a pixel filter....Worley wouldnt be able to sell Sasquatch anyway as long as FF4 is on the market.
But FPrime is something unique, still...i bet Worley has given up Sas long time ago and mainly works on FPrime.

You'd be surprised how much Sas is still used in actual productions- warts and all. This side of a reyes rendering solution its still supposed to be one of the fastest out there. There are very experienced people who are TDs for mr pipelines that would LOVE to have a version of sas working on their end.

Most people in this world out side of LW actually want to be able to render hair with DEEP shadowmaps BTW, not radiosity, not GI. So far LW doesn't have those kind of shadow maps...so it's kind of back to raytraced ones in LW. Deep shadow maps and hair are awesome- fast and effective.

I'm hope'n that NewTek implements deep shadow maps by ver. 10.x as they really are a great middle ground between regular shadow maps and area lights.

gareee
02-23-2008, 02:01 PM
Good to see that uv relaxing can be done by selection, rather then the entire uv map, like plg does.

As far as existing legacy plugins, IMHO it's foolhardy for newtek to expect users to reply on them, expecially when we're talking plugns written in 2001, 2001, ect. It's great if you are a legacy users know abotu them, and where to obtain them, but suppose flay closes doors tomorrow. Then what? Look at ALL the free pkugins that make lightwave <MUCH more feature rich that could just vanish, or become almost impossible to locate.

IMHO Newtek should to the same thing as Zbrush central does.. have a forum specifically for add ons with links... And to better that, host the files whenever possible. That way they don't just vanish over the course of time.

I also agree about exporting a uvmap in jpeg, tiff, or bmp format native insode lightwave. It's not like we haven't had uv mapping now for like going on 10 years..supposed uvimaginator does work in vista.. vista 64, ect. Then lightwave this uber power app suddenly looses a pretty important uv feature?

IMHO something like uv mapper's export should be created. output the uv map in colors with a color chart at the bottom. as users of a high end application, we should have to hunt down piddly freebies on the web to do our work.. that's why we bought lightwave in the first place.. to have a professional application.

Since there was a nod now the modeler advances.. any hope of being able to rotating magnets before using them? Or adjustable symmetry on selectable x/y/z axis for alternate of multiple symmertrical functionality?

Pretty basic tools, that can have a pretty dramatic impact on production workflow.

gareee
02-23-2008, 02:17 PM
If LW used to be the all in one package, but isn't now, what features have been removed?

Is it just our expectations have exceeded development?

No, it's that other applications have advanced and included these features, and lightwave has fallen behind.

Great example.. at one point in time, we didn't have uv mapping, let alone uv unwrapping or relaxing. So it's a new 3d tech advance.

New applications released took advantage of it, and pressed forward, adding uv unwrapping and manipulation tools.

So do that mean Newtek doesn't need to add it because it's something new? Hell no! There was a time when new 3d features like this were introduced BY Newtek, instead of newtek playing catch up with other utilities that have already gone and run with them.

Just like there was a time when max and maya were possible up and coming applications, but Newtek was 3d king. Now lightwave's become the underdog, and I want it leading the pack, not following along a few years later.

Name another major application that didn't have native uv unwrapping at LEAST 2 years ago, (and some almost 3 now). heck even "poorboy" applications like hexagon 2.2 and silo2 have now had it before lightwave.

If I was one of the NT developers, frankly I'd have been pretty embarassed trying to explain to netwek executives why features like this weren't implimented years ago.

And I'm not trying to be a downer, or dis newtek.. it's GREAT to see them finally making advancements to catch up with the rest of the pack.

Sting
02-23-2008, 02:22 PM
I know we need to wait and see, but I thought the updates for character animation were going to replace the current system. I've read the character animation discussions here about what everyone wants to see in a new system. These updates are improvements to the current system. Is there going to be another point release for character animation? Also, I don't see any mention of consolidating the modeler tools in this update. The current list is impressive. I just wanted to know if we are going to see another update before going to 10.

RonGC
02-23-2008, 02:26 PM
The list of items they had promised for the LW 9x cycle have not all been fulfilled as yet, so i believe we should see another update yet.

Ron

gareee
02-23-2008, 02:28 PM
I think it's far too early in th game to be looking past 9.5... let's just see what they cook up, and what possibilities present themselves after 9.5, shall we?

I'm guessing the final 9.5 will probably be announced around siggraph time, and any future developements we'll see come around after that.

Thing is, there are a lot of original promises in the lw9 cycle that still haven;t come to pass, and I'm not sure how many people will buy into these same promises being forthcoming in a lw 10 cycle.

IMHO to get some additional cash flowing, maybe the next cycle after 95. could be a relativly inexpensive upgrade.. say $100-$200 for current license holders, and new features could be added to it. I KNOW I wouldn't shell out another $500 or $600 based on the current track record of developement.

But that's more nagative feelings and I'd rather keep this thread positive on newtek's bright shiny future, shall we?

JBT27
02-23-2008, 02:44 PM
I know we need to wait and see, but I thought the updates for character animation were going to replace the current system. I've read the character animation discussions here about what everyone wants to see in a new system. These updates are improvements to the current system. Is there going to be another point release for character animation? Also, I don't see any mention of consolidating the modeler tools in this update. The current list is impressive. I just wanted to know if we are going to see another update before going to 10.

Major feature-set replacements may only appear in LWX, especially CA tools. These 9.5 additions do seem like just that: additions. But I wouldn't expect any completely new way of doing CA until X. But then I have no idea :)

Are we seeing dynamics and volumetric improvements in the 9.x cycle? Substantial Modeler additions? Wider spread use of the nodal system for animation and dynamics?

There's an awful lot of stuff to be done, and carefully at that.....I reckon we'll see a 9.5.1 maintenance release like we got a 9.3.1, and then maybe another point release before X. At the current average rate, what do we reckon for GM on 9.5? Summer - June/July, sooner? And then back-end of 2008 for OB on the next 9.x point-release, with X sometime in 2009? ..... at this rate I wouldn't be surprised to see X in 2010. Whatever, no big deal - pointless speculation :D

Julian.

Lightwolf
02-23-2008, 02:44 PM
Great example.. at one point in time, we didn't have uv mapping, let alone uv unwrapping or relaxing. So it's a new 3d tech advance.

Surprisingly it isn't. It is the basis of just about any mapping really. The only thing new is that at one point in time (ages ago) UV coordinates were directly exposed to the user. And the reliance of 3D hardware on UV coordinates was imho one of the major reasons for LW to add that functionality.

Some things are just old tech that LW has never adopted (vertex normals being another example). That had advantages as the tools weren't advanced enough to handle them nicely, but times are changing.

Cheers,
Mike

gareee
02-23-2008, 02:49 PM
I like seeing "LWX".. hope Newtek adopts this!

I'm speculating we'll see a siggraph announcement for LWX in 2009, with a projected winter release, and like LW9, it'll be either towards the end of winter, or then early spring.

Only issue really is if Newtek can survive that long without another major release for cash flow reasons.

Sting
02-23-2008, 02:51 PM
Thanks for the replies. I like what has been done. I can wait even if that means not seeing what I expected until version 10.

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 02:53 PM
I have a feeling that Sasquatch 2.0 will knock your socks off :)


in 2020 ?

prospector
02-23-2008, 03:15 PM
HMMMM, nothing up for awhile....

Philbert
02-23-2008, 03:15 PM
suppose flay closes doors tomorrow. Then what?

Archive.org? :p But really, I used to use UVImaginator, but then I discovered EPS Export and never went back. Something like UVI might be nice, but I don't really see it as a priority item. There are far more important for NT to be worrying about.

Cageman
02-23-2008, 03:28 PM
Raccoon Bandit has created a thread regarding LW9.5 Lights:

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80460

EDIT: I just love that name... Raccoon Bandit! :)

RonGC
02-23-2008, 04:32 PM
Archive.org? :p But really, I used to use UVImaginator, but then I discovered EPS Export and never went back. Something like UVI might be nice, but I don't really see it as a priority item. There are far more important for NT to be worrying about.

It may not be a priority but if they have people working on the uv portion of LW at this time, then now is the right time to hit them up for extra improvements. They are totally up to speed on this specific code at this time. After version 9.5 they may be assigned to work on other areas of LW, then it could be years to get these little items attended to.

It is not just the big ticket items that make a killer app, its the attention to all the little extras.

Ron

DeepThroat
02-23-2008, 04:49 PM
:newtek:

zapper1998
02-23-2008, 04:51 PM
:cry: :cry: :cry:


OMG


:cry: :cry: :cry:

DragonFist
02-23-2008, 05:14 PM
:agree:
Nice! :thumbsup:

JeffrySG
02-23-2008, 05:14 PM
:newtek:
looks pretty friggin' cool...

___mats___
02-23-2008, 05:22 PM
any really nice arch viz interior in 9.5 perhaps?? otacon / vray quality level?

too much to ask? :D

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 05:31 PM
:newtek:


Dear throat!

can u recrate somethin like this
http://www.worley.com/Media/animations/sasquatch/dynamica.avi

i just cant look on that black object under your fur... make it fat density with lot more randomness in combing

COBRASoft
02-23-2008, 05:33 PM
For all current beta testers: I think you guys are teasing us. I think you know very well what LW 9.5 is capable off and you are showing us just the tip of the ice mountain.

Each time we are all saying 'wow, amazing, superb, impressive...' you guys come up with something better, faster, easier, ...

So, to all of you, show us what the new LW is really capable of doing and stop playing with us, it's bad for our hearts! :)

For the rest, thank you for giving some nice previews and thank you Newtek for allowing it.

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 05:34 PM
also is there timoty albee on beta list he is brilliant fur guy i would like to see somethin from him

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 05:46 PM
also is there timoty albee on beta list he is brilliant fur guy i would like to see somethin from him


btw i just saw this thread on cgtalk about dog commercial
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?threadid=597571&utm_medium=plugblock&utm_source=cgtalk

guys talkin about how it is done and here is c/p

from ARVID

We ended up with about 1.5 minutes per frame for all passes on the farm in the close-up shots, which makes it about 15 minutes per frame and node. We had to go up to 2/3 AA to avoid flickering in the hair, we used 600,000 hairs to get a soft look (100k x 6).

Oh and thanks everyone, highly appreciated, I enjoyed working on this spot, great team!
--------------------------

so this flickering is as some1 already mention common to all fur systems

mav3rick
02-23-2008, 05:53 PM
OMG i quoted myself. no good.. it's time to go sleep ....

Hidden Halibut
02-23-2008, 06:03 PM
Removed

T-Light
02-23-2008, 06:05 PM
I really should pop in more often.
It's taken hours to read this lot. What happened to Saturday?

Roll on March, desperate to play with Jon's new hair. :thumbsup:

[edit - now that just sounds plain wrong]

kfinla
02-23-2008, 06:51 PM
I actually emailed worley the other day to ask if Sasquatch's development was dead?

"We're definitely working on a UB versions of FPrime and Sasquatch but at
this point can't really predict when they will be ready. The updates will most likely require a new version of LightWave with some new SDK additions in order to overcome the stablitily issues associated with LW and FPrime on the Mac. Hopefully these SDK additions will make it into upcoming LW 9.5 update."

So it sounds like if there is a new Sasquatch it will be fprime friendly.

I haven't seen any very convincing hair yet so far from FiberFX.. as ppl have said u can clearly see patterns and uniformity that don't occur in nature. I realize this is perhaps v.0.9 and testers have not had long to play with it.. im just going by what i have sceen so far.

hrgiger
02-23-2008, 06:57 PM
There's been some people in this thread kind of cutting on Sasquatch (cutting, get it? Nevermind) But I haven't seen anything yet from the new FiberFX (or Fiber Factory for that matter) that looks as good as Sas hair. Sas may be limited due to the fact that it won't render in reflections and only uses shadow maps but Sas fur does have its own dynamics engine which works awesome and does not need any calculation time. It renders fast and has lots of options for creating the type of hair you want. I'm looking forward to playing with the new fiberFx to see how good it can be. I hope that they will keep developing it and not let it stagnate.

meatycheesyboy
02-23-2008, 07:31 PM
I'm looking forward to playing with the new fiberFx to see how good it can be. I hope that they will keep developing it and not let it stagnate.

I'm always worried about this especially when you look at things like HyperVoxels, CC SubDs, Viper, and IK Boost which have gotten no updates either since they were introduced or in a very long time. But then I look at all the progress they've made and speed they've made it in the renderer and I start to get hopeful. So, I guess at this point it's unfortunately one of those wait and see things.

[nagging] So NT, don't let FiberFX fall to the wayside and don't forget to update the other things I've mentioned as well. [end nagging]

MiniFireDragon
02-23-2008, 07:39 PM
9.5 hairball

OMG... the trebles has learned to time travel and have come back in time!!!

GregMalick
02-23-2008, 08:51 PM
There's been some people in this thread kind of cutting on Sasquatch (cutting, get it? Nevermind) But I haven't seen anything yet from the new FiberFX (or Fiber Factory for that matter) that looks as good as Sas hair. Sas may be limited due to the fact that it won't render in reflections and only uses shadow maps but Sas fur does have its own dynamics engine which works awesome and does not need any calculation time. It renders fast and has lots of options for creating the type of hair you want. I'm looking forward to playing with the new fiberFx to see how good it can be. I hope that they will keep developing it and not let it stagnate.

Since I already own SAS, I'm looking forward to the new fiberFX as simply another tool to be used where appropriate.

MCB, had a good point. HV's haven't gotten many enhancements lately. I would love to see some action in that area.. :phone_cal

richcz3
02-24-2008, 12:29 AM
....Thing is, there are a lot of original promises in the lw9 cycle that still haven;t come to pass, and I'm not sure how many people will buy into these same promises being forthcoming in a lw 10 cycle.....
There in lay my reservations and reworked expectations. No doubt we're getting nice new features not mentioned before - But some initially brought up before 9.0's release are still WIPs @ 9.5. Will there be a 9.7?..Should we expect these features promoted in 9 to be rock solid working in 10? I think thats a fair question.

If you follow this course, features to be announced for 10 will be worked on through 10 development and up until 11's release. I hope a key focus of 10 is CA at the start - but even then it starts to feel like a long journey to 10.5.

jin choung
02-24-2008, 12:35 AM
ick... it looks like hair club for men! why are the hairs growing in discrete CLUMPS? are we gonna call the tool HAIR PLUG?!

lol!

hopefully that's not the best in show for 9.5 hair....

jin

Verlon
02-24-2008, 01:07 AM
In all fairness, if the 9.5 beta were prefectly implemented and rock solid, we would all have a copy in our download box by now.

I am sure the guys testing it are working as hard as they know how. While they may not test things exactly how *I* would like to see it done, who knows what limitations they are working under?

As far as it goes, I'd love to know more about the new bones (joints). Are you guys able to share?

How much do the IK/FK enhancements help with CA?

Symmetry tolerance...how is that working? Is it useful?

Is the new OPENGL lighting system just the IES lights? Or is the more to it? Like more than 8 lights (I thought latest openGL allowed more...could easily be wrong)?
Hair and FPrime preview mode? PRETTY PLEASE?

Medi8or
02-24-2008, 04:36 AM
Ohh.. Hairy goodness.

I kind of suspected NT was working on their own solution, with the fancy line-rendering in 9.3.1, but I didn't expect to get hair in 9.5. :D

Thomas M.
02-24-2008, 05:09 AM
That's something I realised while Proton showed his basketball net video. That's been almost like hair...

Philbert
02-24-2008, 06:41 AM
Ohh.. Hairy goodness.

I kind of suspected NT was working on their own solution, with the fancy line-rendering in 9.3.1, but I didn't expect to get hair in 9.5. :D

Hmm It's either a brillo pad or the trees from Final Fantasy: Advent Children.

*Pete*
02-24-2008, 06:43 AM
Ohh.. Hairy goodness.

I kind of suspected NT was working on their own solution, with the fancy line-rendering in 9.3.1, but I didn't expect to get hair in 9.5. :D

is that image made with fiberx and lw 9.5?...thick fibers, finally :D

cresshead
02-24-2008, 07:05 AM
i know that screen grabs are not doable with joints and the new character animations tool 'just yet' but these are much higher on my list than fur/hair as you'll only be using fur hair on characters to haveing good ik/rigging tools is a essential step toward thinking about adding fur...poor charater rig>>no fur needed!

''joint'' developments please!!!

i'ts a bit odd how everyone was SO focused on NEW character tools and all ...but gone with the shiny fur tools in the spotlight so far
seems dangling a glitter ball in front of lw's eyes takes their mind off of important stuff like the rigging/animation toolset.:D

cresshead
02-24-2008, 07:10 AM
we need rigged/animated cats!

....then once rigged we can think about FUR!

jasonwestmas
02-24-2008, 07:21 AM
I've got a rigged and automated maine coon in my living room atm.

Medi8or
02-24-2008, 07:42 AM
is that image made with fiberx and lw 9.5?...thick fibers, finally :D
I wish!
Unfortunately I have only 9.3.1 to play with :cry: , so it's just 2-point polys and edge-rendering..

dballesg
02-24-2008, 08:03 AM
i know that screen grabs are not doable with joints and the new character animations tool 'just yet' but these are much higher on my list than fur/hair as you'll only be using fur hair on characters to haveing good ik/rigging tools is a essential step toward thinking about adding fur...poor charater rig>>no fur needed!

''joint'' developments please!!!

i'ts a bit odd how everyone was SO focused on NEW character tools and all ...but gone with the shiny fur tools in the spotlight so far
seems dangling a glitter ball in front of lw's eyes takes their mind off of important stuff like the rigging/animation toolset.:D

Maybe a screenshot it is not possible, but someone can take an arm, add bones and a joint on the elbow, animate it and post the rendered animation, so at least we can see how the new joints affect the deformations in the mesh! :)

theo
02-24-2008, 08:28 AM
Forgive me if this has been mentioned previously but I wonder if the 'instancing' process in the hairFX module can be utilized for populating a surface with objects other than poly strands.

Philbert
02-24-2008, 08:34 AM
Forgive me if this has been mentioned previously but I wonder if the 'instancing' process in the hairFX module can be utilized for populating a surface with objects other than poly strands.

Well earlier we saw beads in the hair, perhaps you could just do that and make the hair invisible or somehow too thin to be seen, something like that.

theo
02-24-2008, 08:39 AM
Well earlier we saw beads in the hair, perhaps you could just do that and make the hair invisible or somehow too thin to be seen, something like that.

Or, landscape objects over geopolys?

hrgiger
02-24-2008, 08:40 AM
I've got a rigged and automated maine coon in my living room atm.

You have an automatic teller machine in your living room? Kooky.

Exception
02-24-2008, 08:47 AM
Does everyone realize LW 9.5 is not even in beta yet?
Just saying... all these requests... and was has been shown will mature a lot over the next weeks, I'm sure.

RonGC
02-24-2008, 08:53 AM
Request when they are in an active development phase makes sense to me.

Ron

theo
02-24-2008, 08:58 AM
Does everyone realize LW 9.5 is not even in beta yet?
Just saying... all these requests... and was has been shown will mature a lot over the next weeks, I'm sure.

It is amazing how much interest 9.5 is generating. The requests are probably just a natural blossoming of inquisitive energy.

The anticipation factor around here anymore is a marketing goldmine.

hard8
02-24-2008, 09:04 AM
I really don't care too much about the new features in 9.5 cause the only feature I want is stability.

I didn't have time to read through the whole thread, but can anyone confirm better stability on mutli-core macs with 9.5?

colkai
02-24-2008, 09:04 AM
Request when they are in an active development phase makes sense to me.

Ron
Likewise, when I'm working, sometimes such things put me in a "ohh, that's an idea" mood. Especially if you feel it wouldn't overburden your code to implement it. Even if it seems it would be a task at present, always good to have these things as possible future features. :) (Doesn't mean they'll all get implemented mind ye. ;) ).

colkai
02-24-2008, 09:05 AM
I didn't have time to read through the whole thread, but can anyone confirm better stability on mutli-core macs with 9.5?
Nope... 'cause we ain't got it yet. ;)

starbase1
02-24-2008, 09:16 AM
I really don't care too much about the new features in 9.5 cause the only feature I want is stability.

I didn't have time to read through the whole thread, but can anyone confirm better stability on mutli-core macs with 9.5?

That's exactly the kind of thing you can't tell from a beta version...

hrgiger
02-24-2008, 09:22 AM
If it were stable and all features worked flawlessly right out of the gate , there would be pretty much no reason to go to beta.

parm
02-24-2008, 09:56 AM
we need rigged/animated cats!

....then once rigged we can think about FUR!

You'll get no argument here :thumbsup:

Thanks for the previews everyone. Never imagined native hair/fur was on the cards. Looking forward to the OB. Until then, keep em coming :)

Exception
02-24-2008, 10:12 AM
Request when they are in an active development phase makes sense to me.


I wasn't talking about feature requests, I was talking about image and example requests.
I'm sure they're working their socks off testing and making all of this. Requesting animations of 500 flying furry balls with full dynamics in a church under 10 bounce radiosity while cached and compared to 9.3.1 on Mac UB on a 386 running on wind power is perhaps a bit of a chore, and is perhaps hampered by people wanting to do more testing and/or fixing and/or adding of features :)

jasonwestmas
02-24-2008, 10:37 AM
I wasn't talking about feature requests, I was talking about image and example requests.
I'm sure they're working their socks off testing and making all of this. Requesting animations of 500 flying furry balls with full dynamics in a church under 10 bounce radiosity while cached and compared to 9.3.1 on Mac UB on a 386 running on wind power is perhaps a bit of a chore, and is perhaps hampered by people wanting to do more testing and/or fixing and/or adding of features :)

LOL! This is the perfect test for software performance!

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-24-2008, 11:26 AM
FurBall....LW9.5!
hairs.rar (http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=55066&d=1203810556)

Okay, i think this whole thing with FiberFX hype is still somewhat cryptic, despite what people say and show. Is FiberFX FiberFactory4 purchased? If yes, is it a full or limited version, like SasLite was to Sasquatch? If not and it's a brand new NewTek's solution, should we expect to see features that'll replace Sasquatch completely, until maybe a newer Sasquatch version emerges, if ever?

Since, we don't have the 9.5 beta to test it ourselves, unless someone step up and show some quality results, we can not judge if this new "hair and fur" solution, is in par or not, quality and features wise, with Sasquatch, as everybody feels and saying so far. I mean, one correctly would think, that since FiberFX is like 8 years newer than Sasquatch, it would fly circles around it. It should and i'm sure we all hope so, but we have to see some really good examples of it's hair/fur quality first.

Anyway, last night i cooked a "one minute setup" test with Sasquatch, just for comparison and considering that the settings i used for the fur was almost the defaults of the plugin, i think the results are okay. I only altered the colors by adding a simple image on the fur and adjusted it's density/length. The rest is the FI's Flabby plugin and 2 hours of rendering on my sig's PCs for 200 frames of animation. Too bad, i forgot the shading quality at only 50% and the rearward polygon quality at only 10%.

http://www.sub-pixel.com/FurBall.jpg

Here (http://www.sub-pixel.com/FurBall.mov) you'll find the QuickTime Sorenson 3 movie (9MB)...

Here (http://www.sub-pixel.com/FurBall.zip) is the scene, for those who want to test it, including the FI's Flabby plugin, which is freebie in case you don't have it. Of course, you'll need Sasquatch full version...

Maybe someone with 9.5 would have the time and be kind enough to try and replicate this rendering, so we have a standing reference point to compare the two.
Although, probably we'll have to wait until the 9.5 Open Beta cycle starts and more people fiddle with FiberFX, in order to minimize the man hours that needed for quality results...

Cheers,
T.Rex

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-24-2008, 11:27 AM
Having said that, i'm not really interested in hair and fur. I'd love someone to speak or show about the new animation I/O options like FBX and Collada and how intuitive and transparent is the IK/FK blending.
Also, more info about the new Light plugin class. It should be possible to add more and new Light types, along with the default ones, yes? What about caustics, volumetrics and lens flares for those new type of lights?

All 'n all, 9.5 looks as a much needed solid update with some critical key-point features and shows that the dev team is moving forward, so congratulations to all involved for the hard work...

Cheers,
T.Rex

wavemaster
02-24-2008, 11:33 AM
I was also wondering if light portals will be possible with the new light class?

Lightwolf
02-24-2008, 11:46 AM
It should be possible to add more and new Light types, along with the default ones, yes?
That would be the point of it all I suppose :D

What about caustics, volumetrics and lens flares for those new type of lights?
I have no idea about caustics... volumetrics could work (even without any direct support by the light plugin)... lens flares aren't a light effect, so I doubt they are influenced by that. (technically lens flares happen in the camera, and in LW they are more like image filters).

I was also wondering if light portals will be possible with the new light class?
Hm, they way I undertstand them that's more of a function of the GI renderer than something I'd expect a light to handle by itself.

Cheers,
Mike

GraphXs
02-24-2008, 11:50 AM
Man ,gone all week at GDC and this is what I come back to! Sweet! :lwicon: :thumbsup: :newtek:

Olaf
02-24-2008, 12:11 PM
looks all nice. i want to know how USABLE the new features are.

vadermanchild
02-24-2008, 01:06 PM
Is there any examples of fur that looks like GOOD fur?

Sasquatch might not be suitable for all things but its hard to get examples as poor as some shown from 9.5

Im not going to ditch sas fur look quality for rendering in reflections.


Hopefully someone can show a convincing render in the coming weeks.

richcz3
02-24-2008, 01:19 PM
Having said that, i'm not really interested in hair and fur. I'd love someone to speak or show about the new animation I/O options like FBX and Collada and how intuitive and transparent is the IK/FK blending....
I'm OK with the hair inclusion but Not at the expense of anything else that came before it. I would guess allot of people are interested to see how dynamic the changes are to CA. What examples could be showcased in regard to CA as its the first thing noted for 9.5 Beta. :D (Hopes hopes hopes - but remains reserved) I'm guessing we'll get to preview those changes come March...

The 9 Cycle has been huge for many aspects of render improvements which are very welcome - but other areas need to be leveled up now as we're hitting that midway point. I imagine 9.7 will be a blockbuster.

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-24-2008, 02:03 PM
I doubt that we'll see a 9.7, though there was once a 5.7 "internal" version...
Probably, a 9.6 next winter and that's it for 9.x cycle.
Then, move ahead to 10.0, which i bet will be as huge, as was the transition from 5.6 to 6... :)

WillBellJr
02-24-2008, 02:12 PM
http://newtek.com/forums/showpost.php?p=658502&postcount=305


http://www.willbelljr.net/public/funnypics/OrsonLikes.gif

jin choung
02-24-2008, 02:54 PM
trex's hair example is great. the posted examples from 9.5 can't hold a candle to it... as i said, hopefully what we've seen so far is not best in show.

jin

p.s. as for cress' sentiment, i am soooooooo in agreement with. but regarding new ik stuff, i have faith that in this day and age, it will be right.

as for joints, i just have a ba feeling to begin with cuz it's not even described what it is.... just a word thrown out there.

WillBellJr
02-24-2008, 03:02 PM
I have a number of test scenes lined up on my farm to test all this when my open beta arrives! ;) Exciting times! Looks like they looked better to vray/kray/modo/mentalray(/messiah?) this time!

Only thing left for me renderwise is vertex normals import from OBJ to be able to render triangulated meshes from CAD programs correctly in LW (the way gfxcard OpenGL deal with them in realtime in the CAD gui's ...) Every other renderer supports this by now.

Yes, I'm praying that this is improved! I totally moved over to Cinema 4D XL because my MOI objects just weren't looking as clean as they did in C4D after import! :grumpy:

I've invested so much time and money into LW since v6.5 - I'd love to have it on top of my 3D toolkit again since I know it so well! :king:
(After seeing all of this, I have incentive now to upgrade to v10 again if all works out well!)

-Will

gareee
02-24-2008, 03:03 PM
"as i said, hopefully what we've seen so far is not best in show."

Gee, let's see, these guys are posting BETA test shots with a new version they JUST got.

You really think they've mastered it in a few days, when it's not even already completely coded?

jin choung
02-24-2008, 03:11 PM
it IS completely coded. beta in development parlance means that everything that's going in is in. it's all bug fixing now.

that means the hair - however it's in there now, is as good as it's gonna be for 9.5....

as for how long they've had it, i assume it's NOT coincident with the announcement. you can ask them... how long DID they have it?

and i assume that these guys are posting screenshots for the sake of enticement and 'look at this!'....

and the example with the ball is a pretty standard kinda test and you should be able to get good or at least REPRESENTATIVE results right off the bat.

your gut instinct is to think it's gonna look a lot better than we've seen? as i said, i hope you're right.

jin

hrgiger
02-24-2008, 03:14 PM
From all indications, I'm not getting rid of my full version of Sasquatch yet. I just hope they don't break it with any new releases of Lightwave. My guess is that sometimes I'll use Sasquatch and sometimes I"ll use FiberFX. It's good to have options. I've emailed Worley to ask if Sas is going to continue to see development. I've yet to hear back from them and probably won't on this issue. Software developers are so secretive. Geesh. But as someone else says, I hope this inclusion of new hair and fur in Lightwave lights a fire under Worleys butt.

Gregg "T.Rex"
02-24-2008, 03:22 PM
lens flares aren't a light effect, so I doubt they are influenced by that. (technically lens flares happen in the camera, and in LW they are more like image filters)

Yes...
I've been asking for quite some time now, to move Lens Flare options into Camera properties, along with a major core update of their functions and simply add a flag switch for each light to flare or not during rendering.

2D Lens Flares are easy in a 2D compositing package, but 3D Lens Flares are easier to control in a 3D program. I'm looking forward for the "Add Camera Plugins" slots in the Camera panel, that could easily add these type of camera specific effects... :)

Cheers,
T.Rex

RedBull
02-24-2008, 03:26 PM
Any chance that Camera Presets are fixed and properly implemented?, they were introduced in LW9.x and removed in later revisions. It would be nice to see them working after four major revisions. And has it been told officially if we are seeing shots of FiberFactory IV, or is this an internal solution?

vadermanchild
02-24-2008, 04:07 PM
Id like to see a 9.5 furry ball test that comes close to sasquatch.

I agree as a basic test it gives you a feel for what you might achieve.

The tests so far are not encouraging.

Jack of all trades - master of none?

Id hope Newtek look to better sasquatch if they are putting resource into it...otherwise its the same old LW were used to. A Free hair plugin that looks like crap isnt really what im after.