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Maxx
02-15-2008, 10:50 PM
I may have asked this before, but I can't find the thread via the search function if I did, so -

I ran a search on the boards here and it looks like my CPU may be running hot - the reason that I'm asking this is that I've had some full system locks while rendering with LW and I'd really like those to stop now, please. It's mostly with animations (radiosity or no, cached radiosity or not), but occasionally on stills. My segment memory in LW is set to 128.

According to "Super Utility" that I had to download from my mobo manufacturer's website (because apparently FoxConn WinFast boards don't come with a CD of any sort), I'm running at about 40 degrees Celsius at idle, about 68 - 70 degrees C at render. According to my readout on the front of the case, I run at about 79.5 degrees Fahrenheit at idle, and about anywhere from 82-88 degrees F at render.

I can, however, run CPU Burn-in for about 5 hours without issue, and any test I run on the RAM via my FixIt Utilities System Diagnostics comes back fine. MemTest+ was no problem on the RAM as well.

I have no earthly clue what should be acceptable temperatures for a CPU, other than the couple posts that I read that said they ran about 20 degrees C at idle. Which is *WOW* kinds of cooler than my 4-fan air-cooled system.

I'm not over-clocking my system - running an AMD 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4600+ 2.41 GHz (socket 939), with 2.0 GB RAM, on Windows XP Professional 32-bit. I do have the 3 GB switch thrown in the boot.ini, but I was having this issue more before I did that.

Anybody have any ideas where to look for a possible issue? None of my hardware appears to conflict.

Maxx
02-16-2008, 06:54 AM
Thanks neverko. I appreciate the links - gotta figure out what exactly is causing the heat-up. All my fans appear to be in working order... :grumpy:

Anyway, thanks again for the info and link!

eagleeyed
02-16-2008, 07:58 AM
Max, this may sound stupid, but was the case for me, my heatsink had came a little lose, eg, 1 out of 4 clips had dis-engaged, and the temperature was 20 above normal celcius. When I fixed that problem, temp dropped to 40 max under load.

It may not appear lose, as was the case for me, but it was, and it fixed things instantly.

crashnburn
02-16-2008, 08:59 AM
We've got the celcius, centigrade and fahrenheit scales being used. What are your temperatures in centigrade. A temp problem might become more clear.

Maxx
02-16-2008, 09:14 AM
We've got the celcius, centigrade and fahrenheit scales being used. What are your temperatures in centigrade. A temp problem might become more clear.
Sorry - the cpu reads in the software idling at 39 degrees "C" - for me, Centigrade and Celsius are interchangeable. Chalk that one up to ignorance on my part, as I honestly don't know... ;D 8~

crashnburn
02-16-2008, 09:25 AM
So going by the info neverko found there isn't a temp problem. Whats the temp under load when rendering?

Maxx
02-16-2008, 10:26 AM
So going by the info neverko found there isn't a temp problem. Whats the temp under load when rendering?
Runs right about 68 - 70 degrees C. Which looks to be about 10-12 degrees higher than the graph that neverko found.

I'm going to try cracking the case open, checking the various connections and blowing a crapload of compressed air through everything to make sure it's all good and clean. Maybe it's just gunked up?

crashnburn
02-16-2008, 10:33 AM
Have the temps slowly gone up or suddenly gone up?

Stooch
02-16-2008, 01:48 PM
athlons do run a bit hot. 75c is a warning temperature for my motherboard. so if you are anywhere near taht then yes its too hot.

another thing to check is the voltage stability on your PSU. make sure its a good PSU, voltage drops cause crashes as well. if your PSU is older than 2-3 years i would consider replacing it.

Maxx
02-16-2008, 09:27 PM
crashnburn (kind of an appropriate name for this thread, btw :D ) I honestly don't know. I've had issues intermittently with LW since the 9.0 OB started (which was about the same time I bought this system), and have replaced my mobo once already due to an apparent incompatibility. I'd also replaced my RAM and CPU, but neither the RAM nor the CPU swap made any difference. Once I got the new mobo in, I could at least render still images with only the occasional lock-up.

The case has a front-side temperature readout which I'd been checking, but that's always reported the system being between 62 and 79 degree Fahrenheit, which didn't seem too bad. It's only recently that I lighted on the idea of flashing my BIOS (I do tend to be a bit slow sometimes) and found out that the manufacturer offered a software based temperature reading. Of course, my BIOS is apparently already up to date and given the advice I've gotten in this thread it does seem to be hardware related as opposed to software, so flashing it seems a bit pointless, though I may give it a shot anyway if I can't figure anything else out.

Stooch, thanks for the confirmation on temperatures. I haven't been to 75 degrees yet, but as I said, I seem to lock right around 70 degrees, give or take one. The processor is a couple or few years old by this point, and I've got my eye on a couple of the newer models (probably going to go back to Intel, honestly - this has been my first foray into AMD-land, and I'm not the happiest about it so far...), but unfortunately I've got to make do with what I have for a bit. Or win the lotto soon. So basically, I'm trying to see if there's anything I can try to cool the system down as it is right now just to get me through for the time being.

crashnburn
02-17-2008, 05:27 AM
The first thing you can do is liik at airflow through your case. If you are using ribbon cables for your hard drives try to have them feeding round the inside edges of your case so that you dont disrupt your airflow.

What find of heatsink, fan and paste between the CPU and heatsink did you use. Some pastes are better at conducting heat away than others.

Qexit
02-17-2008, 01:41 PM
According to "Super Utility" that I had to download from my mobo manufacturer's website (because apparently FoxConn WinFast boards don't come with a CD of any sort), I don't know about your specific overheating problem. However, you mentioned that Foxconn manufactured the motherboard. It might be worth checking exactly which Foxconn board you have got and then looking on their website to make absolutely sure that it supports the cpu you are using.

The only reason I'm suggesting this is that I recently encountered/uncovered a motherboard mismatch problem with a Foxconn motherboard that came as standard in a retail PC. In this case, it involved an Intel QX6700 quad core Extreme and a Foxconn 975X7AB-8EKRS2H motherboard. Advent, here in the UK, shipped a high-end gaming PC with this cpu and motherboard installed. All of the components (with the possible exception of the motherboard) were top spec but they were plagued with unexplained crashes and overheating problems. The explanation turned out to be that only the version 2.0 release of this board supported Quad core extreme cpus, the voltage regulator on the version 1.0 could not cope and caused no end of problems. The systems all shipped with version 1.0 boards. So there is a chance that you have a similar problem. It isn't exactly easy to find out this sort of info on the Foxconn site though.

lardbros
02-17-2008, 03:27 PM
68 - 70 degrees C sounds really hot, even under load. But I'm not sure what temperature ranges apply to an Athlon X2.

My overclocked Core 2 (2.4 GHz -> 3.0 GHz) is running at about 26 C while idling and not above 40 C at sustained load. I'm running a large air cooler at a low 1300 rpm for near silent operation. I only have a single 120 mm rear fan in the case, and that's it.

You might need to take a look at your heat sink and disassemble / clean / reassemble the CPU cooling parts, as well as apply new cooling paste.

Just out of interest, what air cooler are you using and where did you get it? I have a core2duo and find mine is running at around 50 C Idling. I'm using the standard Intel Fan and heatsink though, and have heard these aren't too great! Something is very noisy in my PC too, and i'm not sure which fan it is, but it could be my intel one?

Thanks in advance for any advice! :thumbsup:

crashnburn
02-17-2008, 03:46 PM
My E6600 idles at 29C with the OEM heatsink and fan. You definately have a problem. Mine runs at 40C at full tilt and about 44C when running at 3Ghz. I would check your fan is running properly, modern CPUs die very quickly if are allowed to overheat. Some friends of mine work in a PC workshop where I used to help out and they tried an Athlon XP processor without a heatsink. It last literally a few seconds.

Good airflow through your PC is important too. If it hasn't got airflow through the case then areas in the case start to get hot and the CPU fan just re-circulates warm air over the heatsink.

Maxx
02-17-2008, 03:49 PM
Qexit - thanks for the info. When I researched the Foxconn, it touted compatibility with the AMD x2 64 939-pin that I'm using. This is actually the second mobo in the system - apparently the mobo that the manufacturer swore would work fine with the CPU didn't, in fact, work with the CPU.

I don't know what heat sink or glue was used - how would I find out on the heatsink? Is it labeled? (I ask having not torn the system apart yet.) The glue I could probably find out by calling the tech that re-installed the new motherboard - he also swapped out the CPU for a while, to no avail.

I've run about every system diagnostics software I can find - MemTest, CPU Burn, everything in the FixIt Utilities suite, and everything comes back fine. I haven't, now that I think of it, run CPU burn with the new software based temperature read-out. That could prove interesting... I'll probably give that a shot tomorrow.

Thanks to all for the advice and experiences shared so far in this thread!

lardbros
02-17-2008, 03:49 PM
My E6600 idles at 29C with the OEM heatsink and fan. You definately have a problem. Mine runs at 40C at full tilt and about 44C when running at 3Ghz. I would check your fan is running properly, modern CPUs die very quickly if are allowed to overheat. Some friends of mine work in a PC workshop where I used to help out and they tried an Athlon XP processor without a heatsink. It last literally a few seconds.

Good airflow through your PC is important too. If it hasn't got airflow through the case then areas in the case start to get hot and the CPU fan just re-circulates warm air over the heatsink.


It still seems cooler than most. I just checked out the Intel website and they have 60C as the temp on there. My PC has been running like this for a year now, so it can't be fatal, just not as good as running it at a lower temp. Oh and my CPU fan is running at 2500rpm, is that normal?

Maxx
02-17-2008, 03:51 PM
crashnburn - I opted for the case with 4 fans (1 on top, 2 in back, 1 on the side with a tunnel to the CPU), and all appear to be working. I'll do what I can to check again, and to make sure that I haven't somehow turned the fan speed down (I've got a knob on the front of the case that supposedly controls fan speed, though I've never heard or seen a difference when it's twisted.)

Maxx
02-17-2008, 03:52 PM
lardbros - what did you use to figure out the actual RPM on your fans?

lardbros
02-17-2008, 03:54 PM
lardbros - what did you use to figure out the actual RPM on your fans?

Some shoddy piece of software bundled with my MOBO. Called AI booster or something! :)

crashnburn
02-17-2008, 03:57 PM
Mines rendering a job at the moment and my fan is running at 1600rpm. I was thinking of getting a different heatsink and fan but listening to others temp figures I don't think I'll bother.

Qexit
02-17-2008, 04:39 PM
Some shoddy piece of software bundled with my MOBO. Called AI booster or something! :)So you've got an Asus board too :D For the record, one of my QX6700s idles at around 29-31 C and goes up to around 55-57 C under full load while the other one idles at 30-33 and goes up to 57-60 C. Fan on first goes from 780 idle to around 2100 under load while the other idels at 850 and up to 2500-2600 under load. The only difference between the two is the motherboard they're installed on (identical case, PSU, RAM, Harddrives, DVD and Akasa H/S+Fan) and the graphics card (7950GT and 7800GTX)


I don't know what heat sink or glue was used - how would I find out on the heatsink?The heat sink may or may not be labeled. Quite often the only way to identify the model is to match it up to the appearance of another one. No real way of knowing what heatsink paste was used. Just needs to be applied in a good, thin even layer though.

Sonitrolio
02-17-2008, 08:46 PM
I can't vouch for the validity of this CHART (http://users.erols.com/chare/elec.htm), but I haven't ever burned any processors up while using it as a reference. (It took me a while to get my watercooler working properly.)

lardbros
02-18-2008, 03:44 AM
Okay, so mine was running hotter than normal then... just changed the thermal paste and now it's running at 43C and 46C for each core. That's just idling though. I would be more happy with it running at around the 30C mark though. Fan is currently running alot slower too, which is good for my ears.

Just out of interest have any of you used the SpeedFan tool? Im running it now, and there's a worrying temperature that keeps fluctuating. At the moment it's on 100C and under the Internal Temperature heading. Where the hell could it be getting this hot on my PC, and being recorded?? It shows up a flame warning too in SpeedFan, but i don't know if that's because it's not configured to the right limits.

I seriously need some help!

lardbros
02-18-2008, 04:58 AM
Okay, and now i've replaced the sides of my case the temp has gone all the way up to 50C and sometimes a bit more just idling. Conclusion is it's my case. What a bummer... the last time i buy a case coz it looks nice! :)

Gonna try and get some more airflow through it somehow, do those tunnel thngs fit almost any PC case? I think that's the way forward!

Qexit
02-18-2008, 05:16 AM
Just out of interest have any of you used the SpeedFan tool? Im running it now, and there's a worrying temperature that keeps fluctuating. At the moment it's on 100C and under the Internal Temperature heading. Where the hell could it be getting this hot on my PC, and being recorded?? It shows up a flame warning too in SpeedFan, but i don't know if that's because it's not configured to the right limits.

I seriously need some help!Not too sure what the SpeedFan Tool is. On the two Asus boards I'm using, I've enabled the Q-fan Control in the BIOS and set it to Optimal. I also have C1E support enabled for the cpu in BIOS as this 'turns down' the cpu when it's idling (uses less power and runs cooler :thumbsup: )

lardbros
02-18-2008, 06:07 AM
Not too sure what the SpeedFan Tool is. On the two Asus boards I'm using, I've enabled the Q-fan Control in the BIOS and set it to Optimal. I also have C1E support enabled for the cpu in BIOS as this 'turns down' the cpu when it's idling (uses less power and runs cooler :thumbsup: )

Yeah, i've just changed those settings in the bios now too. I did have them on that when i first got it, but I guess i changed it and forgot! Stoopid me!

As for SpeedFan, it's just one of the best little bits of software for looking at your temps. I'm still worried about this one that's creeping up to 100C though. If anyone is willing to install speedfan and see what the temp og "Internal Temp" is on theirs I'd be extremely grateful!

Qexit
02-18-2008, 06:43 AM
Yeah, i've just changed those settings in the bios now too. I did have them on that when i first got it, but I guess i changed it and forgot! Stoopid me!If you've updated the BIOS, then these would have been reset to their defaults. By default, Q-Fan is disabled.


As for SpeedFan, it's just one of the best little bits of software for looking at your temps. I'm still worried about this one that's creeping up to 100C though. If anyone is willing to install speedfan and see what the temp og "Internal Temp" is on theirs I'd be extremely grateful!OK, I've installed SpeedFan. Interesting little utility. I also have one very 'alarming' looking temperature reading, i.e. AUX = 122C. However, I had a quick look through the FAQs on the SpeedFan site and found this:

"As a final note, please remember that not all available temperature sensors are actually connected to something. If you happen to read unusually high or low temps, they are likely to be from a disconnected (unused) temperature sensor."

So I think I'll rest easy on this one :thumbsup:

lardbros
02-18-2008, 06:57 AM
If you've updated the BIOS, then these would have been reset to their defaults. By default, Q-Fan is disabled.

OK, I've installed SpeedFan. Interesting little utility. I also have one very 'alarming' looking temperature reading, i.e. AUX = 122C. However, I had a quick look through the FAQs on the SpeedFan site and found this:

"As a final note, please remember that not all available temperature sensors are actually connected to something. If you happen to read unusually high or low temps, they are likely to be from a disconnected (unused) temperature sensor."

So I think I'll rest easy on this one :thumbsup:


Yeah, i read that one too, but what bothers me is that mine goes up and down. At the moment it's at 98C, but has gone up to 106C earlier today. If it was an unused temp monitor chip then why is it going up and down?

I also have one that says -55C and i'm pretty sure this is ok! :) (Sorry, bit sarcastic, it's clearly fine)

What does your internal temp say? I don't have an AUX one on mine at all. Is yours a Core2Duo E6600?

Qexit
02-18-2008, 07:23 AM
What does your internal temp say? I don't have an AUX one on mine at all. Is yours a Core2Duo E6600?Not too sure, the attached image is a screen grab of the two main SpeedFan panels that I have here.

BTW, I have a Core 2 Extreme Quad Core QX6700

lardbros
02-18-2008, 07:38 AM
Well, your temps are certainy lower than mine and for a quad core that's pretty good isn't it? I'm not the best at these things, but i'd have thought a quad would run hotter or the same as a Dual?

Here's a screen grab of my SpeedFan Tab!

Qexit
02-18-2008, 08:07 AM
Well, your temps are certainy lower than mine and for a quad core that's pretty good isn't it? I'm not the best at these things, but i'd have thought a quad would run hotter or the same as a Dual?Normally, I would agree. Don't forget though that when it's idling my cpu drops down a long way as the chip multiplier goes down to its lowest value:

Idle: 6 x 2.66 = 1.6GHz
Load: 12 x 2.66 = 3.2GHz

NB, as this is an Extreme chip I can change the upper value of the multiplier. In my case I upped it from 10X to 12X, so under load all four cores are running at 3.20GHz rather than the standard 2.66GHz. It could probably go even faster but this is at stock settings on the core voltage, so it isn't doing the cpu any long-term damage :thumbsup:

androidmaker
02-18-2008, 08:16 AM
a while back i had a problem with my system crashing and found that my videocards fan was not working well. when i changed the card the crashing stoped.

Maxx
02-18-2008, 01:23 PM
Downloaded and installed speed fan - and here's the readings I'm getting. It looks about comparable with the other posted, unless I misreading? The one thing don't get is that it's only showing one fan? I do have 4, I can see them....

Qexit
02-18-2008, 01:42 PM
Downloaded and installed speed fan - and here's the readings I'm getting. It looks about comparable with the other posted, unless I misreading? The one thing don't get is that it's only showing one fan? I do have 4, I can see them....Not all of the fan powerpoints will have speed sensors. Are they all connected to your motherboard or are they linked direct to the psu ? I have three case fans, none of which appear in my SpeedFan panel but then only the cpu fan power cable is attached to the motherboard (and that is a 4-pin connector so that Q-fan works).

beverins
02-18-2008, 09:34 PM
Excessive heat on the CPU can be attributed to ventilation, thermal grease and the heatsink itself.

see if there is dust and things clogging the fans. Check the heatsink fins for dust buildup too.

so if that doesnt solve it, then the next one is the thermal paste that is used as a thermal conductor between the metal plates of the CPU and the heatsink.

problem is, thermal paste can only be replaced by removing the heatsink. And you have to get yourself some better thermal paste as well. Any of the Artic cooling or even the MX-1 paste are the best.

thermal paste tends to dry up and get less effective as it ages, and due to the thermal load that is passing through it. The only way to fix that is to replace the paste. You don't need much, but it isn't a job you can do with the computer sitting in its normal spot... it demands the whole thing be benched and properly worked on with static-free environment... (antistatic wrist-strap). There are lots of guides to be found via google.com on how to properly apply thermal paste.

the last possibility is the heatsink itself. Does it properly blow air across the fins? Is the fan itself going bad? You might want to get a better heatsink like a Zalman or a Scythe (http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/cpu/032/scmnj1000_detail.html). If you feel like overclocking the CPU, then a TEC cooler such as this one (http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/03/15/vigors_monsoon_ii_tec_cpu_cooler/) is a great choice.

I have a QX6700 overclocked to 3.2ghz and its real nice and stable with my tec cooler and lots of case fans. Used MX-1 paste and the thing runs at 106F under max load on a cool day.. and up to 124F on a 95F degree day unless I crank up the A/C :-) Right now with some Fprime rendering going on its at 95F and the room temp is around 70F.

beverins
02-18-2008, 09:50 PM
One thing I want to add to my cooling tale is that I do not have an ideal cooling solution by any means. I run my machine with the side case off (easier for me) which allows me to suspend case fans where I want them to enhance the cool air flow on really hot days. Since my machine has a 650watt PSU, running the A/C on hot days really clicks up the energy meter, so I try to get as much airflow in there, even though my machine looks like something from the Matrix LOL