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bluerider
09-13-2007, 07:19 AM
Here is a rescent approach I found useful for an area of curriculum development I am going through at the moment. I am studying character design and the most complex area is the face. The very most complex part of the head are the ears.

I decided to model them in clay first before I built them in Polygons.

Pheidian
09-14-2007, 06:53 AM
Can we see the wires! :lol:

bluerider
09-14-2007, 08:20 AM
Look, with the wire shot I even provided motion blur :D

gerry_g
09-15-2007, 03:06 AM
Needs more anisotropy on the metal to really cut it........ clay still beats 3D modeling for tactile feed back and simple ease of use but I hated it at collage, couldn't work and pick my nose at the same time

bluerider
09-15-2007, 11:02 PM
gerry_g,
I figured if I made a clay nose to pick, plus my own, thats four digits for a nostril each.

anisotropy,
OK I goggled searched the word and it was about complex stuff. Your joke was right over my........nose :D

Pheidian
09-17-2007, 01:36 AM
Your work flow is amazing, having motion blur in the production phase, awesome! :)

Heheh, have you finished the clay figure yet?

bluerider
09-17-2007, 06:38 AM
ZBrush 3.1 > Clay

Thats sounds awesome :) :jam:

bluerider
09-17-2007, 06:51 AM
Your work flow is amazing, having motion blur in the production phase, awesome! :)

Heheh, have you finished the clay figure yet?

Lol..........thankyou. As for the whole figure, thats a good question. I'm not at that stage yet for the work I am doing.

Heres older clay projects I developed from the wire to the finished piece.

Surrealist.
09-17-2007, 05:16 PM
Funny, I'd be a far better clay sculptor now than I ever was before, having done modeling in 3D.

I do remember way back when I was first trying to get a grip on 3D modeling characters (1994) that I was going to try sculpting and entering the data with one of those scribes:

http://management.cadalyst.com/cadman/data/product/cadman/512004/138300/ghost-Scribe-iT_medium.jpg
Modern Version found here (http://management.cadalyst.com/cadman/CAM/3D-Digitizing-and-Input/Product/detail/138300?contextCategoryId=8783).

At first the concept of getting that kind of organic detail into the computer seemed extremely hard to grasp. But after working with metaform subdivision for a while it started to sink in. 10 years passed and when I picked it up again in 2004 using SDS subDs it finally clicked.


I noticed that in the 2006 3D feature Monster House (http://www.sonypictures.com/movies/monsterhouse/site/) they actually sculpted the characters then scanned them. I am sure that is done quite a bit.

In the end I guess, what ever it takes, and depending on the needs and skills of those producing, you do. Interesting that in Monster House they used MOCAP for animation, which in a sense is the same work flow as the modeling.

bluerider
09-18-2007, 08:56 AM
Hey Surrealist,
Thanks for posting. The link of the scribe, I used one of those around 1998. Good fun, but i felt I was more productive with a mouse. But I can be convinced otherwise :D

IN some ways perhaps Mo Cap captures the work flow of the modeling. However, I think if your using exaggerated character design it would make more sense that the hyperbole of the motion echoes that. In other words, it makes sense stylistically that key frame animation echoes the exaggeration of the design. More realism in design for the character, them realism using motion capture makes sense. It depends I guess to every unique film project.

Surrealist.
09-18-2007, 03:35 PM
Agreed. I think MOCAP is great for "realistic" anims but certainly not for traditional animation style.

Looking back at my post it may not have been clear, I never wound up using a scribe. Instead, I wound up just figuring out how to do it in virtual 3D. And after having done this, I think it would make me a better sculptor.:hey:

Clearly for some artisans using traditional sculpting is what they do best and this can integrate into 3D quite well. So anyway, great to see you giving it a go this way.

2BitSculptor
10-01-2007, 05:35 PM
Doing 3D for just a few years actually got me back into sculpting in clay (a hiatus of about 25 years)... which now I spend most of my time doing, thanks to being a beta tester for Impulse's Organica (remember Organica?). I have Z-Brush, but still haven't gotten into it, it cuts into my clay time, which at the time being, makes me a little money.

Here is my latest work, If I may. I'd like to have the time to distill my skills in the digital world too. I have been doing a little digital surgery for a free Poser figure, converting the male figure into female.

Anyway... here she is. These are actually WIP pics, sculpted in Super Sculpy, although the piece is now in production as a 1/6 scale resin model kit.

Chuck
http://www.2bitstudio.com/gallery3/working/nancy/nancy07071001sm.jpg
http://www.2bitstudio.com/gallery3/working/nancy/nancy07071002sm.jpg
http://www.2bitstudio.com/gallery3/working/nancy/nancy07071003sm.jpg
.

bluerider
10-01-2007, 06:23 PM
I think thats truly awesome. The detail incredible. How long does a piece like this take you. Do you use an armature underneath.

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

zapper1998
10-01-2007, 08:42 PM
woah nice

2BitSculptor
10-01-2007, 09:30 PM
I think thats truly awesome. The detail incredible. How long does a piece like this take you. Do you use an armature underneath.

Thanks Graham....

I can't really pin it down in hours... but, depending on my workload and if my eyes are cooperative, I typically quote a minimum of 6 weeks, then try to figure in the difficulty level in likeness and detail. This one took about 7 weeks to finish.

I do use an armature. I usually fashion the armature to a scaled full-length photo of the person using 9 gauge aluminum wire. I also tightly pack a wad of aluminum foil for the torso and head, and sometimes the thighs, with a final winding of 32 gauge beading wire to hold it together before the clay is blocked in. I try to determine very early where the best points of separation would be for breaking it down for molding and include keys in the final for reassembly.

I wish I had the imagination you have, though. :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

Chuck

2BitSculptor
10-01-2007, 09:32 PM
Thanks, Zapper.

akademus
10-01-2007, 11:29 PM
Hey, cool ones. I started doing some clay miniatures just for fun couple weeks ago. I must admit they are more than helpful.

Just a hint, have you tried stuffing wires with aluminum foil instead of paper. It seems to work better, at least for me :)

bluerider
10-02-2007, 08:30 AM
Hey, cool ones. I started doing some clay miniatures just for fun couple weeks ago. I must admit they are more than helpful.

Just a hint, have you tried stuffing wires with aluminum foil instead of paper. It seems to work better, at least for me :)

Are you gonna let us see the results :) .

Tin foil or paper, tin foil or paper...........mmmm, papers cheaper!

A friend of mine swears by the tin foil for what your talking about. Hes been doing this for about twenty years. It sounds like your using the right method. :thumbsup:

bluerider
10-02-2007, 08:32 AM
2BitSculptor,
Thanks for also sharing your methodology, some valuable tips. Please show more work when you get the opportunity :) .

akademus
10-02-2007, 08:37 AM
Are you gonna let us see the results :) .

Tin foil or paper, tin foil or paper...........mmmm, papers cheaper!

A friend of mine swears by the tin foil for what your talking about. Hes been doing this for about twenty years. It sounds like your using the right method. :thumbsup:

Will show making of next one. Within few days. Foil don't tend to unwrap as paper does, that's what I found :)

oobievision
10-27-2007, 06:28 PM
wow thats so realistic, It looks like shes about to rope u. did u intentionally not add the flair to the arm held above her head or was it ur not done with it yet?

2BitSculptor
10-28-2007, 09:07 AM
wow thats so realistic, It looks like shes about to rope u. did u intentionally not add the flair to the arm held above her head or was it ur not done with it yet?

Thanks....

Actually, that was just a test, to try to visuallize the final product. I didn't sculpt the fringe onto the finished figure. I used vinyl cut from a shower curtain for the test. I think it would be better to use a piece of soda can cut into the shape. The sculpting on this is done and it is currently being cast as a resin model kit.

Chuck

bobakabob
11-25-2007, 05:10 AM
Marvellous work in this thread guys... Graham, your art always conveys a sense of sponteneity and a balance between observation and imagination.

2BitSculptor, checked out your website and the images are amazing. You're a talented figurative artist. Interesting you should mention Organica... are you saying you're still involved or have you given up on it? I remember trying it years ago, it was an embryonic 'clay modeller' like a primitive version of Zbrush and incredibly memory hungry. Created my first 3D figure in 1999 importing an Organica mesh into Lightwave. I'm a bit embarrassed by the result (http://www.invisibleray.co.uk/mephisto_gallery.htm) but for a newbie it felt more intuitive than poly modelling which before Lightwave's MetaNurbs used to feel like welding steel plates together :)

Great to see more organic character work on the forums.