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stevecullum
08-21-2007, 09:32 AM
I've just been playing with Dponts Node Item Motion plugin, but I'm finding evaluation to be very sluggish for some reason. Not sure if its a problem with my system or the plugin itself though?

I've created this simple test scene, but when I drag my slider its sticking - not surprising really as I'm sure Layout was never intended for this kind of functionality - can someone else check it out and confirm the issue?

dpont
08-21-2007, 10:23 AM
I tested your scene,
not slow here, playing or moving the cursor in the preview.

Denis.

stevecullum
08-21-2007, 10:41 AM
Thanks for that. I'll try it on my other system when I get a chance.

Fantastic node btw... I can see lots of uses for this one!

stevecullum
08-21-2007, 10:58 AM
Ah - found the problem. If the node editor is open its sluggish. Close it up and it runs smoothly :)

dpont
08-21-2007, 11:19 AM
Or disable the preview in the node editor option panel.

Denis.

LW3D
08-22-2007, 02:19 AM
Another Great Node from dpont.. Thanks Denis..

stevecullum
08-26-2007, 09:10 AM
I just got an immediate crash by doing the following:

1. Add null
2. Add Node motion
3. Add DPKIT SplineMap node
4. Crash - before I connected anything

Anyone else get this?

dpont
08-26-2007, 09:28 AM
No crash here,
...This node is for surface editor,
I wonder what you want to do with it
in the Item Motion node editor ?!

Denis.

stevecullum
08-26-2007, 09:45 AM
Hehe.. just tinkering about :)

I'll refrain from putting it in the node motion panel! - I thought I might be able to use it to effect the nulls motion in a spline type way - I haven't tried it with a surface so wasn't sure what it would do!

dpont
08-26-2007, 10:54 AM
...Something like rotating a wheel,
with the covered distance output...
Remember the input rotation in the
Item Motion NE are in radians,
like the output of Item Info.

Denis.

stevecullum
08-26-2007, 11:24 AM
Remember the input rotation in the
Item Motion NE are in radians,
like the output of Item Info.

Thanks Denis, I'll keep that in mind while I'm experimenting.

dpont
08-26-2007, 11:24 AM
49784

Denis.

stevecullum
08-27-2007, 08:57 AM
Hey that's cool! Can I see the node graph for that?

dpont
08-28-2007, 01:02 AM
I couldn't access Lightwave these days,
but I remember that was easy, since SplineMap
need a curve motion, I used a null aligned to its path,
Item Info (Null) to get heading of ball, SplineMap (Null)
to get "Covered Distance" Pitch, but should be rescaled
by the half-diameter of the ball (don't remember if mine
is totally right...)

Denis.

stevecullum
08-28-2007, 09:06 AM
Thanks Denis, I'll give that a try!

omichon
08-28-2007, 12:49 PM
Node graph would be useful and appreciated. I can't get it working as expected :stumped:

dpont
08-28-2007, 02:54 PM
Don't know what do you mean by a node graph,
may be some confusions with a channel modifier,
and I don't know what you expected, did I miss
some of your messages?


Denis.

omichon
08-28-2007, 02:59 PM
Don't know what do you mean by a node graph,
may be some confusions with a channel modifier,
and I don't know what you expected, did I miss
some of your messages?


Denis.
Sorry. In fact, I would like to see the motion nodes for the sphere following the spline path you posted 2 days ago.

dpont
08-28-2007, 03:09 PM
I couldn't access Lightwave these days...

I should add until an unknown date...

Denis.

omichon
08-28-2007, 03:18 PM
No prob Denis. I am not sure to find how to properly connect those nodes...until an unknown date ;)
Maybe Steve could post something before that time...

stevecullum
08-28-2007, 04:10 PM
Maybe Steve could post something before that time...

I'll do my best - still working on my trigonometry, but hopefully will come together shortly :)

stevecullum
08-28-2007, 04:48 PM
Here is a start - I think!

I've used : Distance * (Ball Radius * PI) as the basis for my setup. Not sure if it looks quite right tho as I'm not sure how to calculate the sideways motion.

Hi Denis: - I'm still getting the error I mentioned with spline map - is this the expected behaviour in the scenerio shown?

omichon
08-29-2007, 12:56 AM
Thanks, Steve.
FYI, I don't have any error when adding the Spline Map node.
Anyway, I don't know what to do with it.:confused:

dpont
08-29-2007, 12:56 AM
I didn't use trigonometry at all,
you can't calculate the "real" distance
this way if the path is curved but
the covered distance of the SplineMap node
is an approximate measurement of it
by segment samples of the spline which
is nearest to this real covered distance.

A perimeter of a circle is two pi radius,
a full rotation of the wheel is two pi in radians.
So with the "covered distance" output you
get also directly (almost) the pitch rotation,
just rescale it with the radius of the wheel.

It you added first the keyed null in your scene,
it should, it should work, you need also the
position and the heading of the (aligned to path)
null.

Please don't insist about support, I have lost
any access to a work station.

Denis.

omichon
08-29-2007, 01:15 AM
Please don't insist about support, I have lost
any access to a work station.

Denis.

No problem, Denis. You have done so much help and support to the community here.
For my part, I am just playing with toys and try to improve my knowledge about nodes at this time, so there is no pressure, really. Well, maybe regarding my own brain ;)
I just hope that there is no serious reason that makes you lose your access to a workstation.
Best,

dpont
08-29-2007, 01:22 AM
I think that developing or fixing something
become totally impossible in a "cybercafe"
or by squatting the computer desk of a friend.

Denis.

omichon
08-29-2007, 02:47 AM
I think that developing or fixing something
become totally impossible in a "cybercafe"
or by squatting the computer desk of a friend.

Denis.

doh ! maybe it's time for the community to give you something back. :help:
Do you have any Paypal account for donations ?

stevecullum
08-29-2007, 04:10 AM
Please don't insist about support, I have lost
any access to a work station.

Don't worry, I'm more than happy with everything you've given to the community, but yikes it sounds like a bit of a nightmare not having access to a workstation!

duke
08-29-2007, 04:12 AM
What happened Denis? Did your computer explode? :(

stevecullum
08-29-2007, 05:16 AM
Its like we lost the single most important freebie LW developer in the community :(

I'm sure if you were to ask for donations to 'help maintain and develop future LW nodes and plugins' then for once I think it would work!

omichon
08-29-2007, 06:09 AM
So, I tried to extrapolate from Denis's explanations and here is the result.
I defined a curve path on a Null object, then applied the motion nodes to a 0.5m radius sphere.
Actually, it works as long as the Null path stay in the -Z. When it comes to +Z, Pitch rotation freeze.
If anyone has an idea about this limitation...

dpont
09-15-2007, 04:11 AM
Just some comments, since I retreived my sample
scene and tested it again (and Lightwave too...)

"Covered dist" is evaluated in the Null Reference Path
but at Sphere/Wheel position,
if you take position for Sphere in Item Motion NE
it couldn't be updated for calculation so
for IMNE the Sphere is still at zero and positive
path is skipped.

I parented the Sphere to Null, and checked
"World Coordinate" in Spline Map node, this way
I got directly the position & heading (and pitch
if your floor isn't flat),
and just need the pitch with SplineMap node
since the covered distance was correctly evaluted
with its world position in Item Motion NE,
and I didn't need to divide by PI here,
I just rescaled by the Wheel radius.

Hope this help.

Denis.

omichon
09-15-2007, 04:47 AM
Hey Denis, Nice to have you back here :)
Thanks for your explanations ! I have to play with all that a little more...

UnCommonGrafx
09-15-2007, 06:36 AM
Hey Denis,
Please do us all two favors:
1) Put a paypal link on your site to accept donations from the community. Once there, I will donate immediately;
2) Could you post the scene of which you speak above in post #33? It helps to figure lots of this out with a visual example.

Number One is the more important of the two. I don't know what your situation is, and that's not important for this, but opening your arms to the thanks of the community could only be good for you.

omichon
09-15-2007, 06:49 AM
Put a paypal link on your site to accept donations from the community. Once there, I will donate immediately;

Since I asked for the same in post #27, I have to second that :)

dpont
09-15-2007, 10:53 AM
Here is what I got,
50389

Denis.

JBT27
03-31-2008, 04:48 AM
It's been awhile for this thread, but I'm just looking at this for the first time :)

Problem is consistent for me: I create a null, keyframe a path for it over 125 frames. Open Motion panel, add Item Motion NE, then add a Spline Map node to that, no connections at that point, select the null in the ref menu, and Layout crashes, every single time.

Trying to connect first then see what happens - first use of this for me - is it me?

Julian.

JBT27
03-31-2008, 04:52 AM
Nope.....connected or not - I can't use SplineMap in this NE - crashes every time.

Julian.

dpont
03-31-2008, 05:31 AM
I can use Spline Map in node Item Motion node editor,
without crashes here, but as I said before in this thread,
it was written for Surfacing use, so when you try a node
tree with a current surface node in other node editor you
may have issues, since these node editor are clearly
described as experimental, you are using them at your
own risk, solving all cases is an enormous task,
helping somebody with undetailled report, a pain.

The author,
Denis.

stevecullum
03-31-2008, 05:57 AM
Its a valiant effort by Denis to bring motion control via Nodes, as I think the future of animation in LW should have a strong nodal tie. However as seen, clearly there needs to be a few (or a lot!) architectural changes to allow this to work properly.

Roll on the future...

dpont
03-31-2008, 06:17 AM
Adding X-Z keys to a Null for a floor-motion,
adding ItemMotion NE, Adding Spline Map node,
selecting the Null, outputing the "Covered Dist"
to the Y position,
56902

Is it working, because this is not my first use?

Denis.

Edit:...But totally useless for me!

Dodgy
03-31-2008, 06:30 AM
I've found that motion paths slow down LW quite a lot, even on relatively simple things, but in some cases are needed for interactivity :P A catch 22

dpont
03-31-2008, 06:42 AM
Disable the preview it is faster.

Denis.

stevecullum
03-31-2008, 06:54 AM
I just tried it and got an instant crash when I tried to scrub.

dpont
03-31-2008, 07:25 AM
Disabling the preview?

Denis.

JBT27
03-31-2008, 08:03 AM
I can use Spline Map in node Item Motion node editor,
without crashes here, but as I said before in this thread,
it was written for Surfacing use, so when you try a node
tree with a current surface node in other node editor you
may have issues, since these node editor are clearly
described as experimental, you are using them at your
own risk, solving all cases is an enormous task,
helping somebody with undetailled report, a pain.

The author,
Denis.

My apologies if I came across as a potential or actual 'pain' - I didn't mean to. I know it's experimental, and I was just, err, experimenting - nothing serious, just trying stuff out :)

If I can provide detailed reporting, I will. For now, what I did report is all there is - it crashed easily and consistently.

Julian.

dpont
03-31-2008, 08:25 AM
Ok, I'm glad to know this is not serious.

Denis.

stevecullum
03-31-2008, 08:36 AM
Disabling the preview?


No..just the set up of the nodes. I'll try cancelling the preview and see if it helps!

dpont
03-31-2008, 08:56 AM
I don't think so, disabling preview is only for speed,
crashes are caused by what you are evaluating,
knowing that you will have immediate update in
opengl windows, something like selecting a Null
in a (Surface Map!) node for its own Item Motion
instance is extremely dangerous, I get some
success in my test above but it is a miracle...
There are some other limitations I could not fix.

Denis.

duke
04-01-2008, 06:49 AM
stevecullum try turning on/off Full Scene Param Evaluation - hit "o", and tick or untick FSPE down the bottom right.

stevecullum
04-01-2008, 07:04 AM
Its already deselected duke, but thanks for the suggestion anyway.

Edit..not tried it with it on tho!

dpont
04-01-2008, 08:15 AM
stevecullum try turning on/off Full Scene Param Evaluation - hit "o", and tick or untick FSPE down the bottom right.

Good point,
mine was "Lock Motion Key In Time",
pressing "o" in GE.

Denis.

duke
04-01-2008, 08:12 PM
Good point,
mine was "Lock Motion Key In Time",
pressing "o" in GE.

Denis.

I meant just General LW options, not in the Graph Editor. FSPE can cause trouble in some situations and works in others.

dpont
04-02-2008, 01:27 AM
I understood what yo meant, my quote wasn't to deny,
I replied to previous post about specific stability problems,
Item Motion like GE make a full evaluation of motion path,
not only for a NE preview, this causes crashes with
nodes which need also a frame basis motion path
evaluation.

Denis.