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pixeltek
08-15-2007, 04:39 PM
I don't know if this is the proper place to post this, but I think that a tablet is an invaluable tool for CG. Seeing the Wacom Graphite 4 tablet for just $50 at Circuit City should be something most anyone can afford. Here is the link:

http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/Search.do?c=1&context=&keyword=wacom&searchSection=All&go.x=8&go.y=3

I originally saw this on http://www.Slickdeals.net

Karl
http://www.comic-pearl.com

DiedonD
08-16-2007, 05:44 AM
Yeah... but all the good ones Intuos are way expensive :(

DiedonD
11-01-2007, 08:10 AM
Yeah... but all the good ones Intuos are way expensive :(

Well... You dont need all that much of preasure sensitivity as much as modeling and animating are concerned anyway. And again, for that price it should be available to everyone, its definitely worth it, and at least like an entry to the wonderful feeling tablets can offer. So, yeah go for the cheap ones, cause theyre great.

Exception
11-01-2007, 09:31 AM
I've had a graphire for years. works like a charm. Also in photoshop. you won't notice the lack of pressure levels and who uses the tilt function?

the intuos is nice because of the finger strips for zooming in CAD... that's why I got one. Graphire is also smaller and lighter, and thus easy to carry. Nice find pixeltek!

Captain Obvious
11-01-2007, 10:09 AM
My Intuos3 6x11 is from Japan. It's like a third as expensive over there!

calilifestyle
11-01-2007, 10:31 AM
whats the deal with the bamboo. Is that like there way to hook ppl at a lower price. i mean you can but larger one from any other company for the same price, same spec (512 levels of pressure). so what am i missing i mean i almost fell for it, its the name always the band hehe.

Captain Obvious
11-01-2007, 11:35 AM
I really don't see the point of Graphires. I'd rather buy a non-Wacom, to be honest. But the Intuos is better than, well, anything else I've tried.

Exception
11-01-2007, 12:08 PM
Ive used all kinds of tablets. Nothings stands up to a wacom. You get what you pay for, and Wacom has the patents for their technology, which happens to work the best. Batteries in your pen? oh brother. Graphire and intuos work the same way and work equally well. intuos just has more functions and a sturdier build.

adamredwoods
11-01-2007, 12:43 PM
I've used a Graphire 4 for all my professional needs. I've worn out pens and they are replaceable.

Tablets are excellent and work exceptionally with Lightwave modeling. Not only do I work faster than a mouse, but I no longer have repetative-stress injuries.

If you are in any digital art field, they are HIGHLY recommended.

Captain Obvious
11-01-2007, 12:53 PM
Ive used all kinds of tablets. Nothings stands up to a wacom. You get what you pay for, and Wacom has the patents for their technology, which happens to work the best. Batteries in your pen? oh brother. Graphire and intuos work the same way and work equally well. intuos just has more functions and a sturdier build.
Meh. There are plenty of tablets out there that are just as good as the Graphires, with higher resolution and more features.

Andyjaggy
11-01-2007, 01:08 PM
Get a Wacom, you won't regret it.

Exception
11-01-2007, 01:44 PM
Meh. There are plenty of tablets out there that are just as good as the Graphires, with higher resolution and more features.

By all means, name one. I'd love to know.
The only manufacture that I would know that would come close is calcomp, but they are huge, ugly and expensive, not to mention have very little support.

Scazzino
11-01-2007, 02:15 PM
I use both, Intuos at my work studio and Graphire at the home studio. I love them both. The Intuos is better, but the Graphire is fine for a budget. Before Wacom tablets with the battery-less operation I used to use Kurta tablets with annoying batteries and Sumagraphics tablets with annoying wires...

Captain Obvious
11-01-2007, 02:24 PM
http://www.genius-europe.com/en/produktdetail.php?ID2=55&ID=26&ID3=63

I'd prefer that to a Graphire any day of the week, and twice on sundays.

Exception
11-01-2007, 02:35 PM
http://www.genius-europe.com/en/produktdetail.php?ID2=55&ID=26&ID3=63

I'd prefer that to a Graphire any day of the week, and twice on sundays.

I picked one of those up at my local Aldi supermarket for $50 and after several days of intense frustration with buggy incapable incompatible drivers, a shaking mouse pointer, a pen with battery inside thus too heavy and general unresponsiveness later, I reconsidered.
I've had a Genius and a rebranded genius as they're sold for very little money all around the world and it doesn't hold a candle to even the cheapest wacom.

Tablets with batteries are a flawed concept in my opinion. That technology just doesn't work well. I've tried at least 6 or 7 different kinds, all rubbish, and the pen is just too heavy and thick to be comfortable for everyday use.

Why do you prefer a genius so much over a wacom? Have you owned both?

RedBull
11-01-2007, 03:29 PM
http://www.genius-europe.com/en/produktdetail.php?ID2=55&ID=26&ID3=63

I'd prefer that to a Graphire any day of the week, and twice on sundays.

ROFL, Yeah i really wouldn't..... They are manufactured by Yutron (www.yutron.com.tw) and are quite useless compared to Graphires (or even Bamboo) and Intuos3. And they also have a battery that goes flat, inside the pen... Wacoms are battery less, and much higher quality.

calilifestyle
11-01-2007, 03:31 PM
Aiptek i have an old one. been using for about 4 years. maybe one day i,, move up in the ranks but for now its no big deal.

Bytehawk
11-01-2007, 05:58 PM
been with a tablet for ages now, at least 10 years I think. Wouldn't want to work any other way. Intuos all the way. Nothing beats it.

Just like others here I have tried the cheaper alternatives, they suck.

Captain Obvious
11-01-2007, 06:36 PM
Oh for crying out loud, read whydontcha? I said I prefer it to Graphires! With a Graphire, you're paying loads of money for the brand, nothing else. If you want to go Wacom, go Intuos or Cintiq. The Graphires are no better than Geniuses or any other brand, in my opinion/experience.

I have an Intuos3 6x11 myself (both at work and at home), and I prefer it to, well, any other tablet I've tried. But my Graphire, well, let's just say I don't even know where it is anymore.

Exception
11-01-2007, 07:01 PM
Oh for crying out loud, read whydontcha? I said I prefer it to Graphires! With a Graphire, you're paying loads of money for the brand, nothing else. If you want to go Wacom, go Intuos or Cintiq. The Graphires are no better than Geniuses or any other brand, in my opinion/experience.

Why?
A graphire has everything all other wacoms have except for the tilt sensitivity and the build quality. They're much more portable though.
They don't have a battery in the pen, have reliable drivers, are cheap and quite accurate. I had a Graphire3 XL for years and my current intuos is only marginally better.
Beats a 'yutron' each day, and is close to the same amount of money.

RedBull
11-01-2007, 07:19 PM
Why?
A graphire has everything all other wacoms have except for the tilt sensitivity and the build quality. They're much more portable though.
They don't have a battery in the pen, have reliable drivers, are cheap and quite accurate. I had a Graphire3 XL for years and my current intuos is only marginally better.
Beats a 'yutron' each day, and is close to the same amount of money.

Yeah over here i convinced someone to but a Graphire, over the Yutron, because the Yutron branded versions (also sold as P-Active in Japan)
are more expensive than the Wacom.

I was looking at a 17" LCD Cintiq equiv, as they are $575USD, compared to Cintiq's 3K+ But at the lower end of the market Bamboo and Graphires are good value.

I would like to see Wacom have some competition, when i bought my original Artz-Z 12x12 Wacom, Summagraphics were the only other manufacturer, and they had a cord and a battery in the pen. 15 years later, and only a few small Taiwan manufactures have made any inroads, and none significant.

Ivan D. Young
11-01-2007, 10:04 PM
Actually alot of the Tablet PCs out there are Wacom tablets. Most only have 512 levels of pressure, but many people report that they work well.
http://www.wacom-components.com/english/partner/index.html
there is the link to wacoms site that lists all of the manufacturers that use their technology.:)

loki74
11-01-2007, 11:04 PM
I use a 6x11 Intuos. Honestly, I think that every digital artist should have one.

I've not used it a whole lot, however, because I'm really not that productive in ZB, and probably won't until ZB3 goes UB. But that's beside the point. It is an amazing tool, and immeasurably more ergonomic.

There are two catches though--in LW (and other programs) there are often controls operated by clicking and dragging in the control area. The most relevant example of this is the zoom/pan/rotate controls in a perspective viewport. These are near the top of the screen, so they are at the top of your tablet's active surface. Thus, you can only rotate your view (drag the control) up to where you hit the edge of your active surface... This has been a bit of a problem for me... (if anyone knows how one gets around this, please let me know!)

The other catch has more relevance in 2D work: you aren't looking at the surface you're drawing on anymore. This makes "digital inking" of 2D lineart very difficult. Especially if you're like me and you have a tendency to constantly re-orient your paper when you draw. Of course, painting is a different case, because you're either filling in lines you've scanned, or you're refining forms you've already blocked out using the tablet from the get-go. This, I find, is much less of a problem. But I wouldn't expect to get much good lineart out of anything other than a Cintiq... which I've decided I'm going to save up for. (^_^) xD

One more thing which I don't think has been mentioned--the "express keys" and "touch strips" (assignable buttons and touchy-scrolley-things on either side of the tablet) I find are very useful.

Exception
11-01-2007, 11:40 PM
There are two catches though--in LW (and other programs) there are often controls operated by clicking and dragging in the control area. ...

I think most people don't use these buttons but instead just use alt and ctrl to zoom and pan. Those buttons are really just superfluous. I never use them. Never.


The other catch has more relevance in 2D work: you aren't looking at the surface you're drawing on anymore.

Just takes a little getting used to. You're not looking at your mouse when you're doing it either. Just a bit of exercise for a few days and you won't look back. :)

Captain Obvious
11-02-2007, 04:01 AM
Why?
A graphire has everything all other wacoms have except for the tilt sensitivity and the build quality. They're much more portable though.
They don't have a battery in the pen, have reliable drivers, are cheap and quite accurate. I had a Graphire3 XL for years and my current intuos is only marginally better.
Beats a 'yutron' each day, and is close to the same amount of money.
I actually rather like having a battery in the pen, to be honest. I like having a bit of extra weight to it... So yeah, opinions are like arseholes and all that. I'm just sayin', that, ya know, Wacom isn't necessarily the ONLY option. I've had reasonably good experiences with some other brands (and some rather bad experiences as well, mind you).

And at the end of the day, the Intuos3 6x11 just beats the crap out of everything else on the market (unless you want portability or a Cintiq, anyway).

starbase1
11-02-2007, 05:14 AM
OK, I've never used a tablet, but from what I read here, it really is worth a go. Part of what held me back is that I don't tend to draw with a mouse much, if at all...

How important is it to have a large area tablet?

My gut feeling is that it probably counts for a lot, but the prices seem to go up steeply. (One of the most productive things I did this year was to reduce the sensitivity of my mouse).

Captain Obvious
11-02-2007, 05:54 AM
6x11 is ideal, IMO.

Ztreem
11-02-2007, 08:01 AM
You also have Trust a cheap alternative to wacom, I never used one myself but a friend of mine had one and he said it was OK.
http://www.trust.com/products/default.aspx?cat=INPUT&grp=TABLETS
I have always used wacom intuos, I also have a TabletPC(wacom technology) the next best thing to a Cintiq, it's like a Cintiq but cheaper. You don't really notice the different between 256 and 1024 sensitivity levels, you do feel it but not as much as you expect when looking at the numbers.

Exception
11-02-2007, 09:00 AM
OK, I've never used a tablet, but from what I read here, it really is worth a go. Part of what held me back is that I don't tend to draw with a mouse much, if at all...

How important is it to have a large area tablet?


I never draw with the tablet. There's three specific reasons to use one outside of drawing: Accuracy, Speed and it hardly places any stress on your body. You know, carpal tunnel syndrome, RSI and all that? For those who work with a computer every day for long periods of time this alone can be a saviour. I for one feel far less stressed out have have less physical complaints using one.

Since a tablet is absolute once you work with it for a while you start to be able to just put your pen down exactly where things are on the screen rather than incrementally track the pointer as you do with a mouse. So you can close windows with your eyes closed... selections in modeler become far easier with the right button and so on... you'll just generally work faster.

I wrote a long article (http://www.except.nl/overig/rsi.htm) on RSI, mouse usage and so on, if you're interested. Mind you I wrote it some time ago and the english isn't perfect.

Andyjaggy
11-02-2007, 09:06 AM
I still don't like modeling with a tablet but for everything else it is the way to go.

Ztreem
11-02-2007, 09:31 AM
I think modeling in Lw works perfect with tablet, but other apps when you need to use middle and right mouse button to naivgate it doesn't work as good.

SBowie
11-02-2007, 10:00 AM
I think most people don't use these buttons but instead just use alt and ctrl to zoom and pan. Those buttons are really just superfluous. I never use them. Never.The touch strips are quite useful as little 'flipbook' sliders in appropriate apps, in the absence of other control surface tech.

wacom
11-02-2007, 11:29 AM
Who needs a tablet I like trying to paint and draw with a bar of soap!:D

I've been using tablets for...hmm...12+ years? I think my first one was a Calcomp...it had batteries but at the time it was just amazing to me with its 256 levels of sensitivity! That might seem low...but compared to a mouse and keyboard the quickest you can get is like 20 levels in PS with both hands (using the number keys).

Anyway- regardless of the tablet I highly recommend people give them a try. They take time to get used to but are worth it in the end. The only 3D program I use my wacom in is ZB...but for almost all of my 2d work (except sometimes in illustrator) I use my wacom.

I'm thinking of upgrading my 10 (has it really been that long?) year old graphire 1 4X5 to an Intous3 4X5 or 4X6. I like that size because I often draw small...it fits on my desktop and slides right under my goldtouch keyboard!

The drivers, IMHO, are one of the main reasons to get a wacom- company has been around for ever and isn't going away anytime soon- hence my 10 old tablet is still relevant and supported to some degree. Also the drivers have a lot of nice customization features that you can tailor to work with every program differently! That truly is a simple but powerful feature as not every program handles pressure the same way- and when you have multiple displays it is essential!

And yes- a used graphire USB or a Bamboo IS enough for most professional work. If you do very high end photoretouch, illustration, scene painting etc. I might recommend the Intous level...better pen...MUCH better LPI (esp in the Intous3)...and you might actually use those tilt and rotation functions some day!

With my graphire I actually notice that the ppi and lpi on my graphire are kind of lacking when I draw in Flash- can anyone with an intous3 or even II tell me that it helps this? It's not major, but I actually do a lot of illustration in flash using its pen support.

Have fun and get one- you will not regret it!

wacom
11-02-2007, 11:36 AM
The touch strips are quite useful as little 'flipbook' sliders in appropriate apps, in the absence of other control surface tech.

Oh man that's sexy! That would help in CS3 with roto work for sure!

Bytehawk
11-03-2007, 06:09 AM
yep, I use those along with the modifier keys mapped to the other buttons (ctrl, alt, shift, space)

loki74
11-03-2007, 12:19 PM
I think most people don't use these buttons but instead just use alt and ctrl to zoom and pan. Those buttons are really just superfluous. I never use them. Never.

hahaha! man, that's convenient. Never even knew! xD

grn
11-04-2007, 01:47 AM
Do not buy bigger than A5 if you are a person who draws small, in other words; "never fills a whole A4".

Already graphires are far better than best products of other companies.