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Pavlov
07-26-2007, 04:54 AM
hi all,
i have to realize a movie of a yacht sailing on sea, with realistic water FX.
I never cared too much about fluids, it looks like now it's the moment ;)
Some questions: are Realflow and realwave merged into an unique tool now ? Would you suggest it ? How's rendering quality when i get particles into LW ?
Again, can be better if i buy Maya and use its own fluids (it's way cheaper than realflow) ?
Last, what about Blender fluids ? Is it powerful enough to handle this task ? I heard it exports a sequence of point clouds to LW, so i guess i'd have to stick to HV, which is really not suited for fluids.
Other alternatives?

thanks
Paolo

Glendalough
07-26-2007, 05:36 AM
The sea is just really too big to do this with fluids. Most fluid stuff is about throwing glasses of water around it seems. Though someone got the idea to scale a city scene down to the size of a bathtub or so and have it inundated with a tidal wave. This you can get a link to somewhere on the Blender site. It's a youtube video and very grainy.

Not sure about how you export these meshes from Blender, there is a thread at Spinquad on it though. You can export MDD flawlessly into Lightwave now and also the latest version takes in Lwave objects perfectly with no rotation orientation problems.

People have made successful wakes in displacement seas by various methods and there is some ripple (free) plugin you can get. Would really be very interested to see what you can come up with!

3dworks
07-26-2007, 07:09 AM
what about nature FX? those arete' based plugins still seem to be a good set for sea, water and sky images... and for animation.

http://www.dynamic-realities.com/naturefx2/

but i'm not sure if those work perfectly with 9.2? anyone with this experience?

Red_Oddity
07-26-2007, 07:14 AM
That's exaclty what realwave is for, as far as i remember there are tutorials on the site or DVD that do exactly what you want.

Iain
07-26-2007, 07:16 AM
I thought these things were for more small scale simulations too but I suppose the wake is the tricky bit.

Didn't Ben Smith do a 3dworld tutorial just using displacement and bump once? I'll have a look.

Pavlov
07-26-2007, 12:21 PM
Effectively Maya was my latest option, i'm not familiar with it and it would be too much an hassle. Probable i'll go Realwave (dont see it in NL site, is it merged with Realflow now ?) or i'll come up with some displace+particles+clipping trick into LW.
Anyway other advices are very wellcome...
Iain, do you have a link for that tutorial ?
Markus, these could be nice but ... DR ? Dunno if i'd buy something there, i keep hearing nobody is there now.
Neverko - forgot that, thought that fluids were in basic maya version. One chance less ;)


Paolo

Reco
07-28-2007, 12:08 PM
If you want to create a natural ocean with realistic waves, swell and water material, then go for Nature FX. I do think you can still buy the plug-in, but it has not been updated for several years. However it works in LW 9.2. It is easy to use and you get very realistic result just after a short time of experience. If you looking for a nice calm sea, just set the wind speed to 1m/s. If a stormy sea is what you want, then adjust the wind speed to 100m/s. Itís as easy as that, but there are many other parameters you can adjust in order to fine tune the ocean.

In addition to waves and swells Nature FX can simulate water drops, splashes (no particles), bobbing objects and two different types of wakes. To make a story short, your boat can be affected by the sea, it can create wakes and if it turns around it will be affected by its own wakes. The shader is worth mentioned as well. It has a nice bump feature and a fast refraction. The downside is that Nature FX is not updated anymore, and there is no way to produce foam

By the way, there is another option. Dreamscape for 3DS Max. It is produced by a Serbian company called Sitinisati. It is almost the same plug-in as Nature FX. It works the same way, the simulation is the same, it is updated constantly and the ocean can create nice looking foam. The biggest difference between Nature FX and Dreamscape is the way it is implemented in the 3D software. Nature FX works like an ordinary LW plug-in where you can use LWs own lights and radiosity. Dreamscape however is a world within 3DS Max, with its own light and a slow radiosity. Well, I do not like to work in Max at all, but this plug-in can create stunning results. Take a look for your self (30th anniversary of the Brent Oil Fields for Shell). http://www.afterworks.com/ref-Visualisation.asp

Arete does not exist anymore, but I do hope that somebody will and can develop The Nature FX plug-in up to a new level.

Reco

Reco
07-28-2007, 12:38 PM
Here is another link http://www.afterworks.com/animations.asp

lino.grandi
07-28-2007, 03:55 PM
Other alternatives?


What about D-Storm liquid pack?

Pavlov
07-29-2007, 04:44 PM
reco - interesting, but i wont buy max for this. Gonna check better Nature FX instead.
Lino - i gave it a look but it relies on HV... no way if there's no shader i can render with, HV is not for fluids. Anyway, it looks like i can have another way usign Arete for sea itself, and simple points Sprays with MotionBLur, i saw interesting tests.

Paolo

lino.grandi
07-30-2007, 12:04 AM
Did you take a look to the NaminamiFX Plugins of Liquid pack? They use displacement to generate waves and water perturbation (and can interact with particles, of course).

Pavlov
07-30-2007, 02:07 AM
Lino, not at all... do you mean dosch's one ? gonna give it a look.

Paolo

Mr Rid
07-30-2007, 05:37 AM
Realflow, yes.

Pavlov
07-30-2007, 07:36 AM
Ops- Lino, i got it wrong, BTW it's Dstorm's one again. I'll investigate, thanks.

Paolo

lino.grandi
07-30-2007, 08:02 AM
Lino, not at all... do you mean dosch's one ? gonna give it a look.

Paolo

I'm talking about DStorm liquid pack.

Is not a particle system only, but even a wave system based on displacement, perfect for boats trail.

Some samples:

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=Irc2gxNfwU8

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=BfUn2vP0ucA&mode=related&search=

Pavlov
07-30-2007, 08:15 AM
oh well... that's pretty interesting !
probably ship's waves and trails aer doable with this, while for foam and sprays i think it's pretty much interesting this one from Celshder:

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58740

Bye
Paolo

LightFreeze
08-02-2007, 03:04 PM
you could always try it in Lightwave (http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=8349741348108262835&hl=en-GB) before you spend all the dosh

Pavlov
08-02-2007, 03:29 PM
Lightfreeze, very interesting, some foam and it's pretty ok.
Is there a tutorial to do this ? I was an happy user of MD, but since 7.5 i'm kinda rusted on dynamics...

Paolo

LightFreeze
08-03-2007, 12:36 AM
heres a test scene I`ve knocked up, things to note, theres textured displacement and clothFX on the plane and the important thing is the playback mode in the clothFX is set to local, this lets you blend your 2 displacements and also lets you tweek them individually, by switching one off you can work on the other. Remember to clear the clothFX motion before tweeking it.

Pavlov
08-03-2007, 02:34 AM
thanks a lot, gonna check it asap.

Paolo

munky
08-05-2007, 02:04 PM
This might be of use,

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29664&highlight=water+wake


regards

Paul

munky
08-05-2007, 02:35 PM
Oh and these might be of use,

the stormy ocean tutorial from 3d world is good but if you want an available online video one that is free then go to www.simplylightwave.com and find the Ocean Scene tutorial which does the same thing. See the adapted version I did below.

Here is a scene file of how to make a boat bob about on a displaced sea surface. ( I'd credit this one to Ben Smith and 3d world as I think thats where I learned it from)

All lightwave out of the box no plugins


regards

Paul