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View Full Version : LW 9.2 New cameras not anti-aliasing properlyfor Arch Vis Project



tonybliss
07-06-2007, 04:36 AM
I think i have researched, and tried every combo in the book;
but when i use Vue Xstream for with any new camera option, my renders come out jaggy. Turning on Volumemetric AA for in LW helps a bit but the only favourable results i get is when i use the classic camera :(

Attached is a test render to illustrate the lack of aa when using the real lense camera
(i have even tried levels of 30 for aa; 3 for oversampling; and countles other combos nothing :( )

thanks in advance!!

*Pete*
07-06-2007, 05:23 AM
intresting...thats horrible aliasing you have there.

i find LW AA pretty good, seldom any problems with it...did you use AS?
AS of 0.03 together with AA with about 3-5 produces good enough quality images, most of the time.

perhaps something to do with Xstream?

Bytehawk
07-06-2007, 05:28 AM
in the camera properties panel, do you have multiplier set to anything else than 100 % ?

dballesg
07-06-2007, 06:05 AM
Hi,

What version of xStream are you using? I remember that anti aliasing problem was in on of the previous xStream versions.

I used xStream here with the Perspective Camera and worked fine.

Best regards,
David

tonybliss
07-06-2007, 07:00 AM
hi guys ... thanks for your repys

Res multipler set to 100%
i tried it with adaptive sampling .. followed exceptions fantastic guide @
http://www.except.nl/lightwave/aa.htm

and I am using the final version of Vue Xstream with the latest build 291050

i really don't know :(

but for this project i will complete it with classic camera, will miss the render speeds tho'

I will try and figure it out and let you guys know, if you do not come up with a solution before
a massive thanks to you :D

tonybliss
07-06-2007, 07:03 AM
oh dballesg .. which build are you using ??

cause its the first time i encountered this problem ....

and its my largest project using Vue X ... that was one of four town houses :)
total poly count at 300,000 plus ;)

Cougar12dk
07-06-2007, 08:27 AM
I think i have researched, and tried every combo in the book;
but when i use Vue Xstream for with any new camera option, my renders come out jaggy. Turning on Volumemetric AA for in LW helps a bit but the only favourable results i get is when i use the classic camera :(

Attached is a test render to illustrate the lack of aa when using the real lense camera
(i have even tried levels of 30 for aa; 3 for oversampling; and countles other combos nothing :( )

thanks in advance!!

Make sure that in the Camera Properties panel you check the Use Global boxes....otherwise it won't do any AA, unless you've turned it on in the cameras properties.

dballesg
07-06-2007, 10:09 AM
oh dballesg .. which build are you using ??

cause its the first time i encountered this problem ....

and its my largest project using Vue X ... that was one of four town houses :)
total poly count at 300,000 plus ;)


Well, the same as you! :( I thought you could be using an older one! :( But you have the latest, like me.

Bytehawk
07-06-2007, 10:52 AM
... this is interesting, are there problems ? I was thinking the multiplier is the same as I would type the resolution !!

in some versions of LW it causes problems 9.0 I think it was...

tonybliss
07-06-2007, 11:02 AM
DBallesG
how do you setup your cameras for a Xtream render in lw with lots of polys and vue elements ??

Lewis
07-06-2007, 01:58 PM
I rendered many of Arch renders in las tmonths (just rendering 3000 frames of arch stuff) and never had such problems. Why Oversamling - 3 ? That's too much and previous LWs (Classic camera) had default version of OS - 0.3 AFAIR. Can you post scene file so that we examine ?

Cougar12dk
07-06-2007, 02:05 PM
The OverSampling is 0.1 by default. But I know that when you venture into those high values (3), you'd just as well turn of AA, because not much at all is AA'd

But what I was saying is: It doesn't matter if you set the camera values in the global panel, if you don't check the "use global" checkboxes in the camera properties.

tonybliss
07-06-2007, 03:31 PM
hi lewis, I will try cougr12dk's advice; if it does not work then i will email you the files.

I just checked and my globals are not checked ... hope this works ;)

Thanks a mil the whole lot of you :D :D :D

I love this community ;)

Will let you know

Lewis
07-06-2007, 03:55 PM
Let us know ASAP, I'm really interested to hear what was the problem since I didn't experience such issues in 9.2.

dballesg
07-07-2007, 01:36 AM
To cgswami:

I don't do anything special on the camera setup.

But I think I remember I solved that problem with xStream using antialiasing User settings in xStream.

Usually I am using AA 9 Passes in LW, Mitchell, Sampling Fixed, and Oversample of 0.1 to 0.3.

I hope this links can help you:

Changes on the render settings:
http://www.cornucopia3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4736

Use automatic scene hierarchy can really slow down render:
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/support/forum2/viewtopic.php?t=287

Vue render settings:
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/support/forum2/viewtopic.php?t=24&highlight=suggestions+ultimate+render+settings

Vue Render Settings Guide:
http://users.tns.net/~mwalter1/Vue_Render_Settings.pdf

Another thing I would try it is to do a REALLY SIMPLE scene, maybe a ball in Lw and a terrain with ecosystems and a sky and see if the ball came out with the same bad antialiasing.

I learned with Vue by the hard way, that many times it creates errors when you are reaching the limit on memory use. I had one scene that couldn't render on 32 bits, fortunately I had the 64 bits computers on the office! :)

To Lewis:
cgswami antializasing errors are because he is using xStream with LW.

Best regards,
David

Lewis
07-07-2007, 03:38 AM
If is xStream problem then why topic suggests that LW 9.2 cameras are broken/not aliasing properly :) :)?

I'm really interested to see how this will end up. dballesg thanks for those links that should help him.

pixym
07-09-2007, 07:55 AM
I am just begining to use xStream 6 this morning via PLE, and hope this community will help me if I have some issues.
Thanks in advance.

dballesg
07-11-2007, 02:43 AM
Hi,

What problem you have Pixim?

Best regards,
David

pixym
07-13-2007, 03:57 PM
This what I have between 9.2 and Vue 6 xStream PLE...
The camera cannot be moved or rotated inside LW, whan I hit F9, the LW camera is reseted.
Have you got this kind of issue with the final release of Vue6?
It is about to be sure before buying Vue 6...

pixym
07-14-2007, 08:38 AM
Anybody can give me an answer?

Cougar12dk
07-14-2007, 08:39 AM
Sorry.... I guess people aren't answering because they don't have an answer.

I certainly don't. Sorry dude :(

dballesg
07-14-2007, 08:41 AM
HI,

Well when you create a NEW scene with xStream it is ask you if you want to keep your actual camera or light. If you say NO, xStream will generate 2 new ones that are linked between xStream and LW.

The VueCamera it is the one you can move on LW and it would be updated every time you open the Vue Interface to wherever you put it on LW.

But that it is with the FULL version of xStream, as I said the Demo it is still a few builds old and I remember I couldn't do that on old versions of xStreams ( I mean I HAD your same problem).

Anyhow remember that it is only needed if you are compositing between LW and xStream, because helps you to keep same point of view on both apps.

But many times I keep my initial LW camera, because I know I am going to render EVERYTHING inside LW. And I do not bother myself animating the synchronized camera in xStream.

I mean it if you use the VueCamera, on OLDER versions was better to animate it INSIDE xStream and not in LW. Becuase xStream didn't passed well the keyframe information to LW. But if beign testing on my latest version and looks like works fine.

Be rpepared for LONG render times when you use xStream + LW, many times it is fastere use xStream to get the same point of view nd render the scene in xStream if you are going to composite it with LW.

Hope this helps.

Best regards,
David

P.D: Sorry you were posting when I was writing this answer :)

pixym
07-14-2007, 08:41 AM
Ok thanks Cougar12 ;)
I will just have to wait a bit, but I think it is a Vue 6 PLE bug...

pixym
07-14-2007, 08:43 AM
Thank you very much, Dballesg

pixym
07-18-2007, 09:23 AM
.../... Be prepared for LONG render times when you use xStream + LW, many times it is fastere use xStream to get the same point of .../...
When you said LONG render time I could not imagine in that proportion :eek:
This test is on one of my production work...

dballesg
07-18-2007, 10:24 AM
Hi Pixym,

I had a longer render time for a scene at PAL res. Between 4h and 6h per frame! :)

Which Atmosphere you were using there? I mean it is one of the Radiosity modes on xStream? You can reduce the times a LOT if you use other type of illumination inside xStream.

I see you had the same problem on your roundabout that I had, the plants go out of it. Unless was your intetnion. Use the Ecosystem paint feature to put plants in there, easier and much more control! :)

Aside that I like very much the image! :)

Best regards,
David

pixym
07-18-2007, 11:36 AM
.../... Which Atmosphere you were using there? I mean it is one of the Radiosity modes on xStream? You can reduce the times a LOT if you use other type of illumination inside xStream
I use a GI atmosphere. Ok I will give it a go


I see you had the same problem on your roundabout that I had, the plants go out of it. Unless was your intetnion. Use the Ecosystem paint feature to put plants in there, easier and much more control! :)
It was my intention, I used ecosystem ;)


Aside that I like very much the image! :)
Best regards,
David
Thanks

pixym
07-25-2007, 12:26 PM
Has somebody tried the 6.10 update yet?
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/resources/ShowUpdates.php?ProductTypeID=51
(I receive this information in the e-on news letter today)

dballesg
07-25-2007, 02:09 PM
Hi,

I installed it, but I didn't test it depply enough to find any problems. Have alook on e-on forums, there is a thread about that specific version if I remember well.

Best regards,
David

pixym
07-25-2007, 02:13 PM
Have you noticed a speed inscrease with xStream?

pixym
07-30-2007, 01:02 PM
This is a French link in which Xstream is tested with host Apps.
That have hurt me is the fact that LW is the best app in Open GL ...
http://www.tdt3d.com/articles_viewer.php?art_id=94

The spreadsheet bellow (Part of the artcile) shows a rendering times between the Xstream as host inside the apps and Xtream stand alone. (There are another benches in the articles)