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somecoolgeezer
12-22-2006, 03:35 PM
Hi,

I need to create steam coming out of a coffee cup in Lightwave.

Can anyone advise of the best settings for this or point me in the direction of a tutorial.

Can't seem to find any online.

Thanks
s.

Silkrooster
12-22-2006, 07:10 PM
Volumetrics are your friend. Create a null apply an emiter, change th settings to make it look decent. Add a hypervoxels to the null. Do test renders until you get the voxels to look right. hypervoxels are necessary to see the emiter in a render.
Silk

somecoolgeezer
12-23-2006, 05:26 AM
Hi,

Thanks for the reply.

I am fine with the basics, I can make smoke etc, its just the "correct" settings I was looking for to get the smokey effect.

SplineGod
12-23-2006, 07:16 AM
I would go with HVs on particles, HVs on displaced geometry or transparency maps on displaced geometry. HVs will typically render the slowest.
How I would approach doing the steam would depend on exacty how it needs to look ie. thin wisps of steam or just an area of steam covering the whole top of the coffee.

somecoolgeezer
12-23-2006, 07:29 AM
something like this would be ideal:

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/359121/2/istockphoto_359121_soft_focus_steam.jpg

randomnumbers
12-23-2006, 08:05 AM
I'd use a spotlight inside the cup facing up with volumetrics applied.
I find this is usually a little faster than using HVs.

SplineGod
12-23-2006, 08:05 AM
Any of the suggested methods could work including a volumetric light :)

SplineGod
12-23-2006, 09:17 AM
I think a lot of times people run into problems with HVs because they think that a lot of particles with HVs need to be used.
Heres an example of a cup with a single HV attached to a null. Its using an HV sprite and renders very quickly.
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/steamy_cup.mov

OFF
12-23-2006, 09:47 AM
excellent decision - a dynamite plugin:
http://www.cantarcan.com/v11/html/main.html

jeremyhardin
12-23-2006, 10:04 AM
Transparency mapped polygons goes a long way if your perspective doesn't change too drastically in-camera (i.e. this won't work with a 360 revolution of the cup). 1 polygon for this with footage of smoke mapped onto the transparency channel (so the smoke moves):
40151
The polygon is parented to the cup.
Renders just about as fast as can be and in FPrime too. And didn't have to shoot the smoke either. Got it from Artbeats. :D

T-Light
12-23-2006, 12:40 PM
Splinegod -

I think a lot of times people run into problems with HVs because they think that a lot of particles with HVs need to be used.
Heres an example of a cup with a single HV attached to a null. Its using an HV sprite and renders very quickly.
That would be me then, never thought of using a single HV, excellent, Cheers Larry :)

5had0w
12-23-2006, 02:00 PM
Volumetrics are your friend. Create a null apply an emiter, change th settings to make it look decent. Add a hypervoxels to the null. Do test renders until you get the voxels to look right. hypervoxels are necessary to see the emiter in a render.
Silk

with an answer like that i would be like "Wha???" I know what is a null but it isnt as simple as that for me. How do i add a hv to the null?

Thanks in advance,

Vasco

somecoolgeezer
12-23-2006, 03:06 PM
Cheers for al the eplys guys, I had a go with making some black smoke of a candle using HV's seemed to work fine.

Silkrooster
12-23-2006, 06:28 PM
with an answer like that i would be like "Wha???" I know what is a null but it isnt as simple as that for me. How do i add a hv to the null?

Thanks in advance,

Vasco
Sorry I was in a bit of a hurry last night. Pressing ctrl-F6 will bring up the effects panel. Click add volumetric, then click Hypervoxels. Double clicking on hypervoxels will bring up the hypervoxels panel. On left side you will see the name of the null. Double clicking on the null will make it active.
Silk

lilrayray77
12-23-2006, 06:32 PM
with an answer like that i would be like "Wha???" I know what is a null but it isnt as simple as that for me. How do i add a hv to the null?

Thanks in advance,

Vasco

This was a little hidden for me at first as well. There are essentially two steps in order to apply HVs to a null:

1) select the null and press p. Click the Dynamics tab and from the Add Dynamic drop-down-menu, select emitter. (you can play with the emitter settings to change how the seam looks) Then click the calculate button.

2) next, choose the scene tab at the top of layout. In this menu, click volumetrics/fog > volumetric and fog options (crtl+f6). Then Click on the Add Volumetrics drop-down and choose hypervoxels. Double click what appears in the menu. In the new window, under Object Name, double click your null object. Now begin editing the HV controls and render

[edit] Aww silk, yah beet me to it!!!

SplineGod
12-23-2006, 08:37 PM
You can apply HVs to ANYTHING that has a vertex or vertices in it. It doesnt have to be particles. If you go into the HV panel you can apply the HV directly to a null, an object or an emitter.
In my example I have a single null with an HV applied directly to it. It doesnt have dynamics or an emitter applied to it. :)
The motion is created by a procedural texture running thru the single HV.
Heres an example of HVs applied to particles (the particles can be generated off an emitter, an object assigned to be an emitter or a null assigned to be an emitter):
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/sand.mov
Heres an example of HVs applied directly to an object:
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/cement.mov
Heres an example of an HV applied directly to a null (no emitter) :
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/smoke_ship.avi

SplineGod
12-23-2006, 08:43 PM
Splinegod -

That would be me then, never thought of using a single HV, excellent, Cheers Larry :)

Thanks!
The nice thing is that you can use the method Jeremy suggested exept appy the movie clip directly to the HV. :)

exit6
01-14-2007, 11:36 PM
Hi fellow LW-ers, I'm working on the same thing, creating steam off of coffee. HV's I think are one of the most powerful tools in Lightwave but it's still a mystery to me how to really control them. Is the key to use as few particles as possible? I'm using the plugin "Fire&Smoke," and I've got my particles behaving great, but the render just doesn't look right. Steam, on a small scale, should look "wispy." My steam looks really "puffy," you know? Setting the stretch direction to velocity isn't working... Am I approaching this in the wrong way? Should the motion be from the procedural textures, not from the particles? Fire&Smoke gives you these great vortexes and everything, it would be a shame not to take advantage of them.

Thanks --

McFilms
01-15-2007, 01:38 AM
You can apply HVs to ANYTHING that has a vertex or vertices in it. It doesnt have to be particles. If you go into the HV panel you can apply the HV directly to a null, an object or an emitter.
In my example I have a single null with an HV applied directly to it. It doesnt have dynamics or an emitter applied to it. :)
The motion is created by a procedural texture running thru the single HV.
Heres an example of HVs applied to particles (the particles can be generated off an emitter, an object assigned to be an emitter or a null assigned to be an emitter):
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/sand.mov
Heres an example of HVs applied directly to an object:
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/cement.mov
Heres an example of an HV applied directly to a null (no emitter) :
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/smoke_ship.avi

So, if you do apply HVs to particles, does that mean you could then do collisions or interraction with objects with collisions applied to them?

Surrealist.
01-15-2007, 07:00 AM
OK, here's a slight hijack, but on a similar note. How about a flame, a candle flame?

SplineGod
01-15-2007, 10:46 AM
Use a combination of particles and textures on the HVs themselves to make them look wispy. You can also use displaced geometry.
Something like a candle flame can be done with a single HV, particles and HVs or even displaced geometry like this:
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/candle.avi

Surrealist.
01-15-2007, 10:59 AM
Nice!

Care to share a little more on how you set it up? No tutoiral needed, just some pointers to get me in the right direction.

Thanks.

Silkrooster
01-15-2007, 05:12 PM
So, if you do apply HVs to particles, does that mean you could then do collisions or interraction with objects with collisions applied to them?
In a word yes. Applying HV's to an emiter can have another object act as a collision object. Emiter's honor collision objects.
Silk

SplineGod
01-15-2007, 11:02 PM
The candle flame is just a stretched spheres with a displacement map and textures. :)

Glendalough
01-16-2007, 08:32 AM
You can apply HVs to ANYTHING that has a vertex or vertices in it. It doesnt have to be particles. If you go into the HV panel you can apply the HV directly to a null, an object or an emitter.
In my example I have a single null with an HV applied directly to it. It doesnt have dynamics or an emitter applied to it. :)
The motion is created by a procedural texture running thru the single HV.
Heres an example of HVs applied to particles (the particles can be generated off an emitter, an object assigned to be an emitter or a null assigned to be an emitter):
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/sand.mov
Heres an example of HVs applied directly to an object:
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/cement.mov
Heres an example of an HV applied directly to a null (no emitter) :
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/smoke_ship.avi

Sorry for butting in here, but how is this last one, the ghost ship done?
Wondering if the HV is set to Surface or Sprite?
Wondering what the procedural texture running across clip is, whether done
in the hypertexture or the shading (basic) over the clip.....Any Clues....Thanks....maybe...

SplineGod
01-16-2007, 08:36 AM
Its a single HV sprite applied to a null. Its got both a procedural and animation sequence mapped onto it. :)

Surrealist.
01-16-2007, 10:23 AM
Thanks Larry! :)

Glendalough
01-16-2007, 11:08 AM
Yes, Thanks a lot, ever so much Larry.

Got it!...well just about...how is the procedural set to interact with the animation sequence.....is blending mode set to something (obviously)???

This really makes the effect work, as the mist or vapour on it's own wouldn't be that outstanding....Quiet Amazing!!!

Glendalough
01-16-2007, 05:35 PM
alpha image sequence, blending mode subtractive

But how does one get wispyness in procedurals?

SplineGod
01-17-2007, 12:10 AM
Theres a lot of places to use the image sequence.
The image sequence I used for the ship was done by rendering out the depth buffer. It can be done with a white to black gradient, fog etc.

exit6
01-17-2007, 12:35 AM
Will an animation like this work, (http://www.exit6.net/steam_wf_s.mov) as a starting point, or should I start over?

Glendalough
01-17-2007, 04:15 AM
...
The image sequence I used for the ship was done by rendering out the depth buffer. It can be done with a white to black gradient, fog etc.

Interesting, have to look this up.

Many Thanks again.