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Birdman
02-18-2003, 11:48 PM
My copy of the LW7 CD seems to be missing the OS10 version of the 'rotation.p' plug-in.

Has anyone else found this problem?

Miles
02-19-2003, 05:10 AM
If I remember correct this was but one of the Plug-Ins not apart of the MAC-LW bag-o tricks.

I became very tired with not only the missing OEM plugs, but the lack of 3rd party support for plug-ins for the MAC. Even those developers good enough to produce for MAC as well often have later release dates. I have been a MAC man since 1984 and it took LW to break me down into buying/building a Windozes system just so work with LW and be out of the loop. It was either that or sell my LW-MAC and move to another 3D app. I figured I'd run into many of the same issues via other apps too so now I'm crossplatform. I plan on working my MAC systems into a render farm so not all will be lost. In addition to the PC build costs I've had to purchase a PC installer CD and dongle swap for $66. from NewTek just to just to feel I'm on equal footing. Part of me feels they should've just given me those items for free for sticking it out with them rather than moving over to another app.

Sorry to having gone OT a bit, but your question's wording sounded like me a few months ago and it got me charged up again.

I turely hope NT gets MAC-LW on 100% equal footing with the PC version and with much better optimization of the MAC code for some rendering features so that I can later move back to an all MAC work flow. Everything else I do is on a MAC...

mlinde
02-20-2003, 10:46 AM
The fact is, when Newtek began the port to OS X, they discovered that the source code for a number of plug-ins was lost, and they decided that others were going to be depricated and removed from production. What they didn't do was bother to update the manual or the community with this news. The rotation tools, polygon reduction, and a variety of other plug ins have been missing since the release of OS X. If you need them for some specific use, the current solution is to reboot in OS 9, make the specific change using the plug-in, and get back to life in OS X.

The development team has been aware of this for many months, and hopefully this will be addressed (at last) in the upcoming release of LW.

As far as 3rd party development, that's been a fact of life for about 5 years now. Miles, I understand your frustration, but frankly, I can't think of a specific plug-in (other than Messiah) that never made it to the Mac that had community requests going. Sure, they don't come out at the same time. If you have one (or two) developers, they can only do one thing at a time. With the newer codebase for LW being mostly cross-platform, plug-in development should come quicker to the Mac if people ask and will pay. The fewer users buying, the less incentive for the work. Sadly, a fact of economics.

Birdman
02-20-2003, 02:13 PM
Thanks mlinde

Yeah, we ended up doing the reboot in OS9 making the changes and then back to OSX. A bit long winded and a real pain, but the short term problem's solved.

Fingers crossed Newtek will have those updates fixed in fixture versions, it really takes some of the shine off such a brillant product.

Miles
02-20-2003, 08:21 PM
I'm not disputing the reasons the why third party developer channel their resources/time, but as you point out it's been going on for years. When I was talked into buying LW I wasn't aware of the platform support differences and trusted working with LW wouldn't be a life style were I other MAC user would have to constantly ask for support. I'm one for holding out my hand when I've paid as much as the other chaps. I love my MACs and that will not change, but NT and their 3rd party LW developers have not established an equal footing for the MAC user (not users as a whole %) who have paid equal funding after 5 years then it's a matter of being realistic about the likely hood of it ever changing.

True, as you point out, that more purchasers of these plug-ins for the MAC versions would result in more and/or timely support, but one also has to wonder if after five years chaps like myself find they need to move to the Dark Side (Windoze) just to get past all the delays and pleadings for equal support that the MAC arena will ever expand rather than being reduced in size.

Right now I'm cross platform because of LW I never would've made this move with the Windoze previous OS, but XP so far has been semi-usable especially since I'm only using it for LW. I hope things change so I can just make the PC a node machine down the road and go back to all MAC. I'm sorry to have taken up someone else thread space on the topic. I just thought others considering these points might like to be a little better informed than I was when talked into these issues blindly. It was my fault, but for others not in the know think of a line I liken my experience to.

"Who's the more foolish, The Fool or The Fool who follows him?"

--- OB1 ;)

Chuck
02-22-2003, 09:07 AM
The specific plugins that are missing in OSX because we do not have the source code are Reduce.p, PointReduce.p, Rotation.p, FastTripleFan.p, teapot.p, and, er, um, idiot.p.

The first four are useful modeling tools, and are present in Windows and OS9 because the versions compiled years ago for Windows and for Mac Classic OS still run today. If they had needed to be recompiled in order to run in newer OS versions and newer LW versions, then at this point they would not be present on any platform. We are looking into redeveloping those, but that still looks to be in the indefinite future at this point. I was able to track down who the original programmer was for those items (same fellow did all six actually), and we have been talking with him about the possibility of assistance in redevelopment.

The latter two plug-ins, respectively, make a teapot and an eagle-in-a-barrel, and were sort of a personal-time lark on the part of the coder, so we aren't likely to invest in redeveloping those. For those who may miss those two, Sorry! :(

riki
02-23-2003, 12:15 AM
I think 'Rest On Ground' has been replaced with 'Aligner'. I noticed that plugin/lscript?? mentioned in the manual but didn't find it in my toolset. I later discoverred that there is a version available from Flay but it dosen't seem to have as much functionality as Aligner.

tnarg
03-23-2004, 09:46 AM
Can anyone confirm for me that both the Objlist.p and Objrep.p are missing from both 7b and 7.5 OSX versions before I do something daft like a complete re-install?

Does anyone have a list of the missing plug-ins?

Thanks.

mlinde
03-23-2004, 11:30 AM
I can't confirm this, but I can confirm that they exist if you get the plugins out of 7.5c. You can get and use all the plugins from 7.5c in 7.5 or 7.5b (although 7.5b is buggier than 7.5c). I recommend using 7.5 with the plugins from 7.5c for the optimal LW configuration.

tnarg
03-23-2004, 01:14 PM
Thanks for that, I remember reading somewhere about your LW7.5denver hybrid, so everything is working ok for you then?
Where is that thread with the instructions BTW?

mlinde
03-23-2004, 04:18 PM
Don't remember what thread the instructions are in, but basically make a backup of you 7.5 installation, then install 7.5c over the existing 7.5, then copy the programs folder back over the 7.5c installation, then re-scan the plugins and lscripts to get everything linked.

tnarg
03-24-2004, 02:09 AM
Thanks a bundle. I think I'll go for the LW denver mixed salad now.

tnarg
03-25-2004, 09:48 AM
O.k I followed the instructions, performed the 7.5c update, replaced the 7.5 programs folder back over the 7.5c installation, scanned all the plug-ins and LScript directories and bingo there are the missing ObjectSequencer and Object List plug-ins right where they should be.

Bummer is neither of the buggers work here. Do they work for you Michael?

mlinde
03-25-2004, 11:26 AM
You need to read the manual. They both work though, I did some testing a while ago to verify it.

tnarg
03-25-2004, 02:08 PM
Doh.
Thanks for pointing out my stupidity.
I was being thrown by two things, firstly when I click on Object sequence the tab still shows (none) so I assumed it wasn't working, secondly my object sequence was labeled with a four digit number at the beginning instead of a three digit number at the end. With your assurance that it did work I fixed the numbering and ignored the (none) and voila perfect object sequence.

Oh BTW many many thanks for the 7.5 hybrid tip, you really saved my bacon.:mad: :( :confused: :) ;) :p :D