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gdstark
11-12-2006, 10:02 AM
I'm developing a concept for a future transportation system, similar to what you see in Minority Report, only more realistic (no climbing buildings). But I'm an engineer, not an artist. I'm looking for someone capable of superimposing reasonably realistic models atop photo backgrounds. Here's the concept so far:

www.pptproject.com

The job doesn't pay as I'm not doing it for money myself, but it's a spectacular showcase for anyone wanting their artwork to be seen. Let me know if interested.

Gary Stark
[email protected]

gdstark
01-06-2007, 07:38 PM
I'm still looking for someone to develop CG for this project. It's an excellent portfolio opportunity...any takers?

gary
[email protected]

arsad
01-07-2007, 02:35 AM
shell out some cash and you will find someone.
The fact that you don't do it for money means nothing.
You can't go to your butcher and ask for meat for free
just because you want it and make no money out of it.

Darrell
01-16-2007, 07:32 PM
He has a point...I would love to do it but...I got to eat :)...so do everyone else...ever thought about learning a 3D application on your own?. You may get a college student interested, but there's a gamble with that...quality, meeting deadlines, being responsible...yadda yadda

iggy21
01-23-2007, 02:29 PM
Curious, what happens to one of those 'cars' breaks down on the track? Does it back up everyone else?

kopperdrake
01-23-2007, 02:55 PM
You might get someone to do it for free. I usually have at least one personal project on at a time, at the moment I'm doing some visualisation work for a large engineering project with no payment. Ok, so I may get some publicity if it gets off the ground, and mentions in press when the image is used. Plus I get to play with techniques I wouldn't normally be able to.

You just *might* get lucky, don't give up! You might find some hobbyists who have the time to do what you're asking or as mentioned above, someone who'd like something cool in their portfolio :)

Dexter2999
01-25-2007, 02:42 PM
I think some of the people are having a hard time getting behind your concept. This makes it more difficult for them to want to participate. The foreign concept coupled with the rough images you have posted might be throwing some people off (especially when working for free).

I would suggest maybe starting here
http://www.conceptcar.co.uk/forums/

See if you can get any designers or wanna-be's to come up with some artwork that will spark the imagination of the people here. Or who knows there might be someone there that does 3d as well.

In answer to the back up question I believe all traffic behind a broken vehicle is probably automatically diverted around and traffic automatically merges. It is probably a great deal faster than humans trying to merge.

The one thing you would have to learn though is to be punctual. An automated system like this probably won't allow for running late for work so you speed to make up time.

Watching traffic move out of the way of an emergency vehicle might be interesting.

I can tell you have put a great deal of thought into this.

Good Luck

gdstark
01-26-2007, 09:41 AM
arsad & Darrell: I understand your concern about the lack of pay, but I was upfront on that point. I simply donít have the funds to do otherwise. I realize not everyone can afford to contribute to volunteer projects. I work mine in between taking out the trash and helping the kids with homework. Here's another of my sites that also makes no money (ask my wife)...
www.CliffHouseProject.com (http://www.CliffHouseProject.com)

iggy21: you asked what happens if a car breaks down. Part of the design includes a central routing computer which is in constant communication with all vehicles. If a vehicle reports problems (or stops reporting at all), the central routing system will instantly reroute traffic around the problem and dispatch a service vehicle. This is as opposed to the current system where everybody backs up behind the disabled vehicle, people rubberneck causing further problems, and traffic helicopters circle overhead. And the poor sap with the disabled vehicle has to wait for a tow truck, bargain with a mechanic to get it fixed, and find another way to work. I assure you, an automated system would be MUCH more efficient at handling breakdowns.

Dexter2999: much thanks for the feedback. I'll look into your suggestions. As for the punctuality, thatís not really a problem. Look out on the streets. Cars are parked everywhere. If even a tenth of these cars were available to jump at your command, you would never have to wait long. This is because vehicles are a pooled resource.

ALL: This really is a great opportunity for someone to essentially create an online portfolio. Your credits and contact info will be as visible as you like. I will continue to push the concept, including attempts to get into print media (Popular Mechanics, etc) once the graphics are updated.

If anyone requires further clarification on the concept, Iím happy to help.

gary

Lightwolf
01-26-2007, 11:03 AM
Nice project (no, I don't have the time either) - the concept has been around for ages (I remember reading about it as a kid) and I believe a German university is doing a lot of r&d in that direction, up to a full running prototype to test the software (which seems to be the key).
Good luck with your project!

Cheers,
Mike

shrox
01-26-2007, 11:26 AM
Disney had a similar concept. Epcot in Florida was originally going to be a real city, with housing, shopping etc. There were to be no motorcars in Epcot, so they had designed a transit "peoplemover" system.

It is on the Tomorrowland DVD.

gdstark
01-26-2007, 11:28 AM
Lightwolf, the concept of personal rail transit (PRT) has indeed been around for a long time, but it's never gotten anywhere. IMHO that's because the designs all call for extremely expensive raised platforms so that it can coexist with the automobile. My design is unique (as far as I can tell) in that it REPLACE the automobile...takes over the existing roadways, thus saving an enormous amount of money and FINALLY making for a public transportation system that's actually convenient for the masses (door to door delivery).

Just for the record, I don't think the issue is really software. That sort of routing and such that would be relatively easy to implement. Convincing everyone to give up their cars, now THAT will be another story! We need a movie like Minority Report to bring visibility to the concept. George Lucas, are you listening?

gary
http://www.pptproject.com

shrox
01-26-2007, 11:35 AM
http://www.pptproject.com/PB060025add%20tracks%202.jpg

This picture shows the track in a neighborhood with a big fence around it, how close together would crossover walks be? That would be a big drawback in existing neighborhoods. The idea does have it's place though, I thought the BART train system in the San Francisco bay area was great. I worked at Sega in downtown SF, and lived about 35 miles away near a BART station.
$5 a day, no parking fees, 70mph, 30 min ride to work past all the 30 mph traffic. Public transportation can be a great thing.

Lightwolf
01-26-2007, 12:05 PM
IMHO that's because the designs all call for extremely expensive raised platforms so that it can coexist with the automobile. My design is unique (as far as I can tell) in that it REPLACE the automobile...takes over the existing roadways, thus saving an enormous amount of money and FINALLY making for a public transportation system that's actually convenient for the masses (door to door delivery).

I see. The german concept has been designed for existing rail tracks. Since we have a very good infrastructure in that respect (including subways in towns running on the same rails) it makes sense. No new tracks need to be laid, only the switches need to be exchanged (and they are working on hybrid ones to allow conventional trains to use the same tracks).
The main issue with the software is that they allow the single cabs to link together which reduces the air resistance (their system is designed for fairly high speeds of up to 160km/h if I remember correctly). I assume the linking/iunlinking depending on the traffic across the whole country is a non-trivial task to solve.
Yeah, I'm a sucker for tech like that, I at least hope you find this a bit interesting...

Cheers,
Mike

gdstark
01-26-2007, 06:44 PM
I see. The german concept has been designed for existing rail tracks. Since we have a very good infrastructure in that respect (including subways in towns running on the same rails) it makes sense. No new tracks need to be laid, only the switches need to be exchanged (and they are working on hybrid ones to allow conventional trains to use the same tracks).
The main issue with the software is that they allow the single cabs to link together which reduces the air resistance (their system is designed for fairly high speeds of up to 160km/h if I remember correctly). I assume the linking/iunlinking depending on the traffic across the whole country is a non-trivial task to solve.
Yeah, I'm a sucker for tech like that, I at least hope you find this a bit interesting...

Cheers,
Mike


Hi Mike,

A hybrid concept - very interesting. I guess you better REALLY trust the routing system to share the track with multi-ton trains!

One assumption that many mass transit systems make is that everyone wants to travel at super-high speed. I disagree. People should slow down., enjoy the ride The extreme example of this is the newer maglev trains. Imagine the carnage when a terrorist derails one of these things! It will be the equivalent of an airline crash. No thanks. One absolute requirement of any future system is that it is terrorism-resistant.

Another requirement? That the ride be smooth enough that it doesn't spill my moccha.

gary
http://www.pptproject.com/

Matt
01-26-2007, 11:18 PM
Gary, have you seen this project?

http://www.atsltd.co.uk

It's not exactly what you're proposing, but similar in execution.

gdstark
01-27-2007, 12:27 AM
Gary, have you seen this project?

http://www.atsltd.co.uk

It's not exactly what you're proposing, but similar in execution.

Yes, I've seen this one. But I very much disagree with any implementation that uses rubber tires on pavement instead of steel wheels on tracks. Much higher maintenance, much less efficient, and I would never trust it at speeds over 10 mph. Getting rid of the rails is very tempting, but trying to run any sort of automated system on residential streets is already a big enough challenge without having a blow-out putting a vehicle in someone's living room.

gary
http://www.pptproject.com

liquidpope
01-27-2007, 10:47 AM
I, for one, really like driving.
If something like this ever happened in a town I lived in, I'd move.

gdstark
01-27-2007, 11:22 AM
I, for one, really like driving.
If something like this ever happened in a town I lived in, I'd move.

I totally understand. There are time when I like driving as well. And I suspect there were people in the last century who prefered to take their horse into town. But at some point we will be forced to confront the realities of energy availability, environmental impact, and ever increasing traffic congestion. Besides, if everybody was to move, we'd just end up with more towns facing the same realities.

gary
http://www.pptproject.com

liquidpope
01-27-2007, 11:36 AM
The Amish still take their horses into town. That's their choice.
I'm a car guy. I choose to drive.
I say, all car guys band together and move to the desert. We'll drive around, customize our cars and just have a grand old time.
If you don't like that, we can duke it out in the Thunderdome. :D

Dexter2999
01-27-2007, 11:52 AM
Dexter2999: much thanks for the feedback. I'll look into your suggestions. As for the punctuality, thatís not really a problem. Look out on the streets. Cars are parked everywhere. If even a tenth of these cars were available to jump at your command, you would never have to wait long. This is because vehicles are a pooled resource.

gary

I want trying to imply a problem with availability of units in your system. I was trying to take into account the human factor. People over sleep or are just screwing around and run late. They will no longer have the luxury of speeding and driving like maniacs to make up for lost time. With your system like any public transit system....if you are late, you are just late! No way around it.

People are the weak link.

You mentioned MINORITY REPORT, but the units climbing buildings were just one model. The units at the factory that he gets sealed in were just modern cars. Also a detail might be that those were not public units (I don't think) they incorporated into the living quarters like some prototype Japanese cars do.

There seemed to be a hybrid in IROBOT. Car systems that were autopilot computer controlled but there was also a human override function as I remember it.

Yeah, a robotic car would be nice...program it to take itself down to get washed and detailed...whatever servicing it might need.. all at like 3 AM while I am still fast asleep and arrive back before I wake up for work the next day.

Oh well, Good Luck

gdstark
01-27-2007, 12:44 PM
The Amish still take their horses into town. That's their choice.
I'm a car guy. I choose to drive.
I say, all car guys band together and move to the desert. We'll drive around, customize our cars and just have a grand old time.
If you don't like that, we can duke it out in the Thunderdome. :D

Sounds like a plan!

gary
http://www.pptproject.com

gdstark
01-27-2007, 12:48 PM
I want trying to imply a problem with availability of units in your system. I was trying to take into account the human factor. People over sleep or are just screwing around and run late. They will no longer have the luxury of speeding and driving like maniacs to make up for lost time. With your system like any public transit system....if you are late, you are just late! No way around it.


Oh, got it. You're right...I did misunderstand. Perhaps there could be an optional "hurry up" speed that would not guarantee that your moccha wouldn't spill.

gary
http://www.pptproject.com

JBT27
01-28-2007, 02:00 PM
I'm developing a concept for a future transportation system, similar to what you see in Minority Report, only more realistic (no climbing buildings). But I'm an engineer, not an artist. I'm looking for someone capable of superimposing reasonably realistic models atop photo backgrounds. Here's the concept so far:

www.pptproject.com

The job doesn't pay as I'm not doing it for money myself, but it's a spectacular showcase for anyone wanting their artwork to be seen. Let me know if interested.

Gary Stark
[email protected]

I'm too busy to offer any help as well unfortunately, but good luck with it!

Technology aside, it kind of goes back to the days before Beeching (in the UK) destroyed the vast and intricate rail system we had - even tiny hamlets had a station. But again in the UK I'm just wondering about these vehicles of yours having tracks laid out to isolated villages in the mountains, say, and down country lanes, and otherwise quiet(ish) areas like the Lake District which become car parks in the summer. That I guess also must apply everywhere else - what about accessing the National Parks in the US? Same principle? Where there are now roads you have this system laid-in?

I suspect it will take a generation or two getting used to not having cars, naturally, while seeing more and more of this or something similar. I had the bizarre experience of being in a bookshop the other day (that's not the bizarre experience) and seeing a group of kids going through a book that included photos of the railway station here, in the 1960s, full of steam locomotives and dotted around were these almost gothic-looking signal boxes, huge some of them were. One kid said "Wow, I wonder what that was like to be there?" I could have told him!

I agree on slowing transport down, but it would be very nice to slow time down as well!!

Interesting image possibilities but just too busy to help at present. But I wish you success with it.

Julian.

gdstark
01-28-2007, 05:03 PM
I'm too busy to offer any help as well unfortunately, but good luck with it!

Technology aside, it kind of goes back to the days before Beeching (in the UK) destroyed the vast and intricate rail system we had - even tiny hamlets had a station. But again in the UK I'm just wondering about these vehicles of yours having tracks laid out to isolated villages in the mountains, say, and down country lanes, and otherwise quiet(ish) areas like the Lake District which become car parks in the summer. That I guess also must apply everywhere else - what about accessing the National Parks in the US? Same principle? Where there are now roads you have this system laid-in?

I suspect it will take a generation or two getting used to not having cars, naturally, while seeing more and more of this or something similar. I had the bizarre experience of being in a bookshop the other day (that's not the bizarre experience) and seeing a group of kids going through a book that included photos of the railway station here, in the 1960s, full of steam locomotives and dotted around were these almost gothic-looking signal boxes, huge some of them were. One kid said "Wow, I wonder what that was like to be there?" I could have told him!

I agree on slowing transport down, but it would be very nice to slow time down as well!!

Interesting image possibilities but just too busy to help at present. But I wish you success with it.

Julian.


Hi Julian,

Good points. Clearly the more remote areas post a challenge for this and any other public transportation system. While the PPT system might be ideal for 99.5 percent of the miles people travel, there will always be places that it doesn't make sense to reach with rails. In those cases an automobile can still be used, although you'd probably rent one if you're just visiting. It might also make sense to construct a specialized system for covering the long distances between cities, perhaps a train that piggybacks multiple PPT vehicles and travels at increased speeds.

Ultimately it's always a compromise. With automated vehicles there are a lot of hidden benefits that also have to be factored in....drastically reduced accident rate, access for elderly and children, unattended transport of cargo, reduced noise & air pollution, reduced congestion, improved quality of life, etc. The list seems endless.

You mentioned that people would take a gneration or two to get used to it. I'm not so sure. An automated vehicle is really no different than someone giving you a ride. You jump in, enjoy the view, and don't leave your trash on the floor. Easy!

We talk about this as if we have a choice. If fossil fuels continue to be problematic and population growth continues to increase congestion, which both seem fairly likely, we will soon be at a point where we have no choice but to seek alternatives. I just think we need to think beyond just increasing gas mileage efficiency or riding the bus.

gary