View Full Version : So anyone see Torchwood?

10-22-2006, 07:09 PM
For anyone unable to see BBC3, the new offshoot series of Dr Who aired in Blighty this evening.

Basicaly it's Dr Who for a more mature audience, Aliens and SciFi are the same it's just...a little more adult. When I say adult, I mean it features girls kissing girls, boys kissing boys, a full on s*x scene in a ladies toilet and an alien that feeds off orgasms. William Hartnell will be turning in his grave.

Hey it's fun though :D

10-23-2006, 02:06 AM
Yep I did. Wasn't all that impressed really. And they really should have toned down the sharpness on the video because it looked like a wedding video...


10-23-2006, 02:26 AM
Have to agree with Ben on this one. I was not to impressed at all. Alot of silly mistakes in it, if its such a secret organisation where no one is even meant to know the name how comes everyone does including the pizza shop. Whats the silly lights on the vehicle.

It was made in Cardiff as well, which shows as some of the accents began to get on my nerves, even my partner said that the accent on the policewoman character (cant remember her name) was annoying and my missus is French.

I hope it gets better but thats why it was shown on BBC3.

10-23-2006, 02:50 AM
BeeVee -

Yep I did. Wasn't all that impressed really. And they really should have toned down the sharpness on the video because it looked like a wedding video...
It was shot in highdef, which showing were you watching the 9pm or the 1am?
JohnMarchant -

I hope it gets better but thats why it was shown on BBC3.
It's on BBC2 on wednesday, that's when the evangelism crowd will see it and the complaint's will pour in.:D

Yeah, I agree on the Cardiff note, I thought it would be following on from torchwood London, I thought they're giving the game away that it's all filmed in Wales with all the Welsh accents until the penny dropped. Nothing against Wales by the way :), just thought it would have been more appealing set in the big smoke.

10-23-2006, 03:01 AM
Couldn't even be bothered to watch it, looked crap!

10-23-2006, 03:04 AM
I watched the 9pm one, to be honest tv in this country is getting pretty dire now. My missus used to love UK tv, alot better than french tv but even she said its going downhill fast. We live in a more multi cultural society and need to be aware of strong accents not being understood by other people

Its filmed in Cardiff because its cheaper and easier to film there than in London, it depends what the audience is and what its percieved to be. It would have been better in Smoke if they want to sell it overseas.

Overall not to impressed but hopefully in time it will get better.

10-23-2006, 03:14 AM
It would have been better in Smoke if they want to sell it overseas
They do want to sell it, that's why the episodes are 45 minutes, so you can add adverts, aka buffy, Firefly, BSG. I have to be honest and say I wasn't struck the first time I watched it. When they aired the two episodes again later on, it grew on me (I was working in the front room, I wasn't intentionaly watching it again :help: )

10-23-2006, 03:14 AM
Hmmm, I live in France and UK TV is still miles better than the constant barrage of badly dubbed police procedurals from the UK and US (Inspector Barnaby, CSI), chat shows with people I don't know where everyone speaks too fast, and the interminable ad breaks, even on supposedly state-funded channels for which we pay a licence fee not short of what the Beeb costs. Shows like Spooks, Life on Mars and Dr. Who make it very worthwhile... Like a lot of people today, I find myself not watching much TV, but the quality of what I do watch is usually pretty high.

PS. One exception (to prove the rule?) Engrenages was a fantastic mini-series. We actually watched it on BBC4 as Spiral since it hasn't been shown here on free-to-air TV yet - it's only been shown on Canal+

PPS. Oh yes, the best thing about French TV overall is the sheer amount of LightWave on it. All the PUB interstitials are made with it by Olivier Michon (http://www.newtek-europe.com/uk/community/lightwave/michon/michon_1.html).

10-23-2006, 03:41 AM
Couldn't even be bothered to watch it, looked crap!
You didn't miss much; it was like X-Files meets CSI, with Welsh accents.

10-23-2006, 05:15 AM
I enjoyed the first one more than I thought I would, seems a bit smaller than an organisation like this should be and the name Torchwood is bandied about a bit too much since it's supposed to be black ops... The second one was a bit of a let down, just an inferior version of Caught in the Act from the New Outer limits series, which had the advantage of a lass called Alyssa Milano doing the bonking maniac act....
I'll keep tuning in, but the beeb really needs to hire some proper sci fi writers who know what they're doing.

10-23-2006, 06:01 AM
yeah, I will too, just to see if it improves. If it hasn't got better by the fourth I shall give it up I think.


10-23-2006, 07:14 AM
You didn't miss much; it was like X-Files meets CSI, with Welsh accents.

Wow, sounds like a hit combo! Might have to tune in next time!

10-23-2006, 11:02 AM
Yeah, not crazily impressed.

Too many amatuer mistakes to go into...
They should sack the current production team and get the 'Life On Mars' team onto it because Life On Mars is excellent and has the right combination of style and substance that Torchwood is so lacking.

Joss Whedon need not lose any sleep over this.

Signal to Noise
10-23-2006, 12:11 PM
I'll wait for the "Americanized" version. They'll probably turn it into a sitcom. ;)

10-23-2006, 02:28 PM
I forgot about it...Must download it...

Here in the states we have BBC America but they are not showing Dr. Who. Sci Fi picked it up, but after it already aired in England...I'm a Dr. Who freak and can't wait that long...Hooray! for BitTorrent...

sorry to hear Torchwood is not so great...Must watch and judge for myself...Looks like Russell R. Davies bit off more than he could chew...

10-23-2006, 02:59 PM
i saw a bit of it...didn't realise it was connected to the dr who univers...thought it was a lame standing for 'the bill' and just channel hopped away!...

10-23-2006, 03:19 PM
I saw E2 last night and was very disappointed. I heard it was supposed to be this amazing new show. The FX looked awful, and the acting was unbelievably bad. I won't be able to stomach another episode.

10-23-2006, 03:27 PM
Originally Posted by EmperorPete

You didn't miss much; it was like X-Files meets CSI, with Welsh accents.
Matt -

Wow, sounds like a hit combo! Might have to tune in next time!
There is a line in the first episode between two policemen...
"They should do a CSI Cardiff, they'd all have to sit around calculating the velocity of a kebab" :D

testyturtle, what's E2?

10-23-2006, 08:40 PM
testyturtle, what's E2?

Sorry, episode 2.

10-23-2006, 09:03 PM
Oh right :D

10-23-2006, 10:37 PM
Oh right :D

Hey T-Light do you have anything to do with the show? I thought some of the effects looked like a little bit like lightwave, especially the alien/comet coming down at the start (looked hypervoxelish). The effects just looked too "stock" to me. Anyway, if you are working on it, didn't mean to offend. :D

10-24-2006, 02:57 AM
Nope, if the effects are done by the same folk who worked on Dr Who (The Mill), then it'll mostly be XSI that they used...


10-24-2006, 04:20 AM
Testyturtle -

Hey T-Light do you have anything to do with the show?
Nothing whatsoever to do with me :).

That smoke did look hypervoxelish though, and yeah, it could have been done better. In fact, I've been quite surprised how few special effects have been in the episodes so far. Maybe it's down to rendering time for highdef? You'd have thought they'd taken that into account though. Still, if it's by XSI users then it's anybodies guess :D

10-24-2006, 04:47 AM
I'll find out about the effects because my old Captain Scarlet CG coordinator was CG coordinator for Torchwood.

I thought for Dr Who it was more Maya than XSi? In any rate, I know that the effects the Mill do for Dr Who & Torchwood have to be done VERY quickly because the money they get for each shot is astonishingly low.

10-24-2006, 06:34 PM
You know, I saw both episodes... on the British TV (aka BT) plan ;-)...

Anyway, I was expecting it to be horribly cheezy with swear words... kind of like Blakes 7... but I was plesently surprised.

It feels a bit like Buffy or Star Trek:Nex Gen; where the stories were just the exhuse to see these characters develop and breathe a bit every week.

I think all the good TV is actually that way... Tom Baker Dr. Who's, West Wing, and even HEROES.

So far, I'm interested, but not gaga for the series yet.


ps. BBCAmerica IS going to start with the first series of DR WHO... missed when it will be on, but you can't miss Christopher Eccleston when he looks at the screen and says, "Get ready and come with me, I'm the Doctor."

10-29-2006, 03:56 PM
3rd Episode was more like it :)

LW_Will -

kind of like Blakes 7
Now there's funny, look you look you (vain attempt at welsh). Gareth Thomas aka Blake in Blake's 7 was in this episode, anyone spot him or was I alone?

10-29-2006, 04:02 PM
Yeah spotted Gareth Thomas, my god he's fatter and older now :):), still cant stand the Gwen girl and her accent and the other guy is annoying me as well. All in all its not a bad series but could have been much better and as for it being more grown up well apart from the first episode i cant see why.

I dont think that i will be avidly watching it anymore, not if there is something better.

Poor old BeeVee having to put up with French TV i can sympathise with him, its pretty dire, even makes UK TV look alot better.


10-30-2006, 02:59 AM
Comparing Torchwood and Battlestar Galactica may be unfair, but BSG is so much better than any other sci-fi series, in terms of storyline and effects.

As for French TV, yes it is pourri, but my son likes watching Totally Spies on TFou, and we both like Ouf le Prof. There you go, that's at least half an hour of worthwhile TV a week. ;)


10-30-2006, 03:01 PM
... BSG is so much better than any other sci-fi series, in terms of storyline and effects...

Hear hear.
I have the hots for that show. It has shown what sci-fi can do. Can't wait until series 3 :)

10-31-2006, 02:49 AM
Okay... 3rd episode was good, very solid for the characters, the technology of the alien thing... and the old man was Gareth Tomas? Blake? Really...? wow... I guess time waits for no man...

Any who, did you catch what the kid said about where he got the alien DAC? It was a place where an old man used to hang out? Hmmm... wonder if there was a police box hanging about? ;-)

Okay, next week, not too keen on the idea of the cyber converter, but I much liked the girl in the chair at the end. I'll wait... still not gaga... maybe ga... ;-)

10-31-2006, 04:55 AM
LW_Will -

It was a place where an old man used to hang out? Hmmm... wonder if there was a police box hanging about? ;-)
I was thinking the same thing, return of Tom Baker for an episode or two?

10-31-2006, 02:45 PM
Any who, did you catch what the kid said about where he got the alien DAC? It was a place where an old man used to hang out? Hmmm... wonder if there was a police box hanging about? ;-)Why would there be a Police Box hanging around ? The Doctor's TARDIS only got stuck in that form when it went into the Stone Age way back in 1963 :D Prior to that, the chamealeon circuit was working :neener:

As for Torchwood, I wasn't very impressed with the first 2 episodes but episode 3 showed a lot of promise. I just wish they'd stop running around everywhere. At least they are running towards the threat/problem though which is a change from Dr Who :)

Ben, please don't get me started on the dire scripting of BSG.......:rolleyes:

11-02-2006, 01:31 AM
I just watched the first three episodes and I was pleasantly surprised....Ep 3 has been the best so far while Ep2 the lamest..The best thing about it..John Barrowman of course...I hope it gets better...

11-02-2006, 02:13 AM
Ben, please don't get me started on the dire scripting of BSG.......:rolleyes:

Ooooh. Nasty.

I'm not sure that season 3 has been good so far, from what I have been told. Having the DVDs of both first series and the lengthy pilot 'movie', I had high hopes for season 3 of BSG.


I was very intrigued as to how the battlestars would be able to mount a rescue campaign with skeleton crews, but that seems to be skirted for a quick battle option instead. With a full complement of fighter pilots to make things easy. It has the feeling of a bodge - that they were worried the show would not work without the arsenal of CGI behind it.
Rather than go for a full-on coldwar type of engagement, which could have been utterly compelling and very tense, we have everyone rescued within the first 4 episodes. On the planet, the Guantanamo references are unsubtle, but that's about the extent of the show's efforts for the planet-based adventure.
We also seem to have infinite ammo resources on the battlestars, whereas they had to plunder a spacestation for reserves in the 'movie'. Odd.

Haven't heard what transpired in Episode 5 yet, but I'm betting reprisals for sympathisers are on the cards. Similar to the attacks on some French women after the German occupation was ended in World War 2.

11-02-2006, 12:07 PM
Being Welsh myself, the accents don' t really bother me, but I will say the accents are a lot stronger than people in Cardiff actually sound like. The actors sound to me like they are from the Valleys, and not Cardiff residents.

I was' nt instantly hooked on it, but I do think it' s growing on me. There' s a few series that I did' nt like at first, like Blackadder and Red dwarf, but those got really good, so I' ll give Torchwood a chance. Anyway, if you don' thave Sky (like me), it makes a change from all the reality shows or soaps on T.V.

Comparing it to BSG with their bigger budget is a bit unfair. It should be compared to something like Red Dwarf, or Hitchhikers, which had similar small BBC budgets :)

11-02-2006, 11:58 PM
well I liked the pilot of Torchwood a lot more than I liked 'Rose' for Doctor Who.

I'm sure time will tell. It always does. I think once the show and actors find their footing it will be better. Also when they start a more cohesive story for the season (and not the boyfriend one)

11-03-2006, 02:11 AM
T-Light... Unfortunately, Tom is not as dynamic as he once was. He is the voice on Little Britain, and he was on an occult show, but he really doesn't look like the Doctor anymore. ;-\

Qexit... um, when are they seeing the TARDIS? In 2006.... come on. The Chameleon Circuit was blown out about 6 million years ago and GODS I am SUCH a geek...

Jessica... I whole heartily agree with you. The 3rd was by far the greatest episode yet. THAT seems to be the show, alien tech, ghosts, and the people in the... hey, what is it? The team?... Torchwood feeling there way through. Again, don't really care what the mcguffin is, I just want to see how they get through it. And, remember, there is an over arching story to the whole series (British, you know), and I'm trying to understand what the **** is going on.

This week, the Cybermen... or at least the technology.

Well... I can still look to the 5th episode.


PS. Doc? ROSE was my favorite of the first series... at least until DALEK came by... ;-) I love Rose, and ROSE...

"Hello, I'm the Doctor. Run for your life!"

11-03-2006, 02:26 AM
Wolvy... I know approximately how much money BSG is given and how much Dr. Who is given, and I think it is much closer than you'd think. \

I think that per episode it is approximately $1.5mil US. I'm not saying the BBC hold the money a bit closer to the chest, but it is more expensive to film in England. I mean, they both are shot on HD video, both use pretty heavy effects, not so much in Who as opposed to BSG... they are close.


11-03-2006, 08:09 AM
LW-Will -

T-Light... Unfortunately, Tom is not as dynamic as he once was. He is the voice on Little Britain, and he was on an occult show, but he really doesn't look like the Doctor anymore. ;-\
I know, but it's Dr Who, ever see the episode where they brought back Patrick Troughton, Jon Pertwee and others (Wasn't even the Brigadeer in that episode?). Besides, Tom Baker still has great stage presence, thought he was terrific in Randall & Hopkirk.

Anything's possible :)

11-03-2006, 04:17 PM
Call me sad but I'm quite enjoying it, but then we don't have Sky and I don't watch much telly. It's no FireFly and has that wobbly-set feel to any British sci-fi, but I kind of like that - gives me a sense of nostalgia and I'm comfortingly reassured that some things really don't change. Wobbly British sci-fi belongs to an era that also houses gold-top milk, watching you dad defrosting the inside of the car for half an hour in the winter before going anywhere, and reading all the sunday cartoon supplements in all the Sunday papers on the way to deliver them to the various owners on my paper-round :)

Yep - Torchwood is a nostalgic piece of sci-fi, and for that I like it :)

Werthers anyone?

11-03-2006, 05:19 PM
Torchwood like any other brand new TV series, needs time to mature.
I for one am interested to see where Captain Jack's character goes from here.
There are lots of character arcs expanding already. The show has the odd connection to dr who here and there, IE: through the use of indirect dialogue and certain objects (a great big severed hand!) .. not to mention the fact Captain Jack is now seemingly.. immortal... due to past experiences with the Doctor.
Torchwood is its own show, and i doubt it'll ever connect with Doctor Who as a show directly.

Russel as a writer is kinda like a paradox. He's both good, as a skilled writer dealing with characters and how they relate to one another, and has tonnes of good ideas... but sometimes, his fairly ambitious concepts never quite get properly realised due to budget constraints and time. ... Im still annoyed over the lame use of the Daleks in 'Doomsday'.
They had been used as a plot device to help advance the story and aid in the departure of Rose tyler... man, they were so easily... sucked away back into... well, 'the void' of course. It was like the cybermen emotion chip inhibitor. ... SO LAME! bah.
Many different writers will contribute during the first series of TW. Phew.

I think what they did in the production time allocated to execute the show was pretty d*mn efficient. And no going to HD will make it any better. The production crew working on this show is big.
BBC productions rarely get the time or money to properly treat these shows to the degree that american shows get treated.

A few silly things in the opening two eps of Torchwood aside... I'm gonna stick with it awhile, and see where it goes.
Incidentally, Torchwood has a good score.
More violence in this show is a must! And maybe less effects and more character drama.

PS: In regards to vfx, the Mill in london have a mainly Maya pipeline.
PS2: And I agree!! ... there is no comparing BSG with torchwood (at this time)
Battlestar Galactica is just... too beautifully awesome. :) ... not to mention the fact that most of the VFX in BSG are, as we all know.. created using lightwave. Go Go Zoic !

hmmm, Cylon centurions Vs Cybermen... who would win ?

11-04-2006, 05:57 AM
Kopperdrake -

watching you dad defrosting the inside of the car for half an hour in the winter before going anywhere,
I still have to do that :devil: , are you sure Derby isn't sat atop a time/space rift sucking in global warming from 2015??? :D

11-04-2006, 06:22 AM
LOL - the thought of Derby being more advanced than anywhere else gave me the chuckles. But then you never know what weird and wondeful things go on in the Rolls Royce development buildings...maybe those engines are jus' too darn pw'rful

Actually, today I found myself doing just that (scraping the windscreen), but then my car is as old as me and *I* need defrosting every morning ;)

11-04-2006, 06:27 AM
I was stuck in Derby train station once, cold and misty, felt like an episode of Saphire & Steel:D

11-04-2006, 06:45 AM
Qexit... um, when are they seeing the TARDIS? In 2006.... come on. The Chameleon Circuit was blown out about 6 million years ago and GODS I am SUCH a geek...
You're only a geek if you can remember seeing the original first episode on 23rd November 1963 and it's repeat the following Saturday which I do. So I remember where I was the day AFTER Kennedy was shot :D

But to the matter in hand. To date, the Doctor has only been an old man in one incarnation, i.e. the First as portrayed by William Hartnell. Prior to the trip to the Stone Age from 1963 in the first story, the Chameleon Circuit was working. Susan, the Doctor's granddaughter, remarks on the fact that the TARDIS has retained it's police box appearance when it should have changed when they step out into the prehistoric landscape (of course we all know that the real reason it didn't change was that the BBC budget didn't extend to changing the appearance in every story :D ) So prior to that, if the Doctor had travelled to 2006 the TARDIS exterior would have changed to suit its surroundings. Hence my original statement. QED :neener:

11-04-2006, 06:21 PM
Hmmm... the days of my expertise in Doctor Who is several years out of date. Also, living on the wrong side of the pond, its a bit removed if you take my meaning.

Also, it was impossible for me to see the first broadcast of Doctor Who as I was not yet born. ;-)

As for the very idea that Tom Baker will be on DW again is not too good actually. I think there was allot of bad feelings when he finally left the show. I know, water under the bridge, new people and all, but... it just doesn't feel that he'll do it again to me. ::shrug::

Also, everyone must acknowledge that it is a TV show. Anyone could come out and be on the show. I'd hate to think that continuity or cannon would stand in the way of an amazing hour of TV!

Also, that kid COULD have seen a relitively young man as an old bloke... it COULD happen... Or, maybe the Doctor and New Assistant Girl COULD go looking for an old man who stole an alien device... ;-)

11-04-2006, 06:36 PM
Also, that kid COULD have seen a relitively young man as an old bloke... it COULD happen... Or, maybe the Doctor and New Assistant Girl COULD go looking for an old man who stole an alien device... ;-)There are endless possibilities including having the 9th Doctor, Paul McGann, not regenerating until he was a very old man. That is the only regeneration that has not been shown in a TV episode so it's possible. Also, one day I might be able to track down a smiley with its tongue stuck firmly in its cheek :D :thumbsup:

11-05-2006, 03:22 AM
I was stuck in Derby train station once, cold and misty, felt like an episode of Saphire & Steel:D

LOL...now *there* was a cheesy Brit-sci-fi :D

Funnily enough my first ever visit to (through) Derby ended up in my girlfriend and I sleeping rough in one of the open-doored passenger booths on Derby Station's platform after missing the last train back to Birmingham from Nottingham one February morning. She got the chair, I got the table...I was so envious.

11-05-2006, 05:46 PM
Just saw episode 4. I'm still not convinced by the series at all. This latest episode had so many plot holes it was getting silly.

11-05-2006, 06:40 PM
Well i saw Ep 4 and to be honest both me and my missus think the script is getting worse as bliz says theres more holes than a swiss cheese.

We both hoped that they would upgrade the welsh girl to be able to act and not have an annoying accent. What is it with the women on this show all they do is question everything.

I dont think if it stays this way that i will be watching it anymore, which is a shame it had some good potential but i dont think its realised. A little more storyline showing how this technologie gets to earth, not just a quick one liner, also who these people are and where they are from. There are alot of unrealised threads going on which is not a problem but the show is not enough to sustain interest without it.

And what was the crap about him grabbing her boob, to me it just seemed to be pointless titilation, she's 2/3 naked and they could not kill her, all her vital organs were there for the shooting, they did not need a Pteradactyl to try to do it.

It needs a drastic change of direction, pace and story and a few of the characters need replacing.

Well thats my take anyway.

11-06-2006, 02:46 AM
Yes, to borrow from BryPhi, I am not impressed at all...


11-06-2006, 03:09 AM

They run alot. With all that technology, why not just teleport. The scene in the tunnel/shooting range was aweful. I feel sorry for gwen's Husband.

Overall, not very impressive, but I'll keep watching because I have to know the back story about the main dude.


11-06-2006, 04:47 AM
I TRIED to watch it, but after 10 minutes the low low low low production value made my eyes bleed...Sorry, but even Red Dwarf looks better than this tripe...

11-06-2006, 05:03 AM
I'll keep watching because we have a friend who's a rabid Doctor Who fan and there's enough in this series to keep him going until the next series of La Who, so we're taping it for him.


11-06-2006, 05:19 AM
Gee, all those years watching B-Movies musta tainted me. :p ;)

Me and Da missus enjoy it a lot, granted, it can be ropey, but I've never had a problem with ropey if I'm entertained, which Torchwood does for me.

Of course, I do 'repair' my brain later by pulling out the Firefly DVD's :)

Now, OT, but on the subject of Firefly / Serenity, hands up who thinks, if the teaser for the theatrical release of Serenity had been as good as the one they are using on Sky, it woulda done better at the box office?

11-06-2006, 05:46 AM
Well im glad other people did not like it as well, i was beginning to think i had gotten old or something.

The way things are going i cant see it lasting until the end of the year, i would be nice to get the back story on the main character but the rest of them to be honest i could not give a s**t about them.

I do feel sorry for gwen's husband, but im sure he's delighted not having to many scenes with her, i have to say she is by far the most annoying thing about it.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

11-06-2006, 08:13 AM
This is all too weird, see, I couldn't give a doo doo about Gwen's Husband, I HATE soap in anything, BUT, I do like Gwen.

Apples and pairs I suppose :)

Mind you, for a chap that can instantly reheal after a bullet to the head, why did that bust lip last half an episode?

11-06-2006, 08:29 AM
They should just dump him anyway we can see whats going to happen in the long run anyway.

Well T-Light at least you like Gwen, cant stand her, should have killed her off and left the indian girl in the first episode she was far better and tastier as well

11-06-2006, 02:59 PM
I liked episode 4...I thought it was misplaced however..It should have been shown towards the end of the series once we got to know more of the characters....Gwen and her husband are about the only predictable thing in the series...You know she'll end up with Jack and the husband will ditch her...I wish they would get that part over with....
I'll keep watching...I love cheesy sci-fi and the Brits make the most entertaining cheesy sci-fi....

11-06-2006, 03:15 PM
You know, I saw the cyberwoman and I said, yeah, cheese central... but then, I watched the episode.

Wow. Simply wow.

A lot of emotion, a lot of scary stuff. It wasn't where I'd've gone with the story, but still very cool.

But, I agree with Jessica, it was too early in the season for the episode. We needed a bit more of the guy being weird. The fact that someone (think it was Jack) says that he is their right hand and does the dirty work is okay, but it would do better to SHOW him doing the actual dirty work.

BTW... Gwen's man is her boyfriend, not her husband.


ps. Jessica, re: Icon; Great work! ;-)

11-06-2006, 03:32 PM
If you take a look at the list of episode titles for the series, you'll see that Captain Jacks storyline seems to be headlining in episode 12. This link is to a fan site where you can find all sorts of info and discussion going on about the series. Also, there is a link to the overnight ratings so far for the season. This includes the title run-down I mentioned:


Given that this is being aired initially on a UK digital channel, it doesn't need to pull in huge ratings to be awrded with a second season. As it happens, the first two episodes pulled in the largest digital audience for a non-sport programme ever. So I think it will survive somehow :)

I'll keep watching...I love cheesy sci-fi and the Brits make the most entertaining cheesy sci-fi....Lol, this from the country that gave us 'Lost in Space', 'Buck Rogers in the 24th Century', 'Battlestar Galactica' and 'Logan's Run' :D

11-08-2006, 01:29 AM
Lol, this from the country that gave us 'Lost in Space', 'Buck Rogers in the 24th Century', 'Battlestar Galactica' and 'Logan's Run' :D

Point well taken.....heh heh heh heh :D

However, only the British could have done something like Red Dwarf...A work of genius that would not have passed mustard by American Entertainment Execs...The first time I saw it I was thinking the entire time "only the British could pull this off!"

and only American TV execs could take something wonderful as Doctor Who and make a dreadful made for TV version with Paul McGann (though McGann was good as the Doctor, the entire work was dreadful)

11-08-2006, 02:05 AM
I love Doctor Who. But I'm not a fan of RTD. Here's something I've just written. Warning its long. but well worth it I think. Its for laughs anyways

10 steps to creating a Russell T Davies style character drama

1. You take X amount of sexy characters (hopefully someone will relate to one of them). You have "A" the important ones and "B" the unsexy/quirky disposable ones (maybe some repeat characters). We will call them "B" filler characters.

2. For each character 'try' to create some kind of troubled past or give them some kind of unsuccessful interaction/relationship with the other characters to create conflict. The main character has to remain aloof and alone with streaks of darkness/troubled history. Maybe one or two of the characters are hiding a secret or have an unknown relationship (something from their past to be revealed over time or just out of the blue for a plot). The characters might also have troubled home lives. A few of the Characters do REALLY CARE for each other (wink wink) but its hidden and not acknowledged until its too late. Then their interaction becomes awkward after it is. One or two characters might want to prove other characters wrong or want to show themselves as being better. There might be a 'know it all' or some naysayer character. Maybe take some stuff from other famous characters. (Mysterious stranger with unknown past, Wolverines indestructibility. Batman's broodiness). Maybe they have a vice or personality traits (Bi-sexual James Bond like libido, Above average curiosity/knowledge, Hard sarcastic edge, Geek, Slacker/Goof). One character is newly introduced to this world so the audience can relate to their ineptitude and ignorance. Its through this main new character we are first introduced to this world. Having "B" filler characters from the "A" characters past that show up and cause emotional conflict is good too.

3. The main characters ban together, get dragged in or stumble upon a mystery or an important event. They investigate the strange events or places that leads them into #4. The more bizarre and WTF the better! They may be accompanied by a minor disposable/reoccurring "B" filler character. As they investigate they are seen as interfering outsiders. Then for some reason the are seen as the only people who can solve the situation. They might be investigating all by themselves with no one around. They might also discover items or gadgets of alien origin along the way. Or they might have them with them. Of course the item/gadget will always be what is needed at that precise moment.

4. Dire situation. The Villain of the week and their master plan. Or a situation caused by a characters incompetence. Maybe the latter leading into releasing the former upon the world. Maybe a character goes AWOL to investigate and confront the villain of the week on their own. Even when they were told not to move. This makes matters much worse. Maybe they get captured with threats of pain/death (Insert cliff-hanger here) only to be rescued later when #1 the more main character shows up or #2 they use their ingenuity/knowledge or #3 they use the aforementioned item/gadget to escape then regroup after some harrowing chase. There are events/items/locations that make solving the situation harder or seem near impossible. These can be body swapping, locating an item or person, accessing or escaping a location or maybe solving puzzles (traps or putting clues together). Having the characters separated is a popular choice. Have some violent acts to get rid of a unsexy disposable "B" filler characters.

5. Put them in dark rooms, with vibrant colored lights and flashing bits to talk about their situation or regroup. Revealing some hidden tidbits about someone's past or their love/hatred for each other. Here's where you add in a lot of #6. One character knows the whole situation and has a plan to be revealed later (can you say TRAP!) This is also where techno-babble happens explaining how we got to this point and how we could maybe get out of the situation. Also the introduction of the rapidly decreasing timeframe before doomsday suddenly appears. Some kind of emotional conflict towards the final solution works best here as well. Main characters might become #1 more divided or become #2 more resolute in a "build team bonding" sort of way.

6. Sprinkle in humor at either uncomfortable times or at character interaction points (like #5). It can be either sexual (gay or straight), point out the obvious kind of humor (duh!) or humor for the kids (fart,burp). But really this can go anywhere. Maybe some British charm/references too here and there. Make fun of the Welsh.

7. Then either a last minute save that's based on either love or a character changing their belief and making some kind of self sacrifice. Or one of the "B" filler characters may turn out to be the villain so they can return at a later date. Or have an surprise ending that you didn't know was coming to stop the villain (Trap from #5). Because of 'Time travel' elements there might also be an ending that you cannot avoid. Then one character will have a life altering event (until the credits roll that is). Cue the 'in your face' happy moment and start the music that brings tears to your eyes. You can relax your sphincter as its all over now. Or is it?… wait until the end of season. The main "A" characters can walk off into the sunset never helping clean up the mess they made. If you really want you can have someone other than the main character of the show save the day because the main character is somehow trapped. GO FORCED GIRL POWER!! Yawn. Maybe have a few tense action endings. The villains dead!! YEAH!! No he isn't!! GASP!! (*whack whack whack) Now he is. SIGH!! Wait...

8. Along the way you drop in hints about the past or upcoming events later in the season. When the main characters know something they can't tell the "B" filler characters that is good (hints of the future, knowledge of events the TV viewer knows about and nods to the past). Oooo we know what their talking about. It’s our secret… snicker snicker. Maybe a special word of the day (Peewee Herman would be proud)

9. Wrap it up in what ever the current style is (fashion, camera work, lighting style, quickly paced editing). Have the set designer create some crazy place with eye candy where the characters get together (see #5). Maybe some cool music that you can reuse adnauseum. Some retro music here or there. Oh yeah SEX!! SEX!! SEX!! Gay or Straight. Or implications of sex (kid safe)

10. Sit back and let people tell you how brilliant you are for creating something unique and refreshing,

There are 4 layouts to the timing of the episode:

#1 standard story layout. Beginning, middle, end.

#2 start the story in the middle. Maybe start it near the end of or after the end of the story. Then show how you got there. I call it the "OH X is dead! What happened? Oh X is not really dead suckers!!" storyline

#3 from the "B" fillers point of view

#4 just start the story, don't explain the events leading up to it. They are already in the middle of the investigation.

11-08-2006, 03:09 AM
Russell T Davies is extremely good at writing soap operas (see Queer As Folk for an example of that), but he's not so hot at writing decent Sci-fi. I had a lot of problems with the new Dr Who, especially with Season One (Slitheen? B******s). I was over the moon when Rose and her entire dopey, irritating, let's-keep-the-series-on-Earth clan were stranded in another dimension.
Torchwood got off to a very ropey start, IMO; the first episode was passable, but the second one was just a lamentably bad Species ripoff. And they were both written by Davies.
However, episode 3 was pretty good (and had the added bonus of Gareth Thomas, Blake from Blake's Seven in it) and episode 4 was brilliant. And they weren't written by him.
According to IMDB, the next 4 episodes aren't written by Davies either; IF they can keep the quality that they're climbing towards now going, this will be a series worth watching.

11-08-2006, 04:37 AM

Since several days ago I wanted to give my opinion on Torchwood. A friend of mine coming from London was kind to bring with him the first three episodes recorded from english TV.

I live in Spain, and here, the quantity/quality of SF that you can watch sometimes is null! 8/ Other times we got almost the same series than in england or us, but really bad dubbed! :(

I LOVE Torchwood! :) And I love the new Doctor Who! :) Maybe it is because I can not see as much sf as I would like! :)

It is true that the series is started a bit quickly not introducing the characters a bit more slowly.

And I think that Gwens boyfriend is cannon meat, he is going there to be converted, or eaten by an alien! :)

Anyhow I hope to still keep watching the series! :)

Best regards,

11-08-2006, 07:10 AM
For me this was one of the worst of the bunch and it had the chance to be the best! Just watching the trailer from last week gave me frissons "What?! A part-made cyberman?!" but then I hated Ianto weeping the whole time, and why on earth didn't the team bang a couple of shots in the visible gut, or face? This is "supposed" to be a Doctor-Who-for-grown-ups, but it seriously feels like a Doctor-Who-with-really-bad-effects-for-adolescents to me.


11-08-2006, 07:40 AM
o.k. I can't hold it in anymore....

Why did she have high heel cyber boots?

Why did she have a trim, female shaped bum plate?

Why wasn't she made up from the same size and shaped parts as the rest of the cybermen (even the females get the same size and shaped 'upgrades')

Why would the cyberman design ethos include modesty-protecting breast plates when human emotion is superflous to requirements?

Why did the professor get upgraded in a different order than her? (both upgrades were halted before completion yet his eye was being replaced but her face is whole)

Why was her cyberman voice box operational only now and then?

Why did Jack's cut lip take ages to heal when the bullet wound he took two episodes ago healed straightaway?

Why did Jack never come across that locked door and wonder why it was locked?

How does she control the upgrade machine to swap brains with the pizza girl?


I know some of these things can be explained with 'artistic license' but still, I just couldn't suspend belief enough to enjoy this episode (or the previous three).

I'm going to tune in every week because I'm on cable so my channel choice is registered for the ratings and I want more scifi to get comissioned but I doubt I'll watch it again.

11-08-2006, 07:50 AM

Why doesn't she use electricity to fight off the pteradactyl (a creature based on the same general biological principles as a human being thus vunerable to excess electrical current)?

The pteradactyl is seen having a go at her face but when we see her later, the pteradactly has only left tomoato sauce/ketchup on her abdomen and below?

11-08-2006, 10:39 AM
I love Doctor Who. But I'm not a fan of RTD. Here's something I've just written. Warning its long. but well worth it I think. Its for laughs anyways

10 steps to creating a Russell T Davies style character drama

Or 90% of Hollywood movies....

11-10-2006, 08:34 AM

Yeah, I see your point, but I wouldn't say RTD is particularly reliant on recycled ideas, at least not in a blatant way. To put it another way, if he kept recycling the same stuff over and over, you could boil each of his scripts down into a few simple points that crop up each time. You've kind of described a lot of generic stuff that a lot of writers do. Not getting at you, just an observation. Of your observation.

For example, lets give it a go with Horatio Caine: Supercop ... err, I mean, CSI: Miami.
1) See crime happen, ending left slightly ambiguous. It will be a murder, however. CSIs do not count anything else as a crime, apparently.
2) Horatio Caine shows up 0.04 seconds after the crime (is he committing them??), removes sunglasses, says a "witty" one-liner while standing over the corpse.
3) Roll credits immediately, just to give you time to appreciate how clever Horatio is.
4) Evidence points to a suspect. Horatio finds the suspect, accuses them of the crime. Suspect turns out to be innocent, or only peripherally involved. Fingers someone else.
5) Horatio accuses new suspect of the crime. Suspect is only partially responsible, or optionally innocent. Fingers someone else.

That stuff happens in most episodes. I mean, like, you can set your watch by it.

Here's the part that happens almost every episode without fail.

6) Horatio questions final suspect. Accuses them of crime. Suspect arrogantly denies crime.
7) Horatio presents some evidence that isn't really all that incriminating.
8) Suspect immediately confesses.

Also, we have the following optional scenes:
a) CSI team tries to enter house to search it.
Occupant:"Nope, you need a warrant."
CSI:"Well, we can get one and be back in an hour."
Occupant:"Oh, you'd better come in, then."
CSI:"Hah, great."
Then the CSI will find some evidence that incriminates the occupant, who is apparently too stupid to realise he can be hiding evidence during that hour. Then Horatio Caine solves the crime.

b) Horatio Caine removes his sunglasses, then puts them back on, then stares into the distance. Then he removes his sunglasses. Then he puts them back on. Then he solves the crime.

c) Horatio Caine makes a gigantic leap of logic. Then he solves the crime.

d) The CSI team of digital artists (who must number more than actual investigators) render some CG of the crime scene. Then Horatio solves the crime.

e) "Zoom in! A bit more! A bit more! Zoom in further! Okay, press the ENHANCE button. CRIME SOLVED."

f) Did I pull us off topic? Maybe.

Not impressed by Torchwood so far. Except the music, which is quite funky. Also, I learned today that Torchwood is an anagram of Doctor Who.

11-15-2006, 09:05 PM
Not wanting to keep this at the level of a "Oh, Yeah? Well our Execs are worse than your Execs!" I think there are somethings that need to be stated.

I'll take Russel T Davis over John Natan Turner and day of the bloody week. :-)

RTD is obviously an adult writer and to stick him into a show like Dr Who, you would think, must be a bad fit. No. I think RTD learned his craft from DR Who shows. When those shows were amazingly well written, and the FX were crap?

So, does he have a formula? Of course. Partly that is the narrative stucture of British TV. You have a series, in America we don't, we have seasons. Only in recent years the episodes tie together into a season. Bottle Shows as opposed to ongoing stories. STNG and STE are obvious points of comparison.
So putting in pieces of the plot of future episodes is not suck an evil thing.

JNT's problem was that he ultimately believed that he was in charge of Dr Who for the BBC. RTD believes, I think, that ultimately the power of Dr. Who comes from the viewers. The imaginations of the kids and the adults who watch the show.

Having said that, I think the Torchwood with the faeries sucked. They were treat, which could have been easily done. They didn't do it. I think it is partially due to the editing... ::shrug::

I'm waning again... ;-)


11-16-2006, 02:00 AM
Overall I really like the doctor who stuff, particularly the RTD episodes. He even managed to make me feel sorry for a Dalek!

(Though he is way too fond of over powerful baddies - a million daleks was a lot less effective than one).

But Torchwood? Sorry, really not impressed.

Captain Jack was a great minor character, but cannot carry the main lead. And an unkillable lead has no tension or risk.
It has spectacular logic problems - a supposedly secret organisation, then they have it written on the side of their cars?!
Most disappointing though is the way it is sliding into that laziest of SF formats, the monster of the week.

11-16-2006, 02:48 AM
Spoiler risk! highlight the following to read...

The last one was the best so far, but that's not really saying much. Spoilers follow: Why did they go after Gwen (apart from the fact that she's annoyingly chipper) or the old lady? I guess having an invincible enemy suits having an invincible hero and doesn't work for exactly the same reasons. :end spoilers.

Still not impressed.


11-16-2006, 02:57 AM
I saw the interview with the actor who plays capt. Jack, on the Jonathan Ross Late show. Was quite an entertaining chat ! :)

Haven't had the chance to catch the series, but from the excerpts you could clearly make out the fx budget was really tiny.

11-16-2006, 02:58 AM
I enjoyed this week's episode. Jack's turning into a very a good character IMO, and the more hard choices he has to make, the more of an insight we get into his nature. It's interesting to me to see how the relatively happy-go-lucky cavalier attitude from his Dr Who episodes has had to change into an absolute hardass to be able to cope with heading up Torchwood. I do agree, however, that such a supposed "flagship" BBC programme should have had a larger budget.