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T-Light
07-28-2006, 10:57 AM
No CD's through the post? When was this decided?

BeeVee - 07-26-2006, 07:16 PM (LightWave 3D User Community > LightWave v9 Discussions )

if you upgraded this year you will need to pay extra for it, but the upgrade was always sold as being an "electronic upgrade", actual physical media were not offered
I should say when Lightwave 8 was announced it was also advertised as an 'electronic upgrade'. At the time Chuck had a heck of a job explaining to an angry mob this in fact meant CD's through the post and NOT a download. Today, it would seem that the situation has reversed and 'electronic upgrade' now means something else. In fact it now means two completely different things.

If you upgraded to 9 in 2005 then 'Electronic upgrade' means
Download + CD + DVD in a jewel case via the post as normal
However,
If you upgraded to 9 in 2006 then 'Electronic upgrade' means
Download ONLY.


Newtek customers pre LW 9 ought to be forgiven for feeling there's a whole pavlovian dogs thing going on here, "No 'electronic upgrade' means this", "No, it clearly means this", "Oh but not for you, just for you you and you". Newtek's policy on this was quite clear until only a couple of weeks ago. If you'd ordered an upgrade from 8 to 9, you WOULD be recieving your disks and jewel case through the post.


Here's some posts by Kurtis on this matter, the latest from only a week ago Sunday.

Kurtis - 07-13-2006, 07:01 PM

If you pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 only, you can access the download now, and you will receive either CDs only or Manuals and CDs, depending on what you ordered. Those have not started shipping yet. It will be soon though.
Question from newtekker04, answered by Kurtis on 07-14-2006, 11:33 AM

newtekker4-
So, just to clarify (cause I just want to be sure), those who pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 (w/Vue and LWCAD) are still going to be shipped the discs and manuals?
At present, downloading LW and the content is not an option for me. I'm stuck with dial-up, and by the time I finish those downloads, we'll all be on the v10 beta.

Kurtis -
Correct.
Kurtis - 07-16-2006, 12:17 AM

If you pre-purchased the LightWave v9 upgrade only, you get both the download and the hard copy materials you ordered when they begin shipping.
Kurtis - 07-16-2006, 03:39 PM

If you paid for an upgrade to LightWave [8], qualifying for a free upgrade to LightWave v9, you got an upgrade to LightWave [8] with hard copy materials and you are getting a free upgrade to LightWave v9 via download.

If you paid for the LightWave v9 upgrade only, you are getting the upgrade to LightWave v9 via download and the hard copy materials you paid for when they begin shipping.

Those who paid for an upgrade to [8] got hard copy materials for [8] and a free upgrade as promised. Those that paid for an upgrade to v9 are getting a download and hard copy materials as promised. How do you feel you are not getting what you paid for?


Apologies for the multiple quotes, but it's a contentious issue and Kurtis went out of his way to explain the situation :thumbsup: I just wanted to make it absolutely clear in a single post that up until very recently indeed, 'electronic upgrade' meant a hardcopy of the LW CD's sent through the post.


Just to clarify
Kurtis - Two weeks ago

Those that paid for an upgrade to v9 are getting a download and hard copy materials as promised.
Beevee - Today

the upgrade was always sold as being an "electronic upgrade", actual physical media were not offered


I'm sure I'm not alone in wondering what on earth's going on here.

Earl
07-28-2006, 12:15 PM
I'm not going to pretend I know the answer to the question, since only NewTek can say for sure.

But maybe Kurtis was speaking of orders made on the NewTek.com website, and perhaps orders made through a reseller (NewTek Europe) are up to the reseller?

I hope you get your answer soon, because if I were in your shoes I'd be pretty upset too.

bryphi7
07-28-2006, 12:42 PM
That will really make me mad!!! That is called NT running out of money fast. They should be ashamed of themselves if they don't plan on sending every person that preordered a hard copy...

T-Light
07-28-2006, 12:45 PM
NO, don't go saying Newtek Europe are a reseller, and they have different policies to Newtek US, I'll think the worlds falling apart :D

I can only think Newtek's changed the policy for ecenomical reasons. Beevee's right when he states 'electronic upgrade' was what was on offfer, It's just that over the years and up until a couple of weeks ago 'Electronic Upgrade' has meant CD's in the post.

Obviously I'm a bit miffed as I'm losing out because I upgraded five and a half months ago intead of seven months ago.

I'd like to know why the sudden change in policy.

jwilli3
07-28-2006, 01:00 PM
Electronic upgrade in every instance I've ever seen it used has meant a download.

colkai
07-28-2006, 01:04 PM
Yup, I mean, gosh, electronic upgrade. If I download it, I'll have to burn my own CD, good golly, why, that's gonna cost me all of 5p - oh no, my world is at an end. ....Or not.

Medi8or
07-28-2006, 01:05 PM
As far as I remember from last year there were (at least) three upgrade options. From 8 to 9 with hardcopy manual, from 8 to 9 without hardcopy manual, and from 7 to 9 without hardcopy manual (but with version 8). The two latter were called "electronic upgrade to version 9".

I don't see how the meaning of "electronic upgrade" has had a recent change...

iconoclasty
07-28-2006, 01:11 PM
I upgraded to [9] directly form :newtek: and thought that at the end of the order process that discs would be shipped when they were released. I could be wrong but whatever I read left me with the assumption I'd be getting discs upon the release.

Not that I want to throw a big fit if I don't, but it would be nice to get a shiny new [9] case.:thumbsup:

Earl
07-28-2006, 02:06 PM
NO, don't go saying Newtek Europe are a reseller, and they have different policies to Newtek US, I'll think the worlds falling apart :D
Sorry! Didn't mean to say it like that. I just meant that maybe it was a distinction between the online store at NewTek.com and any other venue. Only NewTek can clear this up...

But I agree that the term "electronic upgrade" is a little misleading. It should be absolutely 100% clear. If it is a download only, then the purchase option needs to say Download Only. If it is a upgrade with discs sent via the mail, then it should says specifically Discs Only by Mail. And of course, a boxed version with manuals should also indicate that.

There's no reason this should be confusing at all... so hopefully NewTek will re-think their wording to avoid these types of posts (not that there's anything wrong with your post...it's completely understandable given the circumstances)...

T-Light
07-28-2006, 02:18 PM
Cheers Earl, It's not that I'm crying in a bucket or anything :D, I'd just presumed we'd be receiving a red dvd box sometime soon.

Clarity is the name of the day. I appreciate the posts above saying 'electronic upgrade' can't be considered anything but a download, it wasn't me reading CD's into 'electronic upgrade' but statements made by Newtek.

2003: LW8 was announced as an 'electronic upgrade', we all thought that meant download, Chuck put everyone straight and said it meant supplied on CD's.

2005: LW9 announced as 'electronic upgrade', some people think download, others remembering '8' think CD's.

2006: Many forum posts asking what 'electronic upgrade' means, all answered by Newtek that it means download AND CD's (see Kurtis quotes in my first post):

And now... Newtek states it's all a download and there's no CD's (unless, rather bizarrely, you'd ordered your 'electronic upgrade' before 2006, in which case again it means download AND CD's)

I dont' understand the question "Where's the confusion".


[Edit] Edited for reasons of clarity :)

nerdyguy227
07-29-2006, 08:10 AM
I think newtek clapsed in last time thinking "Alright the angry paying customer mob wants cds, lets not dissappoint them" but this time we expect the same thing.

"newtekker4-
So, just to clarify (cause I just want to be sure), those who pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 (w/Vue and LWCAD) are still going to be shipped the discs and manuals?
At present, downloading LW and the content is not an option for me. I'm stuck with dial-up, and by the time I finish those downloads, we'll all be on the v10 beta.

Kurtis -
Correct. "


I am in his boat and really just want a streight yes or no answer from newtek, if I did just like he did getting the $395 (no manuals, LWcad and Vue included) package from Newtek directly and bought it just at the end of 2005, do I get a cd or not(Yes/No)?

I would like if I could get an answer without them beating arround the bush, even if they did promise something they now forgot to plan for and cant give us, I would like to know NOW not in a month when they make us think they are still coming.

colkai
07-29-2006, 08:36 AM
Discs yes, printed manuals no, PDF manuals on disc, yes. Given the statements from Jay and from waht BeeVee has said.
However, this is ONLY if you pre-ordered last year as far as I understand.

dgon64
07-29-2006, 10:36 AM
I know I'm not the only one to get this message but decided to post anyway but I got a note a couple of weeks ago from Safe Harbor saying LW9 will be shipping Aug. 7th. I pre-ordered a while ago making sure I ordered the full package version so I would say if you ordered that version you should have gotten a notification already. Also, I 've always assumed that electronic upgrades are just that-no printed manuals, cd, etc. LWCAD, HDInstance, even my Scene Express upgrade in World Construction all came in this form with no hardcopy materials. This is the direction many software providers are heading to save costs which hopefully are passed on to the consumer. So if you want hardcopy make sure you order one though I must admit the upgrade options offered for LW9 did seem a bit confusing at first so it was reassuring to get the e-mail from Safe Harbor.

BeeVee
07-30-2006, 05:27 AM
If you ordered your LightWave v9 upgrade in 2005, you get CDs, if you ordered in 2006 you have to pay extra to receive them (well actually it's a CD and a DVD this time). If you ordered in 2005, there's a special price on getting the box and printed manuals, if you ordered in 2006, there's an order that contains the media, box and printed manuals. That's the way it is for NewTek Europe customers and I'm sorry I can't give prices but it seems that we're having website problems at the moment, so I can't check.

B

newtekker04
07-30-2006, 09:43 AM
Hmm, Newtek better straighten this pretzel out before we all storm Newtek HQ looking for answers. :D Judging from what I've been reading throughout the forums, I was under the impression the upgrading went like so:

Own [8] -> pre-purchase upgrade to [9] -> get Vue and LWCAD now and [9] media will ship when released.

New LW [8.x] seat -> get media and manuals, w/Vue and CAD -> if [9] physical media is desired, Companion Upgrade available for purchase

So, essentially, new Lightwavers have to pay for the media, whereas upgraders do not.

I may be way out to lunch on this, but that's the way I've interpreted it. I am also curious to know whether Newtek will ship straight to us, or to our dealer.:confused:

Rich
07-30-2006, 01:01 PM
From the posts from Newtek on this subject I believe they explained that if you purchased Lightwave 8 during the period when LW 9 was announced you are entitled to LW 9 for free which would be a download only. Those who already owned LW 8 that pre-ordered LW 9 get the CDs. You pay an extra $100 for the printed manuals.

ShawnStovall
07-30-2006, 01:02 PM
I'm confused, so does this mean that since I bought LightWave [8] with a free upgrade to nine in October that I get the CDs+the Manuals? Or does this not apply to upgrades that were bought with 8?

Rich
07-30-2006, 01:22 PM
Back in 2005 when they first started taking orders for LW 9 they had two options.

1. Those who owned LW 8 - Just the pre-order upgrade to LW 9
(LW9 upgrade CD's + Vue 5 infinite) Those who purchased this get LW 9 on CD

2. Those who did not own a copy of LW 8
(LW 8 + Vue 5 infinite + free upgrade to 9 when it's released - Download only) Those who purchased this got LW 8 on CD

Phil
07-30-2006, 02:02 PM
I'm not hugely troubled, I have to say.

I am hoping that the media is already dated by the time it ships. Roll on 9.01, 9.02....through to 9.99. Chuck in a working linux solution somewhere in there and I'll be a happy bunny :)

Same goes for documentation. NewTek promise big changes in 9.x so I'm hoping that the manuals date quickly. For once, this will be a good thing :D

newtekker04
07-30-2006, 06:27 PM
Back in 2005 when they first started taking orders for LW 9 they had two options.

1. Those who owned LW 8 - Just the pre-order upgrade to LW 9
(LW9 upgrade CD's + Vue 5 infinite) Those who purchased this get LW 9 on CD

2. Those who did not own a copy of LW 8
(LW 8 + Vue 5 infinite + free upgrade to 9 when it's released - Download only) Those who purchased this got LW 8 on CD

Yes, I don't believe there is any more to it; that's how I've interpreted it. BTW, have you seen the claymation version of Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer? Your avatar shares a striking resemblance to the yeti in the film.:D


I'm confused, so does this mean that since I bought LightWave [8] with a free upgrade to nine in October that I get the CDs+the Manuals? Or does this not apply to upgrades that were bought with 8?

Yeah, I don't believe your new LW 8 seat is eligible for the [9] media. What you got when you ordered your [8] is all the physical items you'll get, unless you fork over another $20 or $100 for the two Companion Upgrade options, unfortunately.

Rich
07-30-2006, 07:23 PM
BTW, have you seen the claymation version of Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer? Your avatar shares a striking resemblance to the yeti in the film.:D

Yeah, I loved watching that every year around Christmas time when I was a kid. So I decided I wanted to model my own Yeti. :D

T-Light
07-30-2006, 07:31 PM
nerdyguy227-

I think newtek clapsed in last time thinking "Alright the angry paying customer mob wants cds, lets not dissappoint them" but this time we expect the same thing.

Nah, last time it was actually the other way round, people wanted the download rather than having to wait for manuals etc to be printed. There was just as much confusion though. Anyone would be forgiven for thinking these quotes below are 2006 posts. These are actually 2+ years old and all relate to the 'electronic upgrade' release of LW 8. These quotes are only a small selection of the hundreds available for viewing at
http://www.newtek.com/forums/archive/index.php/

Without further ado here's the 2004 version of...
"Carry On Electronic Upgrade"

Chuck - 01-13-2004, 03:49 PM

I hate to even go there, but the fact of the matter is that "free electronic update" was used because we were not sure we'd be able to offer the update by download, and CDs are electronic media, hence, if we have to ship CDs that's an electronic upgrade. If you'll note on press releases other than the 8.0 items, if we are making something available by download, we just say it's available by download.
I AM the Ghost of Christmas past, you have no idea how long I looked for this qoute :devil: :D

Cresshead - 01-21-2004, 11:19 AM (on LW8 shipping dates)

if it ships in april 2004 or afterward then upgraders should get the manual n box for a discounted price of say $50 rather than the $100.
Don't anyone say Newtek doesn't listen. Pity you didn't state 'everyone' who preordered Cress :bowdown:

Exper - 03-08-2004, 05:45 PM

NT Europe is still to "The LightWave [8] free upgrade will be available as a download" on their "LightWave 3D [8] PRE-LAUNCH UPGRADE DFX+ SPECIAL!".
That one's returned like a very bad penny :(

Silkrooster - 03-17-2004, 01:08 AM

From what I read it sounds like they are going to deliver electronically. Which would be a very big problem for dial up users.
For some, that's still a problem over two years later

Mattclary - 03-25-2004, 06:53 PM

And it's electronic UPGRADE not download...
...Their term "electronic" means, not full-blown hard copy.
Well yes, it did, right up until last week in fact :(

blabberlicious - 04-02-2004, 05:36 AM

... Waiting more indeterminate weeks for a few CD to arrive when the app is ready NOW would be appalling.
Imagine how appalling it would be if you now have the download but NO expected CD's !!! :cursin:

Newtek email sent out on 04-15-2004

We are pleased to announce that next week NewTek US will begin shipping the electronic upgrade to our customers
YAyyyyy :D


Ah... the good old days.

[EDIT] - Post was so long didn't think anyone would have the spare time to read it

T-Light
07-30-2006, 07:40 PM
Hope everyone can now see my point from the above post, 'Electronic Upgrade' did NOT mean download, in fact it meant 'content in a jewel case with a pdf manual' right from Chuck's post on the 13th of January 2004 up until shortly after Kurtis's statement on the 16th of this month, 2006. (See the Kurtis quotes in my first post at the top of the thread)

What's really getting my goat is that this decision not to send out the jewel case pack was made in the last week or two. If that wasn't bad enough, to say that people who bought the upgrade in 2005 ARE elligible for a CD/DVD/Jewel case package is just pouring salt in the wound, they're already been offered the full box and manuals for half price. For people like myself who purchased the 'pre 9 upgrade' nearly six months ago, this is a very sore point indeed. If all this was stated before close of play in 2005, no one would have a problem and this post and others like it simply wouldn't exist.

$20 is not a great deal in the scheme of the things, a round of drinks costs more, it's not the money, it's the principle.

If I bought a car at an 'On The Road' price, I don't want to be stuck with license plates or road tax when I pick the car up.
If I buy a present for someone at Christmas that says 'Free Batteries', I don't want to see a redeemable voucher for free batteries when they open it on Christmas day.

The examples above could hardly be described as 'double dealing', but they do leave you with a very nasty taste in your mouth, you've been played, and you know it.


ps I should state that Beevee, Kurtis and Chuck are simply the guys stating company policy, they are not in any way, shape or form, the target of the above.
Sorry guys, please don't think ANY of this is aimed at you.

T-Light
07-30-2006, 08:00 PM
Earl -

But maybe Kurtis was speaking of orders made on the NewTek.com website, and perhaps orders made through a reseller (NewTek Europe) are up to the reseller?
Apologies, Earl, I thought you were way of base there, I'd never heard of such a thing (well, there was the outdated websites in 2004 but that's another matter)

BeeVee -

If you ordered your LightWave v9 upgrade in 2005, you get CDs, if you ordered in 2006 you have to pay extra to receive them...
...That's the way it is for NewTek Europe customers

This is getting worse. Really don't like the last line.
Ben, you didn't state explicitly if this was Newtek Europe policy or Global policy.

In the US the upgrade price is $399. In the UK, we actually paid around $600 for exactly the same deal. If wavers in the states are getting the jewel case and we're not, this really is disgracefull.

To add insult to injury, I actually ordered through Newtek Europe this time round, I wanted more money to go to Newtek Europe directly rather than a third party supplier, money well spent eh?
:(

BeeVee
07-30-2006, 09:24 PM
The entire and only meaning of "That's the way it is for NewTek Europe customers..." is that I can speak for NewTek Europe on this matter and I don't have jurisdiction to speak on NewTek's behalf. Once the website is back up on Monday, you will be able to see all the permutations of the offer on the site - who gets what, and how much they have to pay for it. I also don't know the exact timescale of the decision to charge for the media, but I can assure you that it certainly wasn't within the last two weeks.

B

T-Light
07-31-2006, 06:56 AM
Beevee-

I can speak for NewTek Europe on this matter and I don't have jurisdiction to speak on NewTek's behalf
Fair enough
Beevee-

I also don't know the exact timescale of the decision to charge for the media, but I can assure you that it certainly wasn't within the last two weeks
Kurtis (Newtek 3D Marketing) 16th of July - 2006

Those that paid for an upgrade to v9 are getting a download and hard copy materials as promised.
I understand a decision to charge for media on certain upgrade offers was made before this date, Kurtis had mentioned that other upgrade offers would have to pay for the CD/DVD box set.

However, the deal that I'm referring to is this
Kurtis - 13th of July 2006

If you pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 only, you can access the download now, and you will receive either CDs only or Manuals and CDs, depending on what you ordered. Those have not started shipping yet. It will be soon though.
This deal most certainly did include the CD/DVD combo and it's this deal that that I'm referring to.

The reason given for not sending out the pack for any other upgrade offer was that the customers had already been sent out hard copy materials for their purchase, ie Full 8 box and manuals, 8 Jewel case, CD's and pdf manuals, both of these of course recieving Vue 5 in a CD case etc and getting access to LW 9 by download.

Brian Arndt
07-31-2006, 08:28 AM
If you purchased:
LightWave 8.5 upgrade (with free download of LightWave v9) you only get the download version of LightWave v9 and the CDs for LightWave 8.5. This was a pre-9 special. It was stated on the shop.
If you want the cds you can purchase the PDF Version (http://shop.newtek.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=25) or the Printed Version (http://shop.newtek.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=28).

If you purchased a LightWave v9 upgrade (which are the only things on the shop right now (http://shop.newtek.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=9)), then you will get the cds in the mail when they are ready, but for now can download the upgrade through the registration system online.

Hope this clears things up.

T-Light
07-31-2006, 09:16 AM
Brian Arndt -

Hope this clears things up.
Unfortunately not, sorry. There seems to have been another option.
It was called the Pre-Nine Upgrade (no mention of 8.5). Here's my receipt if it'll help any.

Order: N°BC-XXXXXXXXX, 2006-02-10 14:46:56
Amount: 490.36 € Inc. VAT (VAT N*: )

Details: 1 item(s):

1 - LightWave 3D® version 9 UPGRADE PRE-ORDER* + e-on software® Vue 5™ Infinite (LWD090XXXXXXX) x1

Shipping: Standard
This is the same deal as Kurtis is referring to here...
Kurtis - 07-13-2006, 07:01 PM

If you pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 only, you can access the download now, and you will receive either CDs only or Manuals and CDs, depending on what you ordered. Those have not started shipping yet. It will be soon though.
People again asked for clarification of the above deal and here's a perfect example.
newtekker4 - 07-14-2006

So, just to clarify (cause I just want to be sure), those who pre-purchased the upgrade to v9 (w/Vue and LWCAD) are still going to be shipped the discs and manuals?
Kurtis on 07-14-2006, 11:33 AM

Correct.
Sorry Brian, I think the upgrade to 8.5 may have been for people who were upgrading from say LW 6 or 7 (although I could be wrong).

Thanks for replying.

[EDIT] - Unless of course you're saying the upgrade deal I bought is identical to the current deal on the Newtek site (with the exception of Vue). If it's any help, that is actually what I believed was on offer at the time. The only thing that makes me think this is not the same deal, is Newtek Europe aren't sending the jewel case CD/DVD pack.

T-Light
07-31-2006, 09:57 AM
This is now getting really complicated, I just visited OneVideo to see if they had any of the old deals and everythings been updated, Newtek Europe and Newtek US all show the new deals, none of the old.

I'll have to go from memory here but this is basically what I believe was on offer.

(Bit shaky here, these deals didn't concern me)
Full purchases:
Option 1)Buy V8 Fully boxed with paper manuals + Vue 5 cd's + electronic upgrade to 9
Option 2)Buy V8 in jewel case with pdf manuals +Vue 5 cd's + electronic upgrade to 9

Upgrading from earlier than 8:
option 3) Full Boxed version of 8 with paper manuals + Vue 5 cd's + electronic upgrade to 9
option 4) V8 in jewel case with pdf manuals +Vue 5 cd's + electronic upgrade to 9

Upgrade to 9 from 8:
option 5) Fully Boxed version of 9 with paper manuals + Vue 5 cd's
option 6) Upgrade to 9 (without Full box and manuals) + Vue 5 cd's

ALL of the deals above with included either full box and paper manuals for a given version of LW, or Jewel box with pdf manuals for a given version.

This is what Kutis is reffering to when he says
Kurtis - 07-16-2006, 03:39 PM

If you paid for an upgrade to LightWave [8], qualifying for a free upgrade to LightWave v9, you got an upgrade to LightWave [8] with hard copy materials and you are getting a free upgrade to LightWave v9 via download.

If you paid for the LightWave v9 upgrade only, you are getting the upgrade to LightWave v9 via download and the hard copy materials you paid for when they begin shipping.

Those who paid for an upgrade to [8] got hard copy materials for [8] and a free upgrade as promised. Those that paid for an upgrade to v9 are getting a download and hard copy materials as promised. How do you feel you are not getting what you paid for?

Everyone who purchased option 6 (direct upgrade to V9) are the only ones who are now NOT recieving any Newtek product through the post.

Up until a couple of weeks ago, everyone who ordered option 6, were getting LW9 in a jewel case.

Please say I haven't just complicated things any further .

mrunion
07-31-2006, 11:25 AM
It was my understanding that 3 & 4 were the options that DID NOT get CDs. I remember it going something like this:

Upgrades came with CDs, but ONLY FOR ONE VERSION. For example, if you HAD 7, bought 8-with-free-9 you got CDs FOR 8, but NOT for 9. If you had 8 and bought 9, you got CDs FOR 9. See?

Basically I recall that NewTek would only send you the NEXT version on CD. If you had 7 or less you got your CDs when they sent you 8, and you have to download 9. If you already had 8 you got CDs for 9 (or will soon). No option existed to get BOTH CDs for 8 AND 9 in ONE product. You had to order the convenience package (or whatever it was called) to get TWO sets.

Make sense?

T-Light
07-31-2006, 11:40 AM
mrunion -

Make sense?
Yup, same hymn sheet, same hymn book :) - Newtek Europe however, seem to be on a different sheet, Only sending v9 CD's if you ordered last year??? :(

mrunion
07-31-2006, 01:02 PM
Ah. OK, back to the grind for me...

Medi8or
07-31-2006, 01:20 PM
I upgraded from 7, so I wasn't prepared for a cd in the mail. But now, does this mean I can get a free cd if I request one? (dare I get my hopes up? :) )

Bytehawk
07-31-2006, 01:57 PM
I just want the box, the rest I don't need. Is there an option just to get the box? I can even assemble the box myself so the postage can be kept to a minimum.

:)

Verlon
07-31-2006, 02:26 PM
and what if you ordered in 2005 from a reseller? I realize this is not entirely Newtek's province.

I won't die for the lack of CDs, but would feel cheated at being charged shipping for something that did not actually ship.

Medi8or
07-31-2006, 02:37 PM
and what if you ordered in 2005 from a reseller?Ah, yes. That.
BeeVee? Anyone?

SP00
07-31-2006, 02:51 PM
Alright, it all makes sense now. Get a box set for 8, you don't get a box set for 9. That is basically it, unless you elect for download only to both.

Chuck
07-31-2006, 02:54 PM
Brian Arndt -

Unfortunately not, sorry. There seems to have been another option.
It was called the Pre-Nine Upgrade (no mention of 8.5). Here's my receipt if it'll help any.

This is the same deal as Kurtis is referring to here...
Kurtis - 07-13-2006, 07:01 PM

People again asked for clarification of the above deal and here's a perfect example.
newtekker4 - 07-14-2006

Kurtis on 07-14-2006, 11:33 AM

Sorry Brian, I think the upgrade to 8.5 may have been for people who were upgrading from say LW 6 or 7 (although I could be wrong).

Thanks for replying.

[EDIT] - Unless of course you're saying the upgrade deal I bought is identical to the current deal on the Newtek site (with the exception of Vue). If it's any help, that is actually what I believed was on offer at the time. The only thing that makes me think this is not the same deal, is Newtek Europe aren't sending the jewel case CD/DVD pack.


For US Office customers, Brian stated the matter correctly, Rich has stated the matter correctly, and you also made observations and provided quotes from Kurtis that are in fact in agreement with what both Brian and Rich stated, but you don't seem to realize it.

- Yes, absolutely, of course, owners of LightWave 7.5 and earlier versions bought upgrades to LightWave [8] to get the Vue 5 / LWCAD deal, and such purchases included the free upgrade to v9, via download.

- People who did not own LightWave at all bought full licenses of [8] with Vue 5 and LWCAD, and will receive v9 free via download.

- People who already owned [8] bought v9 upgrades, and yes, I do believe we labeled these on the web site as "v9 pre-upgrades", received Vue 5 and LWCAD at time of purchase, and when the media and manuals are ready will receive the appropriate physical package - media, with or without paper manuals depending on whether they ordered option 5 or option 6, respectively.

- From the invoice, you've purchased through NewTek Europe, and I'm not sure if they offered two options as the US did.

- Again, this applies to customers in North and South America. International Distributors may have differing policies on the delivery of the product. I'll see if we can get further clarification on this with respect to NTE.

- Having been burned by the confusion we created with our last use of the term "electronic upgrade", when pretty much the whole userbase expected a download, we decided this time around to mean what the apparent public consensus was when using the term. Quite some time back we removed "Electronic Pack" from our name for the version with PDF manual, and simply listed the two options as "with Printed Manual" and "with PDF Manual." Looks like it is still just better to say "Download" and skip the "electronic" stuff altogether.

- I'm thinking that much of the seeming complication of this discussion is arising from an inability to tell when folks are saying the same thing in different words. No idea how to solve that, but I do wish I had a nickel for every time I've seen such a situation! ;)

Safe Harbor
07-31-2006, 02:57 PM
All Safe Harbor customers who purchased LW8 (either upgrades or full versions) after August 1 (I think... memory is fuzzy right now) of last year will be getting the CD package shipped to them (no printed manual). This does not include crossgrades, educational versions, etc. Basically, it was all the Vue specials... if you got a Vue special from us, you will be getting 9 on CD from us shortly.

All people who ordered (or preordered I should say) version 9 (either full or upgrade from 8.x) will be getting that shipped shortly.

All of our customers who will be getting CDs shipped to them have gotten several emails from us in recent weeks regarding 9.

Please bear in mind - our method of handling this may be different from other resellers, so if you are wondering what you're eligible for, please contact the company you ordered LW8 from.

Blaine91555
07-31-2006, 03:23 PM
I just did the unthinkable. I called Newtek's customer service to ask. I purchased the full version of 8 with Vue Infinite in 95 when it was first offered and paid the extra for the printed manual. I will get the cd's (dvd[s]) when the "media arrives" as well as a copy of the printed manual shipped to me. If you prepurchased the upgrade you will get the download only. Now I don't feel so bad about having bought a week or so before a price drop:D

Newtek was very helpful on the phone:thumbsup:

T-Light
07-31-2006, 03:37 PM
Thanks Chuck & Safe Harbor.

OK, So Brian, Chuck, Kurtis and the guys at Safe Harbor and I are all in agreement that the LW9 upgrade offer comes with the CD/DVD jewel case (Based on Newtek and Safe Harbor customers in the USA).

All this started with this quote over on Lightwave v9 Discussions
BeeVee - 07-26-2006

As to whether or not you need to buy a DVD, that's a different matter, but if you upgraded before the end of last year, you merely need to request that the set is sent out to you, for which there is no charge. Yes, if you upgraded this year you will need to pay extra for it, but the upgrade was always sold as being an "electronic upgrade", actual physical media were not offered.
Which suggests that Newtek Europe are running something completely different to every one else. Can anyone from Newtek EU shed any light on this. BeeVee may simply have been stating that other upgraders need to purchase the CD/DVD bundle separately, but straight LW8-LW9 upgraders (having only recieved the two Vue disks and nothing else) will infact be sent the jewel case pack.

mkiii
07-31-2006, 06:22 PM
I'll second that.

Now that little "confusion" seems to be cleared up, & NTE can stop trying to make me pay another 20 euros + VAT.

When will my CD/DVD be arriving please?

(edit) WHohoo - my 1000 post. Now that deserves a printed manual.

T-Light
07-31-2006, 07:53 PM
MKIII

WHohoo - my 1000 post. Now that deserves a printed manual.
Bin there, done that tried that. :)

zapper1998
07-31-2006, 08:13 PM
So let me get this right.

If you ordered the Upgrade before Jan 1 2006.

You get the Upgrade on CD correct ??

YES or NO.

I ordered Last year...

So I get a CD in the mail Correct....

Michael

newtekker04
07-31-2006, 08:14 PM
Sheesh, finally got that mess cleared up.:)

But now I'm confused about something else. If I own modo and want to sidegrade to Videoscape 3D, will my order be eligible for the LW 10 beta, and will I get the electronic upgrade?:D

T-Light
07-31-2006, 08:20 PM
Seriously though

This entire thread relates to a direct upgrade from customers who own LW8 who have upgraded to LW9 within the European customer base.

Here's my receipt so Newtek Europe guys can deliberate...


Order: N°BC-XXXXXXXXX, 2006-02-10 14:46:56
Amount: 490.36 € Inc. VAT (VAT N*: )

Details: 1 item(s):

1 - LightWave 3D® version 9 UPGRADE PRE-ORDER* + e-on software® Vue 5™ Infinite (LWD090XXXXXXX) x1

Shipping: Standard

This offer will mean you have recieved the two Vue disks in a CD case, and nothing else. I'm not referring to any other upgrade offer where manuals, pdf or otherwise have been sent.

I appreciate promises inferred or implied, but this is the direct 9 upgrade from 8 I'm talking about, made to those who already OWN 8, nothing else.

MKIII and I would like an answer, do all those who upgraded with this deal receive disks from Newtek Europe, or not?

T-Light
07-31-2006, 08:45 PM
newtekker04

But now I'm confused about something else. If I own modo and want to sidegrade to Videoscape 3Dy order be eligible for the LW 10 beta, and will I get the electronic upgrade?
NO, but you do get the "shot at dawn" package available to 'select customers only', I think that's unwritten but still applies.

newtekker04
07-31-2006, 09:24 PM
How do I determine whether I'm a 'select customer'?;D

In regards to the original issue, though, I guess you'll have to wait for Chuck to verify the deal for European customers. I would be very surprised if Newtek Europe customers received a different order for the same offer North American customers are receiving. That would be a slap to the face, wouldn't you agree?:thumbsdow

SP00
07-31-2006, 10:47 PM
We should probably get an official statement on the site to clear confusion with all the different types of upgrade options including US/Europe, 2005/2006, and Direct Order/Order from 3rd party. Special attention to defininng the words softcopy download and hardcopy mail.

BeeVee
08-02-2006, 10:34 PM
If you ordered your LightWave v9 upgrade from NewTek Europe or one of its dealers by the end of 2005, and you request it (send an email to [email protected]), you will receive the CD/DVD case. If you ordered in 2006, you need to order a convenience pack, as detailed on the NewTek Europe LightWave v9 page (http://www.newtek-europe.com/uk/products/lightwave/index_lw9.html).

B